12GA Rifle From HELL-- - Page 8

hubel458 · May 16, 2006, 09:23 PM

p95-And if Rob shot it in his gun, that stands BMG
pressures, it would max out at 3000 plus fps.Ed.

P95Carry · May 16, 2006, 09:29 PM

Phew 3000+ - hey, leaving aside any legalities - that sucker with a hardened insert would be wicked against armor

In fact daresay that, per the 2300 speed, would defeat some substantial steel plate! Awesome

cordex · May 17, 2006, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Phew 3000+ - hey, leaving aside any legalities - that sucker with a hardened insert would be wicked against armor

As long as no one makes a production pistol in this caliber, legalities shouldn't be an issue at all.

hubel458 · May 17, 2006, 12:43 PM

Legalities are no problem for long guns as long as it fires
all 12ga cases same or shorter than its chamber.And hard inserts in bullets, solid brass bullets, steel jacketed bullets are
no problem, as they are used for target,etc use now.Now
many states don't allow hard bullets for deer hunting as they
want bullets to stop if possible in the animal.Ed.

AJAX22 · May 17, 2006, 02:52 PM

I was wondering if it would be possible to manufacture a conversion barrel for this which would allow function on a standard 10 gauge single shot frame.

Before everyone jumps on me for even sugesting it, (I know the pressures would blow up a standard action)

if the conversion barrel had a breach block with a locking head attached and integral firing pin

and only used the single barrel receiver as a hammer/trigger assembly, NOT to resist pressure.

it might be a way to avoid the legality of manufacturing a receiver in this caliber, while still allowing it to be more widely available.

It would definitly breathe some new life into the old single shots.

hubel458 · May 17, 2006, 07:41 PM

AJAX22-That idea may work, also Rob got 750 gr
up to 1800 in an Encore. He cut our case
back to 3 inches. I looked at NEF 10ga heavy
barrel and if an alloy barrel was used it would
do more. My gun is only running 30,000 psi.Lighter
break actions,the 730gr at 2500 would be all the recoil
you could handle.My gun is 25 lb bolt action.
Now there is no legal restrictions on building recievers
for shotguns for yourself, but if your going to make for sale
then you have to have manufacturers license.
If you make any actions for sale, need manufacture license.
In fact no prohibition in building for anything over
50cal for yourself as long as you pay tax and register it.
That is why we got sporting exemption for 550 Mag, 700HE,
and NE cases, etc, so that registering & tax is excused.
This is all per Title 18 GCA.Ed

hubel458 · May 23, 2006, 11:52 PM

We shot a 6 gallon bucket of water, that was sealed.
Like a shower. Will get pic of one ungluing in
few days.Ed.

hubel458 · May 27, 2006, 10:00 PM

Shot a 610 grain hollowpoint Dixie hard
slug into 6 gallon sealed pail of water.
Going 2800 fps, and real big hollowpoint.
First pic is pail with crimped on top.
Pail full and has filler spout capped.
Second pic,impact with water atomising,
and pail blowing apart.In the next small
fraction of a second is third after impact
with shelf cleared, the hyrostatic pressure
down, has bent top of steel frame shelf.
Same blast put jug pieces all over.
Got to get a 15 gallon one. Behind
you see my wood bundle backstop...Ed

P95Carry · May 27, 2006, 11:11 PM

Now that is spectacular!

Third_Rail · May 28, 2006, 12:08 AM

Torch the weeds, water the lawn, and scare off any critters eating your garden, all with one handy shot!

madmike · May 29, 2006, 12:06 AM

http://www.gunownerstv.com/Impact.jpg

hubel458 · May 31, 2006, 02:47 AM

Mike-Here is long view of exploding pail.Ed

razorburn · May 31, 2006, 11:31 AM

Absolute lunacy.

hubel458 · June 4, 2006, 11:16 PM

It is a virus, called loonyshootitis syndrome.....Ed

hubel458 · June 25, 2006, 08:54 PM

I picked up a 12ga NEF Ultra Slug gun.24 in shorty barrel.
Added weight and thumbhole stock.
Gun weighted to 15 lbs so
far. I got 600gr hard slug to
1650-1700 so far, and shoots easy.
Got 1 1/2 inch thick pad.Working up different
loads.Should get over 2000.
Cases eject easy,no resizing needed
on bottom half of case,action opens easy,
no evidence of binding.Started case 3.2 inch,
settled on case length of 3.15-- Chamber being
full size max 12ga size expands top half of case
more than my minimum chamber in Savage does,
so little more effort needed to size.Our case, though many times stronger than regular
12ga cases is thinner at mouth, so that is
why I used tight chamber on Savage.Still
can't get used to mickey mouse short barrel.
Anyone know of a genius who could
make long alloy barrel with pivot mounted?
Cases can be 3 inches on up to
our length, and work.Ed.

