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Old Yesterday, 11:34 AM   #1
223copperhead
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Fired capacity change

I'm a bit new to reloading. I worked up a load in 223 that I'm very happy with (0.38").

23.3 grains RE15, in new brass. I'm now ready to reload the fired brass, and was wondering if I need to up the powder by a tenth or two. I'm thinking if the capacity is slightly larger (neck sizing only), it will lower the pressure and speed.

Your thoughts?
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Old Yesterday, 11:49 AM   #2
scythefwd
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shoot again and see.. Do a load of each and check as well as your factory load. I doubt you'll see any real difference.

223 - Is this in a semi auto?
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Old Yesterday, 12:15 PM   #3
mdi
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Nope. If the capacity has increased due to case stretching to fit the chamber, it isn't significant and you and your target will never see the difference. Try checking the capacity of an unfired case vs a once fired case, with water and see if there is a difference...
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Old Yesterday, 12:25 PM   #4
243winxb
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4% difference. Gov. Test.
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Old Yesterday, 12:37 PM   #5
rcmodel
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Even if it does change on the unfired case?

It doesn't change the fired case.
And that's what you are really talking about.

The case expands to fit the chamber the first firing.
It is already expanded to fit the chamber after neck sizing.

So the case capacity is still the same, because you are really talking about the chamber capacity with the case in it.

The sized case doesn't determine the case capacity.
The chamber does that when the case expands.

rc
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Old Yesterday, 12:53 PM   #6
scythefwd
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RC - I think he's running from virgin brass to 1x. IF he full length sized it before loading the virgin brass, there will be a miniscule amount of case capacity difference on the neck sized 1x fired stuff.

I say run it as is, but feel free to load up .1 gr and test.. its not my powder
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Old Yesterday, 12:53 PM   #7
Walkalong
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Quote:
The sized case doesn't determine the case capacity.
The chamber does that when the case expands.
If you want to get picky....
Chamber minus case displacement.
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Old Yesterday, 01:11 PM   #8
rcmodel
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Quote:
IF he full length sized it before loading the virgin brass, there will be a miniscule amount of case capacity difference on the neck sized 1x fired stuff.
My point is, that the case expands to fill the chamber, well before Max chamber pressure is reached.

What it holds before firing and it expands to fill the chamber is not relevant.

The actual case capacity that matters can only be determined after the case expands to fill the chamber.

rc
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Old Yesterday, 01:27 PM   #9
223copperhead
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The reason I asked is because I worked up the load in 0.2gr increaments.
The 5 shot group with 0.2 grains less was at 0.90" versus 0.38".
I wanted to go ahead and load up 100 or so rounds, and realized I may be changing the dynamics as I will only be neck sizing now. I worked my load with new brass.

Thanks for all the advice.
I'll just work up 20 rounds with the
Neck sized brass just to confirm.
Thanks again for the advice!!!!!
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Old Yesterday, 01:42 PM   #10
Sunray
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Neck sizing only won't do anything to the groups. Doesn't alter the case capacity either.
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Old Yesterday, 01:45 PM   #11
scythefwd
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rc, while I agree.. he may see a difference before that point when hes dropping powder and its filling the case less (ok, most humans cant do that.. ). If he was running 100% capacity without compressing, he MIGHT notice the difference. I think any capacity difference is pretty much academic, but technically present.
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Old Yesterday, 03:32 PM   #12
rsrocket1
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I am assuming this is in a bolt action rifle for target shooting, correct?
You really should full length resize for hunting and autoloaders such as the AR platform.
In those guns you want reliable feeding over absolute accuracy.
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Old Yesterday, 04:20 PM   #13
223copperhead
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It is a bolt, only for target. Maybe some prairie dogs in the future.
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Old Today, 12:12 PM   #14
bush3755
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Here's what I've gleaned from people getting best accuracy with rifle case reloads as observed on other forums.

Neck only sizing has never produced best accuracy when statistically significant tests with the reloads are made. Benchresters switched from neck only to full length sizing a few years ago. Sierra Bullets does no case prep at all and full length sizes all their cases used to shoot their stuff for quality control with thrown charges; 1/4 to 1/2 MOA ten-shot groups at 200 yards with their match bullets is normal.

One few-shot group with a given load has about a 20% chance of representing what the average of 10 few-shot groups will be. Record 5-shot single groups in benchrest competition are one-tenth or less the size of the aggregate (average) of several 5-shot groups; even smaller compared to aggregates of several 10-shot groups. Few, if any, single group record holders also hold an aggregate record.

Therefore, here's my take on group sizes (based on posts from other forums). The largest groups happen when some of the biggest variables (rifle + ammo + shooter) add up together. Those smallest groups happen when all those variables cancel each other out. Average group sizes occur when some of those variables cancel each other out and the rest add up together. If you shoot several groups with the same load and they're not within 10% of the same extreme spread, you've not shot enough shots per group to be representative of the rifle, ammo and shooter abilities.
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