That's not a shotgun - THIS is a shotgun!

Preacherman · October 3, 2003, 08:43 AM

From a British commentator (http://www.sedgwickpark.co.uk/simons...nmcclean21.htm - thanks to Pax for the link!):

Punt Gun

At long last I found the photographs of my punt gun so as promised here they are. As you can see, its a bit of a beast.

It is just over 10 foot long and weighs more than 3cwt as you see it. Heaven only knows how big the punt must have been to support it.

For those of you not in the know, punt guns were used extensively by gamekeepers and wildfowlers from the early 19th century onwards. Their purpose was brutally simple - to kill as many geese and ducks (or other species of birds) as possible at once. A typically Victorian efficiency drive, one might say.

Rapid re-loading of shotgun cartridges was not really available until the early part of the 20th century so the punt gun was developed as a "broad brush" solution to the problems of bird infestation.

These guns were far too heavy to be carried by hand and were instead mounted on a "punt" or canoe. The punt was an extremely large, shallow drafted vessel that could only be safely used in inland rivers and waters

As you can see from the black & white photograph, there isn't much freeboard to protect you from a watery grave should you encounter waves.

My punt gun is a bit of a rarity apparently. I bought it as a "comfort" purchase at a Sothebys auction a few years ago- I desperately needed to console myself after I was outbid on a double-barrel 4 bore hammer gun.

The gun came with a board on which were mounted four 9 " cartridges, a wad cutter and a powder measure. There is also an inscription on the board, which reads as follows: -

This massive octagonal barrelled punt gun was made in 1852 by the famous FrenchGunsmith Jean Chale for Sir John Reeve de la Pole Bt. of Shute Devon.It was found supporting the roof of a cowshed by its present owner Mr. Tom Smith of Killeen Co. Dublin who has used it over several years for wildfowling on the River Laune estuary.

The gun looks to be in sound condition, although the woodwork needs a damn good clean and all the metalwork needs to be re-browned - a huge job! There is a rather nice engraving on top of the barrel - the name J Reeve de la Pole Bt. is visible. Along either side of the breech there were some silver family crests mounted on the metalwork. These are in very bad order and are unlikely to survive any restoration, although they may be added later on if the mood takes me and finances allow!

The barrel begins as an octagonal section but is taken down to a smooth cylinder. Most punt guns are trunnion mounted - this means that they have small knobs near the breech to secure them, just like cannons used to have.

My punt gun is mounted on a spring-loaded block with a hole through it on. Presumably on would place a large pin through this hole and fasten it securely - very securely!

When the project is finished I will have a test firing, before the gun gets put on the wall. Watch this space for more details.

Interestingly, advances in metallurgy have meant that punt guns are relatively much lighter and smaller than they used to be so behemoths like my weapon are very unlikely to ever be seen in use again - except perhaps on the front of the new Challenger tank!

This photo illustrates a modern piece - it is a mere strip of a gun, being only 7 foot long and weighing a mere 88 lb, despite packing the same firepower as my piece.

Devonai · October 3, 2003, 08:51 AM

After having gone punting at Stratford-upon-Avon, I can appreciate the use of this weapon!

(damn geese)

KMKeller · October 3, 2003, 10:29 AM

I believe there's one on display in the NC Museum of Natural History. Or at least a flintlock of enormous proportion. If any NC folks have been there, it's on display right next to that freakishly huge sunfish...

sm · October 3, 2003, 01:02 PM

Preacherman ole chap, has one not noticed my sig line all this time on TFL/THR ?

Seriously , I'm an hour as the duck flies form the Rice and Duck Capitol of the world. Market hunters used these in various configurations, numerous photos abound to show effectiveness. Yes a few are displayed , some restored and kept for family history. I did so many years ago witness the awesome live fire of one. Words do not describe.

LOL ( damn geese, damn ducks) Yep! So thick couldn't see a field, for the geese, flooded timber /resevoir with so many ducks one never knew water was beneath...

Quartus · October 3, 2003, 01:28 PM

Hmmm.... So that's where the idea of "knock down" power came from!

mtnbkr · October 3, 2003, 02:09 PM

Quote:

I believe there's one on display in the NC Museum of Natural History. Or at least a flintlock of enormous proportion. If any NC folks have been there, it's on display right next to that freakishly huge sunfish...

Are you talking about the one in Manteo? If so, I've seen it.

Chris

Hutch · October 3, 2003, 03:50 PM

There's a bit of a story about a punt gun woven thru Michener's Chesapeake. Muzzle-loader, IIRC. The novel describes sculling up to rafts of ducks, asleep on the water, and taking over a hundred with a single shot. Two retrievers (Chesapeake's, of course) are kept busy for an hour hauling the catch back in. Fascinating to see pictures of what he described....

**Dave McCracken** · October 3, 2003, 09:19 PM

Chesapeake punt guns, Preacher, run along those lines. Many were muzzleloaders, and served long and well for the market hunting here.

Seen similar at the Bay Museum in Havre de Grace, and some still in the families they served long ago.