hubel458 · July 1, 2006, 01:40 AM

We got 600 gr slug to 2000 fps in NEF.Used ball
powder load. Case length of maximum 3.07 works.
Anyone using our style case should also put in adapter
for shotgun primer. Save a lot of work
beefing up hammer speed and strength.Ed

hubel458 · July 5, 2006, 08:47 AM

The Savage perking right along. Used a little faster
ball powder and got 600gr hard slug out to 3000 fps.
That is 12,000 ft lbs. Moving right along.
Got more hard slugs coming and I think 14,000 ft lbs
possible.Ed.

TMM · July 5, 2006, 03:25 PM

I dont' recall if i posted before, but i've got to say what you're doing is totally awesome and also totally crazy. i love it! I'm sending an email regarding your offer of a shell sample.

~tmm

jason_2001 · July 5, 2006, 05:06 PM

I followed a link to this thread from SurvivalBlog.com and read the whole string and WOW! This is some great stuff!

I am also going to send along a request for a shell sample and Thank You for doing this - wildcatting a 12 guage is a great idea!

Jason

madmike · July 5, 2006, 05:21 PM

I posted the link.

www.survivalblog.com

Good debate and info on SHTF issues.

1911_CQB · July 6, 2006, 12:34 AM

Holy Crap.

Sylvan-Forge · July 6, 2006, 10:55 AM

Third_Rail · July 6, 2006, 11:24 AM

Ed - check your PMs.

hubel458 · July 7, 2006, 10:25 PM

For you fellows down under, Scott Wardle is having a bunch of rims and cases with 12ga rims made and will make them
for others in need.Ed.

hubel458 · July 10, 2006, 12:58 AM

In a little while I will have a bunch
12ga rim pieces to supply those who can take them and
thread the case themselves.Most lathe guys can
turn off rims and put on 5/8 by 24 thread.The rim
pieces are precision done on cnc equipment, so if case
has threads they go right on and loctite makes them
permanent.Ed

May 16, 2006, 09:23 PM	#176
hubel458 Member Join Date: March 1, 2003 Location: Brinton,Mich. Posts: 526	p95-And if Rob shot it in his gun, that stands BMG pressures, it would max out at 3000 plus fps.Ed. __________________ Ed Hubel.

May 16, 2006, 09:29 PM	#177
P95Carry Moderator Emeritus Join Date: January 3, 2003 Location: South PA, and a bit West of center! Posts: 16,341	Phew 3000+ - hey, leaving aside any legalities - that sucker with a hardened insert would be wicked against armor In fact daresay that, per the 2300 speed, would defeat some substantial steel plate! Awesome __________________ Chris - P95. Guns don't kill people - people kill people. NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member. Second Amendment Portal - RKBA-2A.com ______________________________

May 17, 2006, 12:43 PM	#179
hubel458 Member Join Date: March 1, 2003 Location: Brinton,Mich. Posts: 526	Legalities are no problem for long guns as long as it fires all 12ga cases same or shorter than its chamber.And hard inserts in bullets, solid brass bullets, steel jacketed bullets are no problem, as they are used for target,etc use now.Now many states don't allow hard bullets for deer hunting as they want bullets to stop if possible in the animal.Ed. __________________ Ed Hubel.

May 17, 2006, 07:41 PM	#181
hubel458 Member Join Date: March 1, 2003 Location: Brinton,Mich. Posts: 526	AJAX22-That idea may work, also Rob got 750 gr up to 1800 in an Encore. He cut our case back to 3 inches. I looked at NEF 10ga heavy barrel and if an alloy barrel was used it would do more. My gun is only running 30,000 psi.Lighter break actions,the 730gr at 2500 would be all the recoil you could handle.My gun is 25 lb bolt action. Now there is no legal restrictions on building recievers for shotguns for yourself, but if your going to make for sale then you have to have manufacturers license. If you make any actions for sale, need manufacture license. In fact no prohibition in building for anything over 50cal for yourself as long as you pay tax and register it. That is why we got sporting exemption for 550 Mag, 700HE, and NE cases, etc, so that registering & tax is excused. This is all per Title 18 GCA.Ed __________________ Ed Hubel.

