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Old October 15, 2007, 10:23 AM   #151
trigeezer
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Thanks, everyone, for the feedback on my question about shooting .38s through a .357. I am a novice at this stuff, and your comments were helpful.
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Old October 17, 2007, 12:38 AM   #152
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Apparently the 340 M&P is available again! I've had mine on order since April and my local dealer called about 10:AM this morning to ask if I still wanted it. Of course......... it will be here Friday. Then, about two hours later I got an e-mail from Randy's Hunting Center telling me they now had them back in stock and asking if I wanted one from them. Bad news though........ price went up to $669.00 but, that includes shipping to your dealer and a free knife.
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Old October 17, 2007, 10:19 PM   #153
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Price and Availability

Thanks for the update. Price for a 340 and the $$ to benefit ratio makes it a a real winner in my book. It's my favorite modern wheel gun.
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Old October 19, 2007, 03:45 PM   #154
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M&p 340 Ct

Review of M&P 340 CT with photos on my blog under the posting entitled "Thoughts on Concealed Carry". The blog can be found at www.randysrangereport.blogspot.com.
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Old October 19, 2007, 11:34 PM   #155
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Colt1903

That is a fair assessment of the 340. If it were six rounds it would be qualite superior. As it is, it's a "26" and I wouldn't disagree.

Great Blog site. Excellent reporting and historical information. You have excellent tast in handguns.

Why beat yourself up with .357 when +P is there, I agree.

Today was the first day I ranged out some .357 SGD 135 gr for short barrel. I really thought it would be more brutalizing than it was. The follow-ups were reasonable and recoil lift was no more than 1.5 inches in assessing a fellow shooter.
I checked for crimp jump and none was evidenced.

I am approaching a hundred and fifty rounds and am still thrilled.

Thanks for reporting in at the 340 Club and we hope to hear from you often.
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Old October 19, 2007, 11:42 PM   #156
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Thanks Mr. Adams. The three .357's I did shoot were Cor-Bon's an aside from being painful I was surprised at the accuracy.
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Old October 20, 2007, 02:27 AM   #157
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Quote:
Today was the first day I ranged out some .357 SGD 135 gr for short barrel. I really thought it would be more brutalizing than it was. The follow-ups were reasonable and recoil lift was no more than 1.5 inches in assessing a fellow shooter.
So, as long as we're discussing shooting .357 mags in an ultralight weight revolver,
maybe we should spend some time on technique.
(Relevant to .38 spl +p, too, but even more so with .357 mag.)

DA and others, what tips can you offer those shooting these ultralight, punk mules to tame their recoil ferocity?

It seems that technique would be especially important, including attention to subtle details of grip (including hand/finger placement), muscle contraction v. relaxation (how stiff should one's arm be in order to best dissipate recoil & lift), flinch control, etc.

Any thoughts?

Nem
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Old October 20, 2007, 02:34 AM   #158
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Jerry Miculek shows how to hold a small J-frame revolver.
http://shootingusa.com/PRO_TIPS/MICULEK2/miculek2.html
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Old October 20, 2007, 07:47 PM   #159
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Smile Just bought a 340ct

Went to what has been "called" the world's largest gunshow today in Tulsa,Ok. Searched long and hard only to not find one. Saw only one M&P 340but was set on the laser. Left kinda sad but called a local dealer and they fixed me right up. $812.00 plus tax. I don't know if that was a great price but I AM HAPPY! Are they hard to find???? Dealer said they had just got this one in last week. Looking forward to shooting it next week and must say the posts I read on this awesome site were partly responsible for me deciding to buy one. Thanks and best regards................
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Old October 20, 2007, 08:03 PM   #160
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hillaryisabum: Are you an experienced shooter--revolver shooter? If not, I recommend you start out with a light load with the M&P340. The first PD round I selected was the Federal 38Spl (NOT +P) 110-gr. load. That's livable as you learn to shoot this pistol. I've now worked up to the GDSB135-gr. 38+P factory PD round, and that's where I will stay.

I suggest this based not only on my own experience, but on hearing about a gun club friend who just picked up a used M&P340--truly LNIB. It was traded in after the original buyer shot one cylinderful of .357s in it--that's five rounds, and he got rid of it.

AFAICT, you got a very good price on your package--was that with the S&W-logo CT grips (i.e., from S&W), or do they have the CT logo (installed by the dealer, I would think)? Doesn't matter--they're the same product, but the former has a bit more penache, some think.

At any rate, congrats on your purchase.

Jim H.
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Old October 20, 2007, 08:28 PM   #161
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Lightweight J Frames

Quote:
DA and others, what tips can you offer those shooting these ultralight, punk mules to tame their recoil ferocity?
Nem-Very good question and I would like to get back to this interrogative more in -depth when ample time permits. I will say this. Those of us who only recently have been shooting the lightweight J Frames, 360s and 340s have a couple benefits that our predecessors did not have. Specialty ammunitions like the .357 short barrel and BB products. It also doesn't hurt to have a handfull of Hogue Monogrip to reign in "the beast".
Maybe the hype had me expecting a crushing blow, a handshake with Hulk Hogan or something akin. It just wasn't that bad compared to +P.
The accuracy was good, and follow-up shots were expeditious. I'll post a picture of two shooters, myself and a newbie to revolvers and first time shooter of a M&P 340. Excellent accuracy with the big dot Trijicons at 25 feet. The 340 stacks like my 642 so once you get used to that its the same drill. Aim, get to the stack point, adjust aim and fire. Pics to follow.
Next...back to the 405CTs with the same round. I imagine FR and recovery will be a different story. BTW there was no crimp jump with the .357 SGD 135s. Checked two cylinders.
You want brutal? We went from 340 to PM9 with Plus P to Seecamp 380. The newbie quit the Seecamp after two rounds of 95 gr SGD. I lasted one magazine of 6 + 1 and was done, now that IS brutal.

HIAB-
Welcome aboard.
That's a good price for a CT rigged 340. They are somewhat scarce but they are out there and with some patience I see no reason that one could not land one in 30 days with some diligence. My LGS is due another soon.
jfh offers sound counsel. Start with standard .38spl and work up. I don't feel anything greater than Plus P is necessary for personal defense. Shooting the .357 rounds is more an educational exercise than anything.

Quote:
they're the same product, but the former has a bit more penache, some think.
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Old October 20, 2007, 08:40 PM   #162
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JFH, I have been around guns my whole life but I would not call myself a marksman. I have shot my 642 with +P ammo on two different occasions and so your ammo advise is strongly noted. Did not even buy any .357 ammo today for that reason. Will shoot it with non +P at the range to save a few dollars. I am sure I will eventually have to try the "big" stuff someday. Kinda broke after this purchase anyway. If it had not have been for this forum I would NOT have known about the S&W logo being on the laser grip only if it were bought from Smith & Wesson that way and this gun does have them. I made sure of that. Thanks for your advise, Richard.
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Old October 20, 2007, 09:18 PM   #163
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Good enough, hillaryisabum. As I have commented here in various forums, this is my first foray into serious revolver PD shooting. I even bought a 640 for additional practice and (re)load development. However, like you, I'm generally a lifetime shooter.

I've now shot about 3500 rounds through the 640, and perhaps 450 or so through the 340, testing various 38+P recipes to find a "replica load" for the Speer 38+P 135-gr PD load. Today I finally got a chance to do the first comprehensive chrono testing of these loads--4 powders, 3 bullets, two cartridges (also a "357 lite" replica load for that Speer 38+P load)--and it is paying off.

I still have to analyse data, but it looks like one can build practice ammo for about 11 cents a round with a 140LTC bullet, or about 23 cents a round using the Speer GDSB 135-gr JHP bullets. It will feel exactly like the factory round--which, around here, costs about $1.00 a round.

More on this topic later--three hours with a chrono today has left me with brain fade.

Jim H.
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Old October 23, 2007, 10:58 AM   #164
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M&P 340 and 357 Rounds

I finally had an opportunity to put some .357 Speer Gold Dot 135 gr for short barrel through the 340.

This was a much anticipated event and one that had built up an almost legendary expectation.

Would it feel like my hand was slammed in a car door? A sledge hammering?

