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Old July 12, 2014, 06:14 PM   #26
Arkansas Paul
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This is a good example of practicing law without a license.
Rusty, just curious as to who you are referring to there. Surely not Frank?

Quote:
As stated, the best bet is to confirm this information with a lawyer or law firm/legal aid group.
That's precisely what Frank is.

<snip - link deleted - >
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Old July 12, 2014, 10:48 PM   #27
RustyShackelford
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JDs.....

I'm speaking of the forum members who(like me) are sans a JD & are not "officers of the court".

I do know a guy who worked as a CT state corrections officer, probation agent & bail enforcement officer(bounty hunter) in the urban environs of the Nutmeg state, but Id need to reach out to him for details, re; homes/property/firearms.

Rusty
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Old July 13, 2014, 12:04 AM   #28
Arkansas Paul
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I gotcha.
I was thinking that most folks that have been around here for a while knew that Frank was indeed an attorney.

When discussing legal matters, his posts are definitely the ones I pay the most attention to.
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Old July 14, 2014, 09:00 AM   #29
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When my felon step-son was released on parole and moved in with us, I was told by his parole officer that my guns had to go. Locked in a safe was not good enough, had to be out of the house. Sucked, but he didn't stay long and I retrieved my firearms from a friend's house.
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Old July 15, 2014, 05:47 PM   #30
HankR
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I am not a lawyer, but I think that you may be missing a distinction between being on parole/probation and being a convicted felon who has served his/her time. If you are on parole/probation, the general understanding is that they could make you sleep at the jail, but are letting you live somewhere else so long as certain conditions are met. These conditions (even for those on probation for misdemeanors) often include "no firearms". I had a roommate facing charges for DWI, his lawyers told him if he pled to the misdemeanor DWI, he would likely get X months of probation and could not live in a house with my guns.

In this case, it was his house, and I was just renting a room, so I would have left if he had been convicted. If it were my house, and he had been convicted, he would have had to live elsewhere or my guns would have had to leave. The state can definitely control this, as he can opt to live in jail if he doesn't have a suitable place to live.

I believe that this is different from the case of an actual convicted felon who has completed all sentencing requirements. That person cannot posses firearms, where "possess" has the normal definition. Once the felon has served his time, the state has no control over what roommates and spouses can possess. The felon may have to prove that he didn't "possess" the contraband. For example, wife's shotgun locked in her safe, felon does not have access. Sitting out on her side of the bed would probably be a harder case to make, of course.
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Old July 16, 2014, 06:21 PM   #31
akodo
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would it be possible for the firearms details to be included in writing in the plea deal? That should take care of any concerns
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Old July 16, 2014, 06:36 PM   #32
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I would get a letter from the State AG and his PO before I would let him stay with me.
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Old August 8, 2014, 09:38 PM   #33
opr1945
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Just because someone is a lawyer, it does not follow that their opinion about the law is always correct. I would want to be sure the lawyer I was getting advice from had some knowledge and experience in the area. And even then they could be in error. In every case before the supreme court there are lawyers on the losing side.

Having dealt with many PO's over the years on behalf of clients, I can tell you their opinions about restrictions very considerably. And some of them follow their own views not the statutes.

From my practice expungement of convictions and restrictions is a lot more complicated and futile that the post above makes it seem. at least in the state I am in.
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Old August 8, 2014, 09:54 PM   #34
Frank Ettin
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Originally Posted by opr1945
Just because someone is a lawyer, it does not follow that their opinion about the law is always correct....
True enough. Some questions are complicated. Sometimes the law is unsettled or in a state of flux. Sometimes there's no clear legal authority on point.

Note also that while I'm a lawyer, I'm not your lawyer. I don't provide legal advice. I offer commentary on legal matters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by opr1945
...In every case before the supreme court there are lawyers on the losing side....
And that is a non sequitur. In each case we must make do with the client we have, the law we have, and the facts we have. We can't manufacture any of those elements to suit our needs. So while we provide the very best representation we professionally can, given the client, the law and the facts we have, sometimes are clients are going to lose because they are wrong.
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Old August 13, 2014, 05:34 PM   #35
Jim K
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There seems to be a common belief that a defendant who plea bargains for a suspended sentence or probation, who accepts probation before judgement, pleads no contest, or takes an Alford plea has not "really" been convicted and has not lost the right to own or access firearms. Any comments from the lawyers?

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Old August 13, 2014, 06:05 PM   #36
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Out of curiosity to those who say a locked safe isn't good enough;

If a parolee or felon moves into an apartment building, does everyone in that building suddenly have to get rid of their firearms?
Realistically what is the difference between The guns being in a safe or locked room and them being in someone else's apartment in the same building. They would all be equally accessible to the felon if he really wanted them.
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Old August 13, 2014, 06:22 PM   #37
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Safes, gun locks, etc....

To think some slick ex-con or felon won't or can't get their mitts on any guns/ammunition?
If you've ever been around any felons/parolees/addicts/etc you'll know they have certain behavioral traits & personality cues.
Some will act like the sweetest, kindest, most compassionate person in the whole wide world then rob you blind or scam you in a second.

To keep a gun safe or lockable container away from a felon is like keeping a batch of chocolate chip cookies away from the Cookie Monster.
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Old August 13, 2014, 06:42 PM   #38
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About 13 years ago, my Dad hired a guy very nearly straight out of prison. He had heard Dad was hiring and walked from town, very nearly five miles, to apply. Dad decided - in his words -if the guy was willing to work that hard to get a job he might work just as hard to keep it.

The guy's parole officer showed up maybe once a month and even though firearms were pretty well out in the open only asked if Carl had made any attempt to obtain one. We provide housing for our full time employees, a duplex in his case. To my knowledge he didn't have any firearms in his quarters although the guy in the other side did. The parole officer had no complaints on the fact.

Dad made it a point to discuss with the parole officer just what the employee was allowed and not allowed to do. While I can't say for sure I'm reasonably certain Dad discussed any possible liability he might inherit with his attorney as well.

Item last: The guy still works for us and quite frankly is trusted more than some of our "law abiding" employees. He has earned that trust over more than a decade of honest dealing and good service to the corporation.
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Old August 13, 2014, 07:33 PM   #39
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To think some slick ex-con or felon won't or can't get their mitts on any guns/ammunition?

If you've ever been around any felons/parolees/addicts/etc you'll know they have certain behavioral traits & personality cues.
Not all felons, or felonies, are the same. There are violent/out-of-control felons, yes. There are also Martha Stewart, the guy who wrote a bad check 40 years ago when he was 18 and stupid, and the guy who ran afoul of some arcane regulation he didn't know existed and pled to it because he couldn't afford a robust defense.
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Old August 13, 2014, 08:44 PM   #40
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I, for 1, feel felons should not have access or own guns.
See:

Quote:
Not all felons, or felonies, are the same. There are violent/out-of-control felons, yes. There are also Martha Stewart, the guy who wrote a bad check 40 years ago when he was 18 and stupid, and the guy who ran afoul of some arcane regulation he didn't know existed and pled to it because he couldn't afford a robust defense.
I am of the opinion that if a felon is too dangerous to be trusted with a weapon, they're too dangerous to be loose in a society where they can easily procure or manufacture one.

I do, however, understand that that is an idealistic position, and one that is untenable in the real world. However, I see no reason that non-violent felons shouldn't have their rights restored once their debt is paid. The guy who embezzled $40k from his employer may not be someone you want in charge of your trust, but there is absolutely no reason to believe he presents a physical danger to anyone based on his crime.
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