May 23, 2006, 11:52 PM	#182
hubel458 Member Join Date: March 1, 2003 Location: Brinton,Mich. Posts: 526	We shot a 6 gallon bucket of water, that was sealed. Like a shower. Will get pic of one ungluing in few days.Ed. __________________ Ed Hubel.

May 17, 2006, 02:52 PM	#180
AJAX22 Member Join Date: November 9, 2005 Posts: 1,137	I was wondering if it would be possible to manufacture a conversion barrel for this which would allow function on a standard 10 gauge single shot frame. Before everyone jumps on me for even sugesting it, (I know the pressures would blow up a standard action) if the conversion barrel had a breach block with a locking head attached and integral firing pin and only used the single barrel receiver as a hammer/trigger assembly, NOT to resist pressure. it might be a way to avoid the legality of manufacturing a receiver in this caliber, while still allowing it to be more widely available. It would definitly breathe some new life into the old single shots.

May 27, 2006, 10:00 PM	#183
hubel458 Member Join Date: March 1, 2003 Location: Brinton,Mich. Posts: 526	Shot a 610 grain hollowpoint Dixie hard slug into 6 gallon sealed pail of water. Going 2800 fps, and real big hollowpoint. First pic is pail with crimped on top. Pail full and has filler spout capped. Second pic,impact with water atomising, and pail blowing apart.In the next small fraction of a second is third after impact with shelf cleared, the hyrostatic pressure down, has bent top of steel frame shelf. Same blast put jug pieces all over. Got to get a 15 gallon one. Behind you see my wood bundle backstop...Ed __________________ Ed Hubel. Last edited by hubel458; May 28, 2006 at 02:01 AM.

May 27, 2006, 11:11 PM	#184
P95Carry Moderator Emeritus Join Date: January 3, 2003 Location: South PA, and a bit West of center! Posts: 16,341	Now that is spectacular! __________________ Chris - P95. Guns don't kill people - people kill people. NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member. Second Amendment Portal - RKBA-2A.com ______________________________

May 28, 2006, 12:08 AM	#185
Third_Rail Member Join Date: January 10, 2004 Posts: 4,981	Torch the weeds, water the lawn, and scare off any critters eating your garden, all with one handy shot! __________________ Giving up the right to arms is a mistake a free people get to make only once. I will not make that mistake. Government always thinks everything is about leadership. It never is. It's about the people. - Standing Wolf

May 29, 2006, 12:06 AM	#186
madmike Member Join Date: January 5, 2003 Location: In a well-equipped suburban bunker Posts: 2,088	http://www.gunownerstv.com/Impact.jpg __________________ http://SharpPointyThings.com http://www.MichaelZWilliamson.com FREEHOLD, Jan 04 from Baen Books THE WEAPON, Aug 05 from Baen Books CONFIRMED KILL, Sep 05 from HarperCollins BETTER TO BEG FORGIVENESS..., Winter 07 from Baen Books ~~~ "The Finest battle implement ever devised." Ung the Caveman on the M1 Pointy Stick.

May 31, 2006, 02:47 AM	#187
hubel458 Member Join Date: March 1, 2003 Location: Brinton,Mich. Posts: 526	Mike-Here is long view of exploding pail.Ed __________________ Ed Hubel.

May 31, 2006, 11:31 AM	#188
razorburn member Join Date: May 16, 2006 Posts: 667	Absolute lunacy.

June 4, 2006, 11:16 PM	#189
hubel458 Member Join Date: March 1, 2003 Location: Brinton,Mich. Posts: 526	It is a virus, called loonyshootitis syndrome.....Ed __________________ Ed Hubel.

June 25, 2006, 08:54 PM	#190
hubel458 Member Join Date: March 1, 2003 Location: Brinton,Mich. Posts: 526	I picked up a 12ga NEF Ultra Slug gun.24 in shorty barrel. Added weight and thumbhole stock. Gun weighted to 15 lbs so far. I got 600gr hard slug to 1650-1700 so far, and shoots easy. Got 1 1/2 inch thick pad.Working up different loads.Should get over 2000. Cases eject easy,no resizing needed on bottom half of case,action opens easy, no evidence of binding.Started case 3.2 inch, settled on case length of 3.15-- Chamber being full size max 12ga size expands top half of case more than my minimum chamber in Savage does, so little more effort needed to size.Our case, though many times stronger than regular 12ga cases is thinner at mouth, so that is why I used tight chamber on Savage.Still can't get used to mickey mouse short barrel. Anyone know of a genius who could make long alloy barrel with pivot mounted? Cases can be 3 inches on up to our length, and work.Ed. __________________ Ed Hubel.

July 1, 2006, 01:40 AM	#191
hubel458 Member Join Date: March 1, 2003 Location: Brinton,Mich. Posts: 526	We got 600 gr slug to 2000 fps in NEF.Used ball powder load. Case length of maximum 3.07 works. Anyone using our style case should also put in adapter for shotgun primer. Save a lot of work beefing up hammer speed and strength.Ed __________________ Ed Hubel.

July 5, 2006, 08:47 AM	#192
hubel458 Member Join Date: March 1, 2003 Location: Brinton,Mich. Posts: 526	The Savage perking right along. Used a little faster ball powder and got 600gr hard slug out to 3000 fps. That is 12,000 ft lbs. Moving right along. Got more hard slugs coming and I think 14,000 ft lbs possible.Ed. __________________ Ed Hubel.

July 5, 2006, 03:25 PM	#193
TMM Member Join Date: February 23, 2005 Posts: 1,049	I dont' recall if i posted before, but i've got to say what you're doing is totally awesome and also totally crazy. i love it! I'm sending an email regarding your offer of a shell sample. ~tmm __________________ "the loudest sound in a gun fight is "click"...." - nyresq "Even if you didn't find no game, it's always some trashy rascal dat needs uh good killin'" - Thier Eyes Were Watching God

July 5, 2006, 05:06 PM	#194
jason_2001 Member Join Date: March 27, 2005 Posts: 1	Amazing!! I followed a link to this thread from SurvivalBlog.com and read the whole string and WOW! This is some great stuff! I am also going to send along a request for a shell sample and Thank You for doing this - wildcatting a 12 guage is a great idea! Jason

July 5, 2006, 05:21 PM	#195
madmike Member Join Date: January 5, 2003 Location: In a well-equipped suburban bunker Posts: 2,088	I posted the link. www.survivalblog.com Good debate and info on SHTF issues. __________________ http://SharpPointyThings.com http://www.MichaelZWilliamson.com FREEHOLD, Jan 04 from Baen Books THE WEAPON, Aug 05 from Baen Books CONFIRMED KILL, Sep 05 from HarperCollins BETTER TO BEG FORGIVENESS..., Winter 07 from Baen Books ~~~ "The Finest battle implement ever devised." Ung the Caveman on the M1 Pointy Stick.

July 6, 2006, 12:34 AM	#196
1911_CQB Member Join Date: March 16, 2006 Location: Western WA Posts: 126	Holy Crap. __________________ www.10mmtalk.com www.brenten.com

July 6, 2006, 10:55 AM	#197
Sylvan-Forge Member Join Date: February 22, 2006 Location: Fort Myers, Florida Posts: 1,224

July 6, 2006, 11:24 AM	#198
Third_Rail Member Join Date: January 10, 2004 Posts: 4,981	Ed - check your PMs. __________________ Giving up the right to arms is a mistake a free people get to make only once. I will not make that mistake. Government always thinks everything is about leadership. It never is. It's about the people. - Standing Wolf

July 7, 2006, 10:25 PM	#199
hubel458 Member Join Date: March 1, 2003 Location: Brinton,Mich. Posts: 526	For you fellows down under, Scott Wardle is having a bunch of rims and cases with 12ga rims made and will make them for others in need.Ed. __________________ Ed Hubel.

July 10, 2006, 12:58 AM	#200
hubel458 Member Join Date: March 1, 2003 Location: Brinton,Mich. Posts: 526	In a little while I will have a bunch 12ga rim pieces to supply those who can take them and thread the case themselves.Most lathe guys can turn off rims and put on 5/8 by 24 thread.The rim pieces are precision done on cnc equipment, so if case has threads they go right on and loctite makes them permanent.Ed __________________ Ed Hubel.