Kinda makes that 10 gauge double of yours seem like a 410, eh?....

gun-fucious · October 3, 2003, 09:36 PM

nice site:
http://www.puntgunner.co.uk/

jsalcedo · October 4, 2003, 04:19 AM

I wonder if was ever used to take out the competing punt hunters?

Being on the wrong end of that boat would certainly ruin ones day.

Moparmike · October 4, 2003, 04:47 AM

I wonder how a PT boat would look with 4 of those mounted on the bow?

HSMITH · October 4, 2003, 12:36 PM

'73 ol buddy ol pal do you need a room-mate or a long lost son or a reloading fiend to shoot with?

Quote:

So thick couldn't see a field, for the geese, flooded timber /resevoir with so many ducks one never knew water was beneath...

That sounds like HEAVEN to me. Damn ducks and geese are in my blood and I can't get them out.

AJ Dual · October 6, 2003, 06:14 PM

Quote:

I wonder how a PT boat would look with 4 of those mounted on the bow?

Like a waterborne ONTOS, LOL!

jacketch · October 8, 2003, 08:06 PM

The Mariners Museum in Newport News VA also has punts and punt guns.

Kestrel · December 15, 2003, 02:16 AM

So, PM, did you ever fire your canon? Any pictures?

So, there are currently produced punt guns? What are they used for?

Steve

LynnMassGuy · December 15, 2003, 05:54 PM

Neat stuff.

Ky Larry · December 20, 2003, 02:22 PM

The punt gun looks like the perfect answer to the starling problem we have here in central Ky. Thousands of these nasty little creatures will roost in a tree. If this tree happens to be in your yard, you can imagine the mess. Of course our city council is too busy worrying about people smoking in bars and bowling alley to worry about real problems that affect real people.

October 3, 2003, 08:43 AM	#1
Preacherman Moderator Emeritus Join Date: December 20, 2002 Location: Louisiana, USA Posts: 13,323	That's not a shotgun - THIS is a shotgun! From a British commentator (http://www.sedgwickpark.co.uk/simons...nmcclean21.htm - thanks to Pax for the link!): Punt Gun At long last I found the photographs of my punt gun so as promised here they are. As you can see, its a bit of a beast. It is just over 10 foot long and weighs more than 3cwt as you see it. Heaven only knows how big the punt must have been to support it. For those of you not in the know, punt guns were used extensively by gamekeepers and wildfowlers from the early 19th century onwards. Their purpose was brutally simple - to kill as many geese and ducks (or other species of birds) as possible at once. A typically Victorian efficiency drive, one might say. Rapid re-loading of shotgun cartridges was not really available until the early part of the 20th century so the punt gun was developed as a "broad brush" solution to the problems of bird infestation. These guns were far too heavy to be carried by hand and were instead mounted on a "punt" or canoe. The punt was an extremely large, shallow drafted vessel that could only be safely used in inland rivers and waters As you can see from the black & white photograph, there isn't much freeboard to protect you from a watery grave should you encounter waves. My punt gun is a bit of a rarity apparently. I bought it as a "comfort" purchase at a Sothebys auction a few years ago- I desperately needed to console myself after I was outbid on a double-barrel 4 bore hammer gun. The gun came with a board on which were mounted four 9 " cartridges, a wad cutter and a powder measure. There is also an inscription on the board, which reads as follows: - This massive octagonal barrelled punt gun was made in 1852 by the famous FrenchGunsmith Jean Chale for Sir John Reeve de la Pole Bt. of Shute Devon.It was found supporting the roof of a cowshed by its present owner Mr. Tom Smith of Killeen Co. Dublin who has used it over several years for wildfowling on the River Laune estuary. The gun looks to be in sound condition, although the woodwork needs a damn good clean and all the metalwork needs to be re-browned - a huge job! There is a rather nice engraving on top of the barrel - the name J Reeve de la Pole Bt. is visible. Along either side of the breech there were some silver family crests mounted on the metalwork. These are in very bad order and are unlikely to survive any restoration, although they may be added later on if the mood takes me and finances allow! The barrel begins as an octagonal section but is taken down to a smooth cylinder. Most punt guns are trunnion mounted - this means that they have small knobs near the breech to secure them, just like cannons used to have. My punt gun is mounted on a spring-loaded block with a hole through it on. Presumably on would place a large pin through this hole and fasten it securely - very securely! When the project is finished I will have a test firing, before the gun gets put on the wall. Watch this space for more details. Interestingly, advances in metallurgy have meant that punt guns are relatively much lighter and smaller than they used to be so behemoths like my weapon are very unlikely to ever be seen in use again - except perhaps on the front of the new Challenger tank! This photo illustrates a modern piece - it is a mere strip of a gun, being only 7 foot long and weighing a mere 88 lb, despite packing the same firepower as my piece. __________________ Proud THR plank-owner Let's put the fun back in dysfunctional! Please visit my blog: http://bayourenaissanceman.blogspot.com/

October 3, 2003, 08:51 AM	#2
Devonai Member Join Date: March 24, 2003 Location: East Granby, CT Posts: 2,745	After having gone punting at Stratford-upon-Avon, I can appreciate the use of this weapon! (damn geese) __________________ Intelligent Sci-Fi with a sense of humor, written for geeks and gunnies alike. *Reckless Faith*: A new science fiction adventure series.

