Storing gasoline for shtf.

[odysseus]

I am curious if anyone has done it, or has thought about it on storage of fuel. Outside maybe county ordinance issues (which are important, but maybe not for this discussion), I am curious about storing fuel safely - and perhaps a large amount - say +100 gallons or more. I would have a base station for this, and if I had to bug out would move what I could with me - but at least I could have a "base" of auto fuel since we all know just the rumor of trouble causes auto-fuel outtages and issues. I could also cycle through it at times to keep it fresh.

What would it take to do this right? I imagine an underground system with a manual pump of some sort that can be attached, not static so it can be pretty hidden. Fire danger is high, so of course I imagine this not being under or too near a structure, but this is of course the larger concern. Also it leakage over time so what materials?

[brerrabbit]

A good fuel stabilizer would be a good start. A 12 volt dc fuel pump and hose setup would be another. Not recomending it, but 55 gallon drums work good for short term storage of fuel.

[R.H. Lee]

I dunno if some offsite underground storage would be worth the expense for +100 gallons of gasoline. If I thought I'd need it, I'd rather have it with me. If you've got a truck, you can add another fuel tank for 20-30 gallons more, plus keep some jerry cans full in a garage or shed. Rotate them regularly.

Or, check these out:
http://www.gemplers.com/a/shop/searc...41012502136072

[odysseus]

If I thought I'd need it, I'd rather have it with me.

That's the thing. Carrying 30 gallons is say enough just for a few over a tank for most larger vehicles. I would want more on site. Again, if I had to be portable, I would have portable storage.

I guess an easier way is just a lot of portable storage containers in a off structure storage space, in some concealed way.

[Coronach]

I've thought about it. If anything, a large enough container might enable you to get deliveries from a gas supplier, at a discount. A farmer might know for sure...farm eq takes gas, and I've never seen a combine at a BP filling up...

Some thoughts:

1. the container will be expensive.

2. I don't know how long of a shelf life gas has, in a tank.

3. Storage will be a fire hazard, and might run afoul of local zoning laws.

4. Might be a nice addition to a gas generator.

Mike

[Art Eatman]

I keep gasoline on hand for a couple of "Tonka Toys", my dumptruck and a little Fiat-Allis grader. I've found that 35-gallon drums are better than 55-gallon, in that I can handle them more easily. Tilt, and roll across the garage floor.

There are all manner of add-on gas tanks for pickups.

And I gay-rawn-tee you that Sta-Bil is Good Stuff.

Art

[P95loser]

definately +1 for sta-bil

gas loses approximately one point of octane per month and when it gets below 80 it loses enough combustibility not to work in engines... sta-bil keeps the octane rating from dropping for like 12 months...

other than that, why not one of those 110 gallon truck tanks hidden in a storage building?

[rufus1]

If you can keep the gasoline in a container that can be presurized to at least 11psi , it will keep indefinetly. I did chemical packaging/cleanup for a while and it is in one of the safety books.

[Sheldon J]

I use sealed 6 gal plastic gas cans with a double shot of Stabl, the cans pressureize them self. The fuel has kept useable for over 2 years in the backup generator's tank (bought it for y2k then the power did not go off for over 2 years) all I did was keep the battery on a tickle charger. Usually I have 40+ gallons of gas and 25 of kerosene in the shop at all times, (hay we live in the country and it's no fun not being able to flush the toilet when the power goes of), the extra fuel never goes to waste with the JD and the Bobcat in use, just keep cycleing the cans and refill each time one goes empty.

[odysseus]

Not sure where to find 35 gallon gasoline approved drums. Point me in the right direction?

Also, anyone got a favorite portable gas can that's of good size?

[CZ-100]

I call it my boat, it holds 60 gal. Plus I have a 28 gal can on wheels.

[bogie]

Gasoline requires stabilizer, as has been noted.

Diesel doesn't.

If something has "diesel" in its name, it costs more.

[Art Eatman]

"Not sure where to find 35 gallon gasoline approved drums."

Approved? What's that?

Some Agriculture chemicals come in that size.

Where? I dunno; start with some Internet search...Want-ads. Yellow pages...

Art

[Tokugawa]

Hmmm.... have I just been lucky? I have left unstabilized gas in the lawn mower, motorcycles and gas cans all winter long all my life and never had a problem with it being "stale" and not working. That aside, I can attest to how much easier gas is to handle in 30 gallon plastic drums- it is the av gas standard up north.

[P95loser]

i like the 5 gallon "safety cans" they are metal and have a spring loaded cap that prevents leaks... they are like 30 bucks at lowes

[LaEscopeta]

I can add two things;

1. You can still burn old gas (octane below 80) if you mix it with fresh gas, maybe a 5:1 fresh-to-old ratio.

2. Most in ground tanks eventually leak. If you put a gas tank in the ground on your property, you might be facing a ton of EPA regulations. Plus maybe legal problems if someone discovers soil contamination from your tank. Plus you might contaminate your own water well. I believe EPA regulations call for double wall in ground tanks, with some way to pump from the space between the two walls. Plus, if you get a SHTF situation >20 years from when a simple metal wall tank goes in the ground, it might be leaking so much you will find less gas in the tank then you need. The fuel tanks I’ve seen on farms and other private property have all been above ground.

[garyk/nm]

Back when I was a young pup, my grandpa kept a 250 gallon above-ground tank with a hand-crank pump. IIRC, he got it filled 3-4 times a year by the local distributor at a 10% discount off the pump price. Never had any problem with the gas going flat, but maybe the distributor was adding stabilizer to the gas.

Buried tanks are risky for reasons mentioned above, but a creatively hidden tank might work.

[dfaugh]

I know (as a friend just started farming) that in NY gas purchased for "farm use" is not taxed, or at least taxed quite a bit less. He bought a 250 gallon above ground tank...Dunno all the details, but he was paying about $.50 a gallon less for gas before the current problems... Something to consider...

[armoredman]

Conceal your tank inside a creatively wrecked, and obviously unsalvageable school bus....

[cracked butt]

Not sure where to find 35 gallon gasoline approved drums. Point me in the right direction

Any 55 gallon mild steel drum would work, things that are a whole lot more flammable than gasoline are routinely stored and shipped in them.

[Art Eatman]

Tokugawa, it's summer heat that kills gasoline. Even down here in the desert, wintertime is no problem for my above-ground, 560-gallon tank--which I always try to have empty by late March.

Art

[Larry Ashcraft]

A farmer might know for sure...farm eq takes gas, and I've never seen a combine at a BP filling up...

Most farmers use fuel tanks on stands, from 200-500 gallon capacity. In fact I have a 200 gallon one which I can't afford to fill up anyway. You can find them at farm auctions and the hoses, dispensers and filters are available at farm supply stores.

Make sure you get a theft proof hose and a good padlock. Smaller fuel distributors will deliver, but expect to pay retail, since you are buying a relatively small amount.

Dunno all the details, but he was paying about $.50 a gallon less for gas before the current problems

DO NOT get caught using farm fuel on-road. It has a dye in it that is easily detected. The fine for getting caught is $5000.

[Ravenslair]

Along the lines of what rufus1 said. You might be able to use cornie kegs (soda kegs). They hold 5 gallons of liquid. You can purchase rebuilt ones for $25. They are stainless steel and can be pressurized with a CO2 or N2 bottle. I would think the gas would last quite a long time. Just get as many as you need. Anyone ever tried this?

[charby]

Would the gas erode the rubber seals on the Corny Kegs? I brew my own beer and use the corny kegs. You can pick them up for under $5 and get a rebuild kits pretty cheap if you search the web.

The only problem I see is extracting the fuel through a 3/8 hose. Be pretty slow to empty five gallons. Or the fuel eating the hose when you are pumping it out or blowing the hose under too much pressure.

Charby

[cracked butt]

The only problem I see is extracting the fuel through a 3/8 hose. Be pretty slow to empty five gallons. Or the fuel eating the hose when you are pumping it out or blowing the hose under too much pressure.

Another problem with rubber/plastic hoses is the static discharge hazard. Make sure you have a wire that connects the steel container to the the nozzle or metal container that you are discharging it to. Non polar solvents such as gasoline can and do pick up static charges when run through nonconducting materials like rubber or plastic, or through open air. Sort of like rubbing a rubber comb over wool. It doesn't take much of a static spark to cause an explosion.