Maybe it was the round but I found it not unlike the .38 Plus P. I stood off to the side of my fellow shooter to observe the muzzle rise and it appeared to be no more than two inches, perhaps less. I doubt that follow-up rounds would be effected significantly compared to the SGD 135 plus P.

I checked two cylinders for "crimp jump" and there was none. All five rounds in two cylinders launched successfully.

The next test will include putting the CT 405 grips back on, but with the Hogue monogrips the recoil was very manageable and not painful. I would not hestitate to make the GD 357 135 gr for short barrels a carry load.

Your experience may vary.



This was 25 feet with the .357. The Tritium sighting dot on this is right on when the shooter does their part.

We also ran 30 Remington UMC 38. spl 130 gr FMJ as a warm-up.
I think this puts the total round count on the 340 at about 350 including standard pressure, plus p and now .357.
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Old October 24, 2007, 06:45 PM   #165
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Smile Help a newbie?

Going to the range on Friday to shoot my new 340. There was no Speers .357GDHP 135gr. short barrel ammo to be had in Tulsa so I bought some Speers 357 125gr. "law enforcement". Will there be a difference in recoil of that ammo vs. the stuff I could not find? Bought some hopps "elite" to clean the gun. Any cleaning advice?Thanks in advance, Richard.
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Old October 24, 2007, 08:43 PM   #166
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Hiab

Hoppes Elite is what S&W recommends on the exterior DLC finish of the 340. It is a preservative, anticorrosive, and lubricant. You may want to use a cleaner for swabbing out the barrel. Outers Tri-Care that comes with the cleaning kits seems to be aggressive enough for the barrel and cylinder yet not harm the finish. I try to keep it in the barrel only though. I will sparingly use Breakfree on a swab or patch to run through the cylinder and barrel for cleaning.

Shooting. I would work my way up. Get some .38 spl, Winchester or Remington FMJ from WalMart and put some of it through first to get the feel.

Get some 38 spl Plus P, bulk 125 gr semi JKTD Remington boxes of 100 are around or, if you can find the Speer Gold Dot 135 in 38 spl Plus P that works, you may find it to be your favorite carry round.

Try some .357 of any kind. Winchester or Remington from Wally is fine although perhaps not the optimal carry round if you decide the .357 to your liking. Federal Premium Hydra-Shok may be around in 158 gr JHP at you LGS, I save that for my L Frame.

Again the revolver is rated for 38 spl, 38 spl plus P and .357 with no rating restriction. You may find the later "stout". Someone said like slamming your hand with a baseball bat. Speer 125 LE, I have no experience with them, but they won't hurt your 340 so give them a shot.

On the .357s you may want to shoot 3, check the 4th and 5th round for "crimp jump". It is the bullet seperating from the casing which could cause the cylinder to "jam" or "lock-up". Shoot, the 4th and see if the 5th is still ok. This seems to be prevalent on the Sc/Ti series as opposed to the 340 with the stainless cylinder and two more ounces to "shock absorb". I have not heard this reported on a M&P 340.

This will not happen with any of the .38 or .38 plus P. I have tried many versions of those manufactured by many vendors.


Let us know what you think.
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Last edited by DAdams; October 24, 2007 at 09:51 PM.
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Old October 25, 2007, 01:16 PM   #167
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Does anyone shoot mainly lead rounds from their M&P 340? If you do, do you have a problem with lead build-up on the cylinder spindle which causes the cylinder to nearly bind?

I shoot mainly lead and about every 200 rounds or so I have to take the cylinder out and clean the spindle. If I fail to do this the cylinder will eventually bind so much that the trigger pull is probably over 20 lbs. It's no real problem to clean, but I was wondering if anyone else had the same problem. As soon as I clean the spindle, relubricate and put the cyliner back in the weapon everything returns to normal.

I have begun using wadcutters instead of heavier LSWC rounds. The change in bullet weights and lengths seems to have helped the problem, but it's still present. Any suggestions as to the cause or cure, or both would be appreciated.
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Old October 25, 2007, 03:40 PM   #168
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brassman,
I don't shoot lead in my M&P340,but I've had that problem with other guns I don't think its uncommon.I started using rainier plated bullets, they're not that much more than cast.
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Old October 25, 2007, 09:42 PM   #169
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B'Man

No experience along those lines.
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Old October 25, 2007, 10:18 PM   #170
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Brassman: I've been shooting both JHPs and Lead (140LTC-.357, 140LRNFP-.358) from my M&P 340. I have had the binding you refer to. However, I had not traced it to lead per se yet; just to shooting 'grunge.'

My 340 shows no sign of spitting with the lead bullets of either diameter, either. I've been successful in freeing up the cylinder operation simply with B&C gun scrubber, followed by Elite oil or CLP, without removing the cylinder.

I'm a relative novice with revolvers, with no real long-term experience. The binding has not shown up yet in either my M60/3" or the 686P/4", nor on the 640/2".

Update, a day later: After shooting about 50 rounds of lead through my 340 yesterday, I noted some binding--and deliberately did not clean it. Today I resumed my chrono tests--and throughout twenty rounds of lead reloads, the binding progressively worsened to the point of being unable to pull the trigger. I'll clean it tonight--and I think I will call S&W about this on Monday. I don't understand why the 340 should be binding, but the SS guns (640, 60) show no such problem at all. I know the 640 has about 250 rounds, maybe 300 through it, and the 60, perhaps 100 to 125.

FWIW, a good powder for reloading to 38+P or 357 Mag GDSB135 specs looks like Vitavourhi 3N37. I did some development runs today, and that powder clocked in at 916 to 1012--those are averages for a cylinderful--with an SD as low as 5.3 in the 640. FWIW, my 640 and 340 average just over 900 with the factory 38+P GDSB135JHP PD loads, and I note that Speer thinks that the optimum GDSB velocities are about 850-1000 fps.

Still analyzing the data.

Jim H.

Last edited by jfh; October 26, 2007 at 06:40 PM. Reason: added 340 update info.
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Old October 26, 2007, 07:44 AM   #171
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I'll try the gun scrubber. I have not been using any since I wasn't sure how the finish would react to it. I have another brand than B&C, but I'm at school right now and can't think of the manufacturer. It sprays on and dries nearly instantly. I used it on my 642 and it took the clear coat finish off. That's the reason that I've stayed away from it on the 340. When I get time I'll pick up a can of the B&C scrubber and give it a try. Thanks Jim.
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Old October 26, 2007, 10:03 AM   #172
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When I bought the M&P340, I called S&W to confirm cleaning products, and I verified the Hoppe's "Elite" product line. I don't remember asking them about Gun Scrubber, though--and my stuff is about ten to fifteen years old, so it probably is not the latest formulation. However, AFAICT it has had absolutely no effect on the DLC finish.

For the cylinder binding, I carefullly dribble it on to the rod/bushings at the front, lean it up, and let it sit to seep down the shaft. Work the cylinder, reapply as needed, then finish up with minimal amounts of CLP dropped on the bushings and shaft at the front.

I did it this way because I had not figured out how to remove the cylinder from the shaft yet. Removing the crane assembly is easy, of course, and I've done that when I want to better clean the cylinder exterior.

I tend to be one of those 'slob' types when it comes to cleaning--I spray Gun Scrubber in and on the frame and go to work with the nylon brush, followed by patches with CLP. I usually use the soft / cheaper brush, but I've found the Brownell's "extra firm" nylon brush works better at the barrel, forcing cone, etc.

Or, I use the Hoppe's cleaner. Since I've shot more lead recently, I also bought the Elite bore gel, but I have no opinion of that yet. Fortunately, leading has not really been an issue, I think.

I'll get around to posting a picture of the 340 one of these days. The finish is holding up well, but one can tell it is a carry gun (Mika pocket holster) and that I have been shooting lead as I've not used any of the lead-removal cloths.


For other shooters, particular older ones with less-than-good eyes:

On another subject--as my hand has gotten stronger, the problem I've had with the CT 405 recoil pocket tearing has abated. I'm not sure that my hand strength has anything directly to do with that problem (the second grip tore after five rounds)--but CT has taken care of me.

I cannot speak too favorably about the Crimson Trace grips for the J-frames; either one. First, the -405 / boot-grip model offers real help with recoil--and secondly, once you've habituated to its use, the accuracy is amazing. Essentially, I now point shoot, can do it with better accuracy than iron sights and a rest, and can do it faster. Further, the laser is the best training aid I have found--dry firing with the laser shows you the kind of bobbles your hand is doing, and live firing gives you instant feedback.

Now that I have figured out how to do those Speer 38+P GDSB135-gr. loads as lead bullet reloads costing about 12 cents a round, I am in heaven. I'll be able to go to an inside range this winter, save money, and still have my brass. It's the best of all worlds.

Jim H.
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Old October 26, 2007, 07:14 PM   #173
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The 340 lead-bullet-and-cylinder-bind problem.

See the comments in the preceding 4-5 posts, and note my "update" comment.

So I took the 340 to the bench--at this point the resistance to turning was strong, and consistent.

1. I sprayed Gun Scrubber on the fore end, at the spacer bushings and worked the extractor rod a few times to distribute the gun scrubber; I then sprayed under the extractor at the back end, and then I 'worked' the cylinder.

It freed up "noticably," but still with resistance. I repeated #1--freed up some more, but would not "freely turn" or spin by any means.

2. After two go-rounds of the above, I then added some CLP at the bushings and worked the rod again. It freed up some more, moving evenly--

3. So, I sprayed a good amount of Gun Scrubber in again, worked the rod, and it's now sitting.

I'm going to disassemble the rod / cylinder assembly to try to learn more and to see what the status is after the degunking-lubing routine outlined above. FWIW, I don't think the above procedure is "cleaning" the assembly, it merely gets it running again momentarily.

Jim H.
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Old October 27, 2007, 11:32 PM   #174
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update on cylinder binding.

I posted a query on this issue over on the S&W forums--first in "Revolvers"--but got little action; everyone seems to be ooohing and aaaaahing over the latest purchase of an original 15 for $75.00. So I reposted it in reloading, and got a few good tips.

It is just a cleaning issue--on the ejector / cylinder assembly. I removed the yoike and disassemble it, cleaned everything, and reassembled. It now spins freer than when I first bought it.

As for the reason this is showing up on the M&P 340s, it apparently is just tight specs on this particular model. One respondee in the S&W / Reloading link commented on the problems he used to have with a K-38 being the same way. His impression is that it is just grunge, not necessarily lead, Brassman.

For cleaning, I started with Gun Scrubber and bronze and nylon brushes. I used Hoppe's Elite Bore Gel on the cylinder and frame for the leading. It worked pretty well, and there was no damage to the DLC finish.

For learning the disassembly / assembly procedure, I used Kuehnhausen's S&W Revolver's Manual, J.B. Wood's pictorial on S&W revolvers in the Gun Digest Assembly / Disassembly Manual, and a J-Frame schematic from Smith & Wesson that I found at Brownell's. If you're mechanically inclined, and if you know that the ejector rod is reverse-threaded, then you could probably get by with just the schematic.

Jim H.
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Old October 28, 2007, 04:21 PM   #175
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Smile Range Report

Shot my new 340CT. What a great gun. Thank you Dadams and to JFH for your ammo and cleaning advice. Bullet hit the spot where the laser ended up after trigger pull. 25 yard shots were in the kill zone most of the time. IMO,very accurate gun for it's barrel length. Laser really helps!

Started out with FMJ about 50 rounds or so which were a pleasure to shoot.
Went to Speer 135 GDHP,also a pleasure. Then went to .357 and that was nasty. Ten rounds of that was all I cared to abuse myself with. Just one .357 round was enough for my "macho" weight lifting son. Could not imagine how loud that would be w/o ear protection. Gun packs a punch which doesn't really hurt it, is jusy very uncomfortable with .357. Anyone know the decibel difference for .38+P vs. .357?

In conclusion ,.357 ammo is fun every now and then and I do have it in the gun right now for CC. Firing ten rounds or so in a row are tolarable, but if you can stand any more than that you are a better man than me. Fireball is impressive to see and I can imagine if you ever had to shoot that gun in a public place everyone around you would hit the ground for one reason or another. Gun was easy to clean because I did mostly fire FMJ. I will hang on to this great CC weapon. Light and easy to put in your pocket, accurate enough to defend yourself and packs a wallop! But you all already new that.

Best regards, Richard.
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