October 3, 2003, 10:29 AM	#3
KMKeller Member Join Date: December 24, 2002 Location: NC Posts: 1,637	I believe there's one on display in the NC Museum of Natural History. Or at least a flintlock of enormous proportion. If any NC folks have been there, it's on display right next to that freakishly huge sunfish... __________________ Proud TFL Alumnus "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows neither victory nor defeat." - T.R. North Carolina Police Combat Pistol League The Triangle NRA/Shooting Sports Meetup Group

October 3, 2003, 01:02 PM	#4
sm Member Join Date: December 23, 2002 Posts: 26,501	Preacherman ole chap, has one not noticed my sig line all this time on TFL/THR ? Seriously , I'm an hour as the duck flies form the Rice and Duck Capitol of the world. Market hunters used these in various configurations, numerous photos abound to show effectiveness. Yes a few are displayed , some restored and kept for family history. I did so many years ago witness the awesome live fire of one. Words do not describe. LOL ( damn geese, damn ducks) Yep! So thick couldn't see a field, for the geese, flooded timber /resevoir with so many ducks one never knew water was beneath... __________________ Use Enough Gun TFL illuminaughty

October 3, 2003, 01:28 PM	#5
Quartus Member Join Date: January 13, 2003 Location: Virginia Posts: 2,178	Hmmm.... So that's where the idea of "knock down" power came from! __________________ Gone to TheFiringline.com

October 3, 2003, 03:50 PM	#7
Hutch Member Join Date: December 28, 2002 Location: Opelika, AL Posts: 1,643	There's a bit of a story about a punt gun woven thru Michener's Chesapeake. Muzzle-loader, IIRC. The novel describes sculling up to rafts of ducks, asleep on the water, and taking over a hundred with a single shot. Two retrievers (Chesapeake's, of course) are kept busy for an hour hauling the catch back in. Fascinating to see pictures of what he described.... __________________ Yoicks! And awaaaaaayy!

October 3, 2003, 09:19 PM	#8
Dave McCracken Moderator Join Date: December 20, 2002 Location: MD. Posts: 11,707	Chesapeake punt guns, Preacher, run along those lines. Many were muzzleloaders, and served long and well for the market hunting here. Seen similar at the Bay Museum in Havre de Grace, and some still in the families they served long ago. Kinda makes that 10 gauge double of yours seem like a 410, eh?.... __________________ BA/UU/R....

October 3, 2003, 09:36 PM	#9
gun-fucious Member Join Date: December 24, 2002 Location: centre of the PA Posts: 1,979	nice site: http://www.puntgunner.co.uk/ __________________ "The real victim of moral legislation is always the honest, law-abiding, well-meaning citizen." "The Uplifters Try It Again" by H.L. Mencken, Baltimore Sun, Nov. 30, 1925

October 4, 2003, 04:19 AM	#10
jsalcedo Member Join Date: December 31, 2002 Posts: 3,687	I wonder if was ever used to take out the competing punt hunters? Being on the wrong end of that boat would certainly ruin ones day. __________________ *Government is not the solution to our problem. Government is the problem.* RONALD REAGAN, First Inaugural Address, January 20, 1981

October 4, 2003, 04:47 AM	#11
Moparmike Member Join Date: June 8, 2003 Location: Oddly enough, a downwardly-plunging firey handbasket... Posts: 3,604	I wonder how a PT boat would look with 4 of those mounted on the bow? __________________ ********************************************************** Mike NRA Member \|\| Betsey's Loyal Minion 6 guns and counting. Requisite Quotes **********************************************************

October 8, 2003, 08:06 PM	#14
jacketch Member Join Date: May 3, 2003 Location: Richmond, Virginia Posts: 443	The Mariners Museum in Newport News VA also has punts and punt guns. __________________ Member of Virginia Citizens Defense League

December 15, 2003, 02:16 AM	#15
Kestrel Member Join Date: December 26, 2002 Posts: 2,168	So, PM, did you ever fire your canon? Any pictures? So, there are currently produced punt guns? What are they used for? Steve

December 15, 2003, 05:54 PM	#16
LynnMassGuy Member Join Date: November 6, 2003 Location: People's Commonwealth of Massachusetts Posts: 842	Neat stuff. __________________ NRA GOAL GOA CCRKBA http://theindependentjerk.blogspot.com/ "Lynn, Lynn, city of sin. You never come out the way you went in. Ask for water, they give you a gin... it's the darndest city I ever been in." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynn,_Massachusetts

December 20, 2003, 02:22 PM	#17
Ky Larry Member Join Date: May 22, 2003 Location: Ky Posts: 1,862	The punt gun looks like the perfect answer to the starling problem we have here in central Ky. Thousands of these nasty little creatures will roost in a tree. If this tree happens to be in your yard, you can imagine the mess. Of course our city council is too busy worrying about people smoking in bars and bowling alley to worry about real problems that affect real people. __________________ "Suppose you were a congressman. Now,suppose you were an idiot. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode