Guns to play all of the games

**Brian Williams** · January 11, 2003, 09:33 AM

Hey guys please list and add to a needed but not duplicating a list of guns to PLAY the gun games i.e. IDPA, IPSC, HIGHPOWER, Silouette, etc

I am not talking the race versions of the games just to play. You could use a AR to shoot highpower but it would not work for ???

MY IDPA guns are
S&W 13
Glock 19
Systema colt 45

Steve Smith · January 11, 2003, 06:42 PM

Well, I wrote a lot, but then decided that trying to detail every rule and how they preclude you from using "one gun" I just gave up. Competition is what it is, and "shared use" competition guns just makes you really annoyed with your "compromise gun." Instead, I would highly suggest you go to a match or two of the types you're interested in, and watch. More than likely, you'll be invited to participate with someone else's gun. Most Highpower clubs have "club guns" for new folks that you can rent for a nominal fee. Once you've shot some matches, you'll know what to focus on.

I will say this, the handgun sports are much cheaper than rifle sports on the whole, and IDPA is one of the cheapest handun sports (excluding indoor Smallbore and airgun). Rimfire Silhouette is also cheap, comparatively.

Andrew Wyatt · January 11, 2003, 07:49 PM

Well, as far as pistol sports go, a decent carry pistol such as a colt commander with a beveled magazine well, high visibilty fixed sights, and a larger safety if you think you need one will work well.

An m-1a NM would be a good cross discipline weapon, with enough accuracy for Highpower rifle use and whatnot, and legality for most 3-gun type stuff.

an 870 with an extention and sidesaddle or butt cuff and choke tubes would work for 3 gun and the clay games.

Captal_de_Buch · January 12, 2003, 09:28 AM

Aaahh..
One of my favorite subjects, what guns can I buy that will “cross dress” easily form one shooting discipline to another, therefore saving me a ton of money.

Here’s a short list of what I came up with.

#1 – Glock 17. Works perfect, as is, for IDPA. Works perfect, as is, for a Production gun in IPSC/USPSA. Works perfect, as is, for GSSF.

#2 – Any unmodified Single Stack 1911. Works perfect, as is, for IDPA. Works perfect with 10 round mags for a Limited 10 gun in IPSC/USPSA.

#3 – Any AR15 in standard service rifle configuration, which is A2 sights, fixed handle, 20 inch un-fluted barrel. Like this - http://www.bushmaster.com/shopping/weapons/pcwa2s20.asp Works perfect, as is, for IPSC/USPSA 3 gun matches in Limited Class. Works perfect, as is, in NRA Hi-Power Service Rifle class.

And, I almost forgot.

#4 - Any Remington 870 or 1100 with screw in choke tubes. Works perfect, with a mag extension, for 3 gun.
Works perfect, as is, for Skeet and Trap.

Just my 2 cents..

Your humble 14th Century Mercenary
Captal de Buch

Steve Smith · January 13, 2003, 10:22 PM

FWIW, I disagree with the above poster about using a Highpower grade gun for IPSC. While the gun itself would do quite well in the sport, I dare you to use any of my HP competition guns to shoot a fast paced IPSC match. The result would be a knock-down drag-out the likes you have never seen. I don't let my comp guns get hot.

Andrew Wyatt · January 14, 2003, 03:23 PM

Most 3-gun courses of fire that i'm aware of for rifles don't have more than 15 rounds, and that's often spread out over a minute or two.

At the Swat Magazine 3-gun match, the rifle stages are actually rifle stages, instead of pistol courses fired with rifles, so they're generally not barrel burners.

Correia · January 14, 2003, 03:35 PM

I see Steve's point. In Andrew's match that may be true, but many 3 gun matches have extreamly high rifle count stages. Usually you will see one long range, one medium range, and one short range stage. The short range stage will usually be CQB style stuff with tons of targets hot and fast.

Daniel Flory · January 14, 2003, 04:29 PM

The biggest round count in a 3-gun match I participated in was 85 rounds for a single stage!

Steve Smith · January 14, 2003, 08:03 PM

Ok, Andrew, here's another reason you won't see any of my HP guns at an IPSC match. My HP guns are just that. Every round down their barrels should better my performance and provide feedback for my HP game. No way am I going to "waste" my match barrels on a 100 yard or less match. For that, I'll use a carbine (aka 100 or less yard gun). (Can't wait to get home so I can play with my new Cav Arms 16" carbine!)

Jon Coppenbarger · January 14, 2003, 09:09 PM

your cav arms is very nice but it kinda stopped functioning at about the 2,300 round mark? could just need to be cleaned as it was really windy and alot of dust on sunday. it kinda wanted to stop after about 1,500 but a good dose of wd-40 down the barrel and in the action it it seemed to work ok for another couple of mags. I really like the weight of it as its nice but even the lower kinda got hot after bump fireing it so much. I wonder what kind of finish they use on the barrel as it sure smoked when it got to hot to touch.

when it kinda froze up, you know thats what I said it looked like but earl and the other guys said it looked like something much worse but after banging it on the bench alot of times to free the bolt up I just gave up on it as I did not want to have to clean it as I know you like to clean your own rifles.

hey hows ca. anyway.
your friend jon

Andrew Wyatt · January 14, 2003, 11:10 PM

IIRC, this thread is about Cross discipline weapons, not about using your Highpower guns on ipsc courses.

Captal_de_Buch · January 15, 2003, 07:35 PM

I guess I'm being a "bad person" by using both my pre-ban Colt and post ban Bushy in both Service Rifle Class in High Power and as a Limited Gun in 3 gun and "Run and Gun".

Your humble "bad person" 14th century mercenary
Captal de Buch

**Brian Williams** · January 15, 2003, 07:59 PM

Remember Guys this is a thread about the novice shooter who wants to try as many games a possible with out speciallizing in this gun only for Highpower and that only for 3 gun.

Captal_de_Buch he came up with a good list but left out the Revolvers!!!!

Jon Coppenbarger · January 15, 2003, 08:29 PM

sorry you are right I get caught up in my highpower thinking sometimes.

its hard to get one rifle to do all you wish and as another poster said and its a great ideal is that with a ar15 all you need is one lower and you can get several uppers to fit what ever sport you want to compete in. not sure about about some of them but you could cover a few of them anyway.

sorry if I was on my soapbox as I have under in alot of stress lately. sorry again as you guys gave some good answers.

thanks and if anyone is here in colorado and needs any help on highpower I will give free leasons on any aspect of it you wish. thanks jon

Steve Smith · January 15, 2003, 10:20 PM

Sorry, guys, but let me try to explain why I said what I did. First off, Perfessr, the original poster, put HP in all caps, and I took it that he was especially interested in that. In addition, HP is a 1 MOA at 600 yard sport. If all the sports he listed were close range "tactical target" or silhouette target sports, then I wouldn't have said what I did. It just seems to me that if you shoot a bullet hose and then expect to shoot wings off of flies at 600 yards, you're hoping for too much. Yes, of course you can (Webster's definition of "can") shoot a high-grade HP gun as fast as you can pull the trigger, and you can do it with beta-c mags if you want. Where I come from, that's called throwing good money after bad. Even most bargain HP uppers have the capability of taking a guy or girl to Master class (I know this is true with the RRA!) Why would you cut off your nose to spite you face by shooting a gun like that at 10 MOA targets at 25 yards? While the initial investment of two uppers IS more, the long term benefit and savings outweigh it considerably.

Captal_de_Buch · January 17, 2003, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Captal_de_Buch he came up with a good list but left out the Revolvers!!!!

GASP!!!

Oh.. The Humanity!!!

How could I forget the Ruger GP100 and S&W 686 both in 4 inch.

AS is, with tons of speedloaders and a belt with tons of speed loader clips, perfect for IPSC/USPSA Revolver class.

AS is with 3 speedloaders in your right hand vest pocket, perfect for IDPA.

After I get C class in Limited I'm going for C class in Revolver with a well used GP100.

Does anyone else keep their speed loaders in the right had pocket when they reload revolvers in IDPA?? Or is this another thing that I learned how to do wrong..??.. It just seems natural for me to hold the cylinder on my left had, pushing the rod with my left index finger while a grab a speed loader with my right hand and "toss" the rounds in the cylinder... It's fast that way..

January 13, 2003, 10:22 PM	#5
Steve Smith Moderator Emeritus Join Date: December 21, 2002 Location: Southeastern US Posts: 4,402	FWIW, I disagree with the above poster about using a Highpower grade gun for IPSC. While the gun itself would do quite well in the sport, I dare you to use any of my HP competition guns to shoot a fast paced IPSC match. The result would be a knock-down drag-out the likes you have never seen. I don't let my comp guns get hot. __________________ I'm strapped like a car seat. TFL Alumnus, THR Plankowner, NRA Life Member

January 14, 2003, 04:29 PM	#8
Daniel Flory Member Join Date: December 25, 2002 Posts: 3,741	The biggest round count in a 3-gun match I participated in was 85 rounds for a single stage! __________________ A major source of objection to a free economy is precisely that it ... gives people what they want instead of what a particular group thinks they ought to want. Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. -Milton Friedman

January 14, 2003, 08:03 PM	#9
Steve Smith Moderator Emeritus Join Date: December 21, 2002 Location: Southeastern US Posts: 4,402	Ok, Andrew, here's another reason you won't see any of my HP guns at an IPSC match. My HP guns are just that. Every round down their barrels should better my performance and provide feedback for my HP game. No way am I going to "waste" my match barrels on a 100 yard or less match. For that, I'll use a carbine (aka 100 or less yard gun). (Can't wait to get home so I can play with my new Cav Arms 16" carbine!) __________________ I'm strapped like a car seat. TFL Alumnus, THR Plankowner, NRA Life Member

January 15, 2003, 07:35 PM	#12
Captal_de_Buch Member Join Date: December 29, 2002 Posts: 86	I guess I'm being a "bad person" by using both my pre-ban Colt and post ban Bushy in both Service Rifle Class in High Power and as a Limited Gun in 3 gun and "Run and Gun". Your humble "bad person" 14th century mercenary Captal de Buch __________________ Addicted to 3 gun

January 15, 2003, 07:59 PM	#13
Brian Williams Moderator Join Date: December 22, 2002 Location: Lancaster, PA Posts: 7,351	Remember Guys this is a thread about the novice shooter who wants to try as many games a possible with out speciallizing in this gun only for Highpower and that only for 3 gun. Captal_de_Buch he came up with a good list but left out the Revolvers!!!! __________________ Watch out for the Stobor No trees were harmed in the production of this message. However, a rather large number of Electrons and Magnetic Particles were somewhat inconvenienced.

January 11, 2003, 09:33 AM	#1
Brian Williams Moderator Join Date: December 22, 2002 Location: Lancaster, PA Posts: 7,351	Guns to play all of the games Hey guys please list and add to a needed but not duplicating a list of guns to PLAY the gun games i.e. IDPA, IPSC, HIGHPOWER, Silouette, etc I am not talking the race versions of the games just to play. You could use a AR to shoot highpower but it would not work for ??? MY IDPA guns are S&W 13 Glock 19 Systema colt 45 __________________ Watch out for the Stobor No trees were harmed in the production of this message. However, a rather large number of Electrons and Magnetic Particles were somewhat inconvenienced.

January 11, 2003, 06:42 PM	#2
Steve Smith Moderator Emeritus Join Date: December 21, 2002 Location: Southeastern US Posts: 4,402	Well, I wrote a lot, but then decided that trying to detail every rule and how they preclude you from using "one gun" I just gave up. Competition is what it is, and "shared use" competition guns just makes you really annoyed with your "compromise gun." Instead, I would highly suggest you go to a match or two of the types you're interested in, and watch. More than likely, you'll be invited to participate with someone else's gun. Most Highpower clubs have "club guns" for new folks that you can rent for a nominal fee. Once you've shot some matches, you'll know what to focus on. I will say this, the handgun sports are much cheaper than rifle sports on the whole, and IDPA is one of the cheapest handun sports (excluding indoor Smallbore and airgun). Rimfire Silhouette is also cheap, comparatively. __________________ I'm strapped like a car seat. TFL Alumnus, THR Plankowner, NRA Life Member

January 11, 2003, 07:49 PM	#3
Andrew Wyatt Member Join Date: December 25, 2002 Location: Bakersfield, California Posts: 3,546	Well, as far as pistol sports go, a decent carry pistol such as a colt commander with a beveled magazine well, high visibilty fixed sights, and a larger safety if you think you need one will work well. An m-1a NM would be a good cross discipline weapon, with enough accuracy for Highpower rifle use and whatnot, and legality for most 3-gun type stuff. an 870 with an extention and sidesaddle or butt cuff and choke tubes would work for 3 gun and the clay games.

January 12, 2003, 09:28 AM	#4
Captal_de_Buch Member Join Date: December 29, 2002 Posts: 86	Aaahh.. One of my favorite subjects, what guns can I buy that will “cross dress” easily form one shooting discipline to another, therefore saving me a ton of money. Here’s a short list of what I came up with. #1 – Glock 17. Works perfect, as is, for IDPA. Works perfect, as is, for a Production gun in IPSC/USPSA. Works perfect, as is, for GSSF. #2 – Any unmodified Single Stack 1911. Works perfect, as is, for IDPA. Works perfect with 10 round mags for a Limited 10 gun in IPSC/USPSA. #3 – Any AR15 in standard service rifle configuration, which is A2 sights, fixed handle, 20 inch un-fluted barrel. Like this - http://www.bushmaster.com/shopping/weapons/pcwa2s20.asp Works perfect, as is, for IPSC/USPSA 3 gun matches in Limited Class. Works perfect, as is, in NRA Hi-Power Service Rifle class. And, I almost forgot. #4 - Any Remington 870 or 1100 with screw in choke tubes. Works perfect, with a mag extension, for 3 gun. Works perfect, as is, for Skeet and Trap. Just my 2 cents.. Your humble 14th Century Mercenary Captal de Buch __________________ Addicted to 3 gun

January 14, 2003, 03:23 PM	#6
Andrew Wyatt Member Join Date: December 25, 2002 Location: Bakersfield, California Posts: 3,546	Most 3-gun courses of fire that i'm aware of for rifles don't have more than 15 rounds, and that's often spread out over a minute or two. At the Swat Magazine 3-gun match, the rifle stages are actually rifle stages, instead of pistol courses fired with rifles, so they're generally not barrel burners.

January 14, 2003, 03:35 PM	#7
Correia Moderator Emeritