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Old March 21, 2015, 08:52 PM   #1
jim8115
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357 Mag problem

4 revolvers , S&W 686+ , Ruger GP100 , S&W Mod 28 , brand new Ruger Sp101

4 loads , all 158 Gr jhp / jsp
14.0 2400
16.5 H-110
8.0 Power pistol
6.3 CSB-1

all loads work fine in every gun EXCEPT the SP-101 , all show sticky extraction in that one to a degree.Removing them one at a time, none are stuck bad, but with all five, its enough combined resistance to be fairly hard to extract.

UMC 125 Gr JSP ( only factory ammo I could find ) doesnt stick in it.

Jim
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Old March 21, 2015, 08:58 PM   #2
Schwing
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This is nothing to worry about. The chambers in the sp101 are probably just slightly tighter. I have the same problem in reverse with my gp100 having the issue.

If you ever shoot .38s out of that gun, you will also get carbon rings in the cylinders that will make it hard to insert and extract .357s.

Give the cylinders a good cleaning. Most likely, that will resolve the problem.
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Old March 21, 2015, 09:26 PM   #3
jim8115
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I cleaned it good. My concern is that the loads I have been shooting for years are hotter than they should be...and I just didnt know it
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Old March 21, 2015, 09:50 PM   #4
Analogkid
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My Sps101 has the same issue. I was told to take a flex hone to the chambers. One of these days I will. Mine does it with factory ammo and my reloads.

Last edited by Analogkid; March 22, 2015 at 12:16 AM.
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Old March 21, 2015, 11:19 PM   #5
rcmodel
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Polish the chambers.

As analog kid just posted.

All chambers are not polished to the same degree.

Old S&W, and old Ruger chambers were finished & polished slicker then owl snot years ago.

Not so much anymore.

Rc
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Old March 21, 2015, 11:32 PM   #6
Bexar
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How many times have you reloaded the brass? Cases lose their expansion and then contraction capacity over multiple firings. Heat and metal fatigue all come into play.

Anyway...that's my thought. Keep us posted.
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Old March 22, 2015, 12:17 AM   #7
Analogkid
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It doesn't matter new or reloaded with mine. They stick no matter what.
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Old March 22, 2015, 01:00 AM   #8
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Inspect for any issues. Out of time, even slightly builds higher pressures and can cause odd issues if it's just barely off. If it's more than just barely off you kaboom the cylinder. If all 5 do this then that's my first place to look. Tight could be the issue but doubtful, burrs could do it too but also doubtful that it be every chamber. Check time, forcing cone, and slug your barrel for size. Any extra resistance holds more pressure under the bullet for a longer time frame and can show its ugly head just as you describe. With the factory ammo, I'm betting it's not nearly as strong as what folks call a full house load or a true magnum load do lower pressures in that setup may not be spiking as high as your reloads. I can't comment on your reloads though, i have never used those powders.
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Old March 22, 2015, 01:25 AM   #9
IMtheNRA
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Jim, if all loads, including brand-new factory loads stick only in that gun, it is probably the gun. I would polish up the chambers with some Mothers or Flitz. They may be tight and not well polished.
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Old March 22, 2015, 08:56 AM   #10
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Do your reloads extract easily before they are fired? I am not familiar with the UMC ammo but maybe put a mic on the mouth and check it against your reloads.

Maybe there is a little more bell on the mouth of the reloads and as others have said, you may have tight cylinder.

You could also try RC's dry erase marker to see how they look after you extract them. Doesn't cost much to try it.
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Old March 22, 2015, 09:19 AM   #11
JRWhit
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Quote:
Do your reloads extract easily before they are fired?
+1

I would find it a little odd that they would show higher pressure out of the shortest barrel. I'm on the polish the cylinder band wagon.
What condition is the brass of the reloads? Polished and cleaned, just reloaded after firing? What is the trim length and OAL.? I've put some pretty hefty loads through my sp101 and have never had an issue with sticking cases.
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Old March 22, 2015, 09:26 AM   #12
Walkalong
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How tight the chambers, throat, groove diameter, and the size of the cylinder gap determines pressure, not how long the barrel is.

