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Old December 27, 2009, 01:46 PM   #2501
Nematocyst
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Thumbs up Marlin 39

Quote:
Any ideas ?
Yeah, I have some ideas.

I'm going to nail this first post on page 101 of the Marlin 39 Club and make a speech. Here goes.

On March 11, 2007, I started this thread, this "club" about one of the most venerable .22 rifles in American history, and arguably THE most venerable .22 lever guns in American history. (You'll note I specifically did not specify .22 LR, because the 39 shoots long and short, also.)

This is not the Marlin 39A Club, or 39M Club, or any other subcategory. No, it's about all 39s and their ancestors.

We now show up in Rifle Country as having 2500 replies and 158,259 views.

That makes this one of the most popular threads in THR history. And it ain't because I started it. I'm nobody. It's because this rifle is something. It's because this is an amazing rifle with an amazing legacy, going all the way back to Annie Oakley, who used one of its predecessors to shoot playing cards in half in the air.

This rifle in all it's manifestations, models, years of production is a masterpiece of gun design. One may criticize this or that about it. Fair enough. Suit yourself. But anyone that even attempts to criticize the rifle itself - its design, its beauty, its usefulness, its legacy - is, put bluntly, an idiot.

I love this rifle. I have had it for 2.75 years. I see it almost daily, and fondle it often. But because of an insane work schedule - being a small business owner, which means I've had 4 days off work in 2.5 years - I've shot it so few times that I'm embarrassed to say. (Same can be said for my beloved 336.) I've yet to kill a squirrel with it, which is the main reason I bought it. But I know - or hope - that someday sooner than later, that will change and that I can begin to give this rifle the time it deserves. I want that deeply.

Yet, it's clear from reading posts here, in the same club in a sister forum, on other forums (like Marlin Owners), and from my own experiences of FTF described earlier in this thread - an ongoing issue yet to be resolved - that current production of the 39 is suffering a bit. Like nearly every other corporation in the world - but not all - it's clear that Marlin Firearms is cutting back on its production standards. It's putting out too many damn rifles that don't work correctly, even right out of the box. That sucks.

However, that isn't the rifle's fault. That's Marlin's fault. No wait, that isn't even Marlin's fault. Marlin isn't a person, it's a corporation. It is driven by the people that run it. If the people that run it are schmucks, then the company will be a schmuck. It's that simple.

But even though John Marlin started it, if there are QC problems with the 39 (or any other of their firearms) today, it's not his fault. No, if fault is to be assigned, it's with the current group of people running Marlin Firearms, starting with the president. In fact, especially the president.

So, to the president of Marlin Firearms, Inc. I, Nem A. Tocyst, president of the Marlin 39 Club, say this to you. Get your act together. Stop producing inferior 39s. Stop it immediately. Get your QC in order. Don't let any rifle get out of your door that won't work right the first time, everytime.

Need to go up a few bucks on the price to compensate? Do it. But don't **** with this rifle. It is your responsibility to keep the name of the Marlin 39 held in high esteem as the paragon of lever 22s far into the future.

Long live the Marlin 39.

Those are my ideas.

Nem
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Last edited by Nematocyst; December 29, 2009 at 11:50 AM. Reason: because this is post 2501 on page 101, and I wanted it to be written well
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Old December 27, 2009, 02:32 PM   #2502
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Nem,

Well said. Thanks for starting this thread. It has become a great gathering place for 39 enthusiasts to share experiences, adventures, victories, trials, make friends, learn, brag, ask questions and be inspired. The 39 has long been My Favorite Marlin and this club has fueled (enabled?) that. Thanks again for giving me an outlet to share the passion.
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Old December 27, 2009, 04:45 PM   #2503
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Thanks, Mo, and you're welcome.

This thread would be far less than what it has become without your awesome contributions.

Same goes for others.
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Old December 27, 2009, 05:51 PM   #2504
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Nem

Your point is well made and expressed even better. I agree the powers that be at Marlin have an inheirent duty to maintain the QC on such a classic as the 39. It has become the standard that all other lever action 22 cal rifles are judged by. From a buisness standpoint it would serve them well to consider that it's one thing to take a proven design and continue to attempt to perfect the design to the next level. It's quite another to take that same proven design and allow it to deteriorate to the point that it is no longer held in the same high regard (all in the name of greater profits or cost savings).