Polishing the chambers will almost certainly cure your problem. I had that problem with some .22 Mag chambers that had been converted from .22 LR where you almost had to beat the brass out. I polished them and now the brass just falls out. I am sure your chambers are much nicer than those were, so it shouldn't take much.
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Old March 22, 2015, 03:12 PM   #13
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Have you pulled some random loads and weighed the charges to verify the charges?

What do the primers look like? Is there a significant degree of flow and flattening or top hats?

GS
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Old March 22, 2015, 06:01 PM   #14
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make sure you are fully sizing the cases. the case head is the thickest part of the case and tends to resist sizing. if that diameter is not reduced enough when sized, it can wedge the fired case in the cylinder (especially if the sp101 has the smallest chambers).

measure a sized case and find out. the diameter should be the same from mouth to head (top to bottom).

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Old March 22, 2015, 08:47 PM   #15
jim8115
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Have not slugged the bore
Does not appear to be out of time
All loads are hand weighed one at a time, with check done with two scales to verify
the 2400 and h-110 loads are near max, but not over according to the manuals I have, lyman, hornady, and sierra
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Old March 22, 2015, 09:32 PM   #16
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This sounds like a different problem, but it should be noted that the first SP-101's had shorter cylinders and were labeled "125gr only ".
Just in case any owners of those are reading along.
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Old March 22, 2015, 10:14 PM   #17
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So how do you go about polishing the chambers?

thanks
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Old March 22, 2015, 10:16 PM   #18
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I know that my S&W k frames will handle a hotter load than my S&W J frames. could there be a correlation here?
I've worked loads for a Ruger Security Six that were to hot for a S&W k frame, So yes your loads could be too hot.
I am not familiar with roughly bored chambers, But when shell extraction becomes difficult it's tellin me I need to back off. A over pressure load will expand the cylinder chamber the chamber will spring back to it's original diameter, the brass having less memory will remain closer to it's expanded diameter and stick.
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Old March 22, 2015, 10:45 PM   #19
Analogkid
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With My Sp101 it isn't hot ammo. I can run any kind of magnum rounds in it and they suck to get out. Just today I finally ran some blazer aluminum 357 in it and of course they stuck a bit.


This doesn't seems to be anything new with Sp101, hence the quick assertion by a few Gunsmiths to polish the cylinder chambers. I was told to use a flex hone in all cases.

After todays range session I will be ordering one. I have a older Rossi Revolver that looks to have had it done either at the factory or by someone else. It has the smoothest ejection of all my Revolvers. The sp101...Not so much I can see the machine marks in all the chambers.


I see the flex hones on amazon for pretty cheap. I am going to order one tonight.
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Old March 22, 2015, 11:30 PM   #20
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If roughly bored chambers is the culprit I'd send the gun back to Ruger.
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Old March 23, 2015, 07:03 AM   #21
JRWhit
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Quote:
If roughly bored chambers is the culprit I'd send the gun back to Ruger.
I'll second that. I've had 2 of the sp101s and have had no issue with extraction. The cylinders are smooth, not mirror finish, but you cant see any tool marks. Just tell them you are having a hard time with extraction and they should take care of you. I've had two occasions where they sent me a call tag, they fixed the gun, and I had it back all in the same week. Those results may not be typical. Just be very descript in your letter you send with the pistol. And make note of the same cartridges working fine in your GP-100. Leave out the part about the S&Ws.
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Old March 23, 2015, 07:06 AM   #22
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I have had several different Ruger revolvers that had problems extracting brass until I polished the chambers. Yes they were all the newer style single action Blackhawk FYI. The two worst were my pair of 30 Carbine ones. ANY ammo that was at factory pressure (even reloads) would stick them enough that I had to remove the cylinder and tap the brass out with a cleaning rod. After honing the chambers, the brass falls out now.
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