While I love both my 39's, when put side by side, the finished quality is clear to see on the older (1969) and the lack of finish detail on my newer (2009). If I could only keep one, it would be the older 1969 model.
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Old December 27, 2009, 11:31 PM   #2505
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Nemotocyst, way to go. I've owned a Mountie for only a few short weeks and have really grown to love it. How dare Marlin (Remington) produce inferior modern 39A's? How about using your post, as the beginning of a petition to present to Marlin execs?
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Old December 27, 2009, 11:39 PM   #2506
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Quote:
I live north of Baltimore. As far as the price goes, it was typical Murphy's Law. I had looked for an older 39 for about 6 months and finally got discouraged, as there weren't really very many to look at. The ones I did see were either in poor shape for the money or in good shape for a lot of money. So being tired of looking for an older one I decided to treat myself to a spanking new 39 for last Fathers Day. I made the purchase through Walmart (best price around, no ffl fee and free shipping included). Bust as my original post stated, the joy was short lived.
Fast forward 3 months later, I decide to kill a rainey Sat morning and go to an extremely small gun show at a local VFW. Very small show 25-30 tables, but I had time to kill. I drive down, pay my $2 entry fee and walk in the door. There on the 2nd table sits the very sweet 1969 39 in VERY good condition. The seller is asking $350 for it w/ accessories. I talked to him for a few minutes and told him I really didn't need the accesories, just the rifle, but he said I could take the whole package for $325. I still think of that as one of my better gun deals.
Now I need to get them a big brother 336 to keep them company in the safe.
Well done! Need to find a couple of more deals like that myself.
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Old December 28, 2009, 07:07 AM   #2507
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Well done

I was one of the early ones to make very adverse comments about the later model 39A. It may have not been received well at the time, but it was all true. Now, after many more have voiced their opinion, it is all out in the open, and it is time for Marlin to wake up to the reputation that they are destroying. Their 'quick buck' approach is going to kill the longevity of the Marlin 39. At present, I would never recommend someone purchasing a new M39 - I consider it a 'Made in China' replica of a great rifle. I should have paid 1/3 the price I did.

After all the work I have done on my new M39A to get the various manufacturing faults fixed (six loose screws? come on!), I am now going to have the barrel re-chambered so that maybe I can get a decent shot group out of it. I'll have the chamber cut to a match chamber and then have the barrel lapped. It's going to cost me some more money, but then hopefully I should have the rifle I thought I bought in the first place. My gunsmith mate said "you have to decide at what point you are going to keep throwing money at it". I told him if he had an old beat up early M39 that shot well, I'd swap it for the new rifle - and on top of that, give him the extra $200 he wants for the barrel work. - He didn't take it, obviously he knows the score too.
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Old December 28, 2009, 09:18 AM   #2508
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I wonder how many good 39a's were produced in the last 3 years compared to bad ones. 1% bad ones produced? Yes, I had an issue with mine and found that Winchester Wildcat 22, of last month, held a group the size of a dime at 66 meters off sandbags in 40F temp. NO FTF or eject problems. Prior, was using Remington Target with 2 duds every 100 with some lame ejects every so often. I will be out in the
Spring to see what the Wildcat 22 will do at 100 meters. I just took my rifle in earlier this month for trigger work by our gunsmith and he adjusted the FTF and checked eject mechanism plus plus cleaning. I plan to test Winchesters T22. I'm aiming at getting 1" grps or less at 100 meters with cheap ammo, hopefully. Some ammo works better than others, is my guess. Anyway, I just spent $65.00 with our gunsmith and maybe all types of target ammo will work to find the cheapest best for accuracy. Massed produced items, like cars, have a certain percentage of defects, warranties.
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Old December 28, 2009, 10:12 AM   #2509
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Hi all,

Nem, While I appreciate the intent, you were actually aiming for page 100 and hit high and right putting you on the top of 101..... Breath control, dear friend, breath control.

Seriously though, this thread is my first stop at THR. My 39s are my favorite guns. They become my *really* favorite guns based on the resources, discussions, and friends found here over the past thousands of posts and 18 months.

I fully believe our early Marlin 39 matches were the catalysts. Once we warm up I am all in for a return to a M39 match. We'll show them rimfire match boys how to do it, again. Nem and Mo, thank you for your help on these matches.

On the quality of the new rifles, I just do not know. We are looking at single rifles from a very large sample size, trying to figure out what's going on. We are in contrast seeing my new rifle, just two years old, shooting statistically the same as my other of '64 vintage against examples of today's deficiency reports. A trend or a deviation? And if so, which of us is the deviation?

Long live THR, and its flagship thread, The Marlin 39 Club.
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Old December 28, 2009, 12:04 PM   #2510
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Quote:
Nem, While I appreciate the intent, you were actually aiming for page 100
and hit high and right putting you on the top of 101.....
Au contraire, my friend.

I was aiming squarely at post 2501,
half way to 5000 at the top of a page.

I nailed it dead on at 2500 paces.
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Old December 28, 2009, 02:27 PM   #2511
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Did someone say shootin' match?!!

Until we formalize something I propose we do a little 'pre-season' practice to prep us for the official match. With many of our members out-posted in snowy regions but have access to an indoor range I suggest the following.

10 yard - standin' on your hind legs and shootin like John Wayne match.
Rifle: Model 39 in any variation, irons, scopes all scored together.
Target: http://www.reloadbench.com/pdf/files...n%20Target.pdf
Course of fire: One shot at each Bull from Offhand position. Slings OK.
Scoring: 1 for touching Black, 2 for IN black, 4 touching white, 8 for IN white. (IN = completely within)
Bonus: 5 points per row for all shots touching white or better 3 across AND 10 points per column for all five shots touching white or better vertically.

25 yard - Doughnut Shoot
Rifle: Model 39 in any variation; Irons and Scopes scored separately
Target: http://www.reloadbench.com/pdf/files...0on%20grid.pdf
Course of Fire: 3 shots per Bullseye, any position including benched.
Scoring: 1 point for Black. 3 points for touching White. Center Bullseye Counts DOUBLE.
Bonus: All shots IN white score an additional 10 points.

For those lucky enough to have a 50 yard range available
50 yard Robin Hood shoot Can you split the arrow?
Rifle: Model 39 in any variation. Irons and Scopes scored seperately
Target: http://www.reloadbench.com/pdf/files/50yd%20NRA.pdf
Course of fire: 5 shots from any position including benched.
Scoring: Score normally but multiply any holes touching making an enlarged hole by the number of shots 2, 3, 4 or 5 by what the shots score added together. (example two shots in the 7 ring are touching - multiply 14 x 2 = 28 for those two shots. Three shots touching in the 8 ring 24 x 3 = 72 and so on).

100 yard variation
Same rules as the 50 yard except; fire 10 shots at this target:
http://www.reloadbench.com/pdf/files...0MiniPalma.pdf

Hopefully you don't need an excuse to go shoot your 39 but if you do, there it is.
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Old December 28, 2009, 07:41 PM   #2512
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^ Oh, now I smell a conspiracy to try to get me to the range
(where I would promptly embarrass myself).

Quote:
How about using your post, as the beginning of a petition to present to Marlin execs?
Be my guest, Pow. Use it as you like, modify it, etc.

I'm too busy at work for the next few weeks to help draft one,
but if it happens, I'll probably put my name on it.
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Old December 28, 2009, 11:15 PM   #2513
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Hey fellas. I just got me one of those new "made in china 39a's". I shot if for the first time today with iron sights. I am hoping to get the scope mounted this weekend, assuming Marlin will send the mounting screws for the weaver base that was included. They didn't send the screws to attach it. I talked to a customer service guy that was real nice to deal with and he seemed genuinely appologetic for the problem, and from his comments it sounds like this may be a common occurence. He was getting the screws sent to me 2nd day delivery. I'm satisfied with that.
I was only shooting at 25 yards as my eyes don't work like they used to. I shot about 200 rounds of various ammo. I tried probably 7 different rounds and they all cycled through the gun very well. I had on ftf on about round 150. That's when I started to panic thinking of the posts I've read mentioning light primer strikes. I looked at the bullet and the base had a very nice looking dent in it, comparable to all of my empties laying on the ground. I'll chalk that up to a bad bullet. It was a federal champion from a bulk pack I picked up cheap.
I am really excited to get this gun scoped out and get it out after tree rats. I love to hunt them and have had good luck using my CZ 452 american. (unbelievably accurate) I don't think the 39a will hold the kind of groups my CZ can do, but there's something supremely cool about the old lever gun out in the woods. I can't wait to get it out there.
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Old December 29, 2009, 07:46 AM   #2514
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White Spacers?

I've noticed that when looking at pictures of Mounties, they have white spacers between the stock and the butt plate. My 1964 Mountie does not. Did some year models not have the white spacer? Should my Mountie have the white spacer? Thanks.
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Old January 1, 2010, 09:13 AM   #2515
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Mngunhead, truly enjoy your new find. I put a scope on mine as use competitively. I hope to tryout 50 yd sandbag bench rest this Spring with my 39a. You know, they have their machined special barrels...etc, but it is all about having fun and get to know a different group of guys. I might surprise a couple fellows too, with my accuracy!! Nothing like joining a club and being active with your 39a which always receives comments or makes others talk about old times or want to come out with their's!
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Old January 2, 2010, 09:42 PM   #2516
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4 year follower here at THR . Bought this new in 1989 for a then king's ransom of $230. Its been shot with open sights, receiver sights and scoped (i like a variety ) and really preferred the original CCI SGB's. Best group was 10 shots into .63" @ 50yds. It has a hankering for Federal 510 nowadays. Here is my TDS (Ms.Tedious) wearing a steel tubed Weaver V7-B 2.5x7.
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Old January 2, 2010, 10:43 PM   #2517
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A TDS for $230?!! And you ain't in jail?
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Old January 2, 2010, 11:25 PM   #2518
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LOL! it was 1989 money though
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Old January 3, 2010, 02:02 AM   #2519
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New addition

I added a new rifle to my collection, a 1957 39A. It is in pretty good shape for a 53 year old.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 39a-web.jpg (69.1 KB, 53 views)
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Old January 3, 2010, 06:42 PM   #2520
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Fella's;

With all respect, I doubt that the picture R6j6b has posted is an actual TDS. The TDS has a 16.5" barrel. Looking at the picture, the barrel certainly doesn't seem to be that short. The total length of a TDS is only a hair over 32.5" & the gun pictured looks to handily exceed that measurement.

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Old January 3, 2010, 08:23 PM   #2521
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with the rubber pad 32 3/4" to be precise. Any pic can be Dr'd of course but its all I got. Hope you enjoy it. I hate having to prove - I guess this'll be my last post here. Enjoy.


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Old January 3, 2010, 08:57 PM   #2522
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r6j6b don't go running off just yet......
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Old January 3, 2010, 10:13 PM   #2523
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This is interesting I have a 1990 TDS no checkering and it has a black butt plate no white spacer. My 1995 TDS has checkering and the rubber padded butt plate.
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Old January 3, 2010, 11:24 PM   #2524
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Please excuse me if this isn't the right place for this. There seems to be a consensus of opinion that older 39A's are better made than newer ones. My question is: what year is the point of old vs new?
Thanks,
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Old January 4, 2010, 07:59 AM   #2525
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I am not sure it is true that older is better than new. The main differences between “old and new” are the cross bolt safety and rebound hammer. They were introduced in 1988-89. The designation changed to 39AS at that time. There are reports of FTF and FTE issues with some of the “new” guns produced in about 2004-2008. There is a thread on Marlin Owners about 39A success stories and there are stickys on how to easily fix the FTF and FTE issues if you have a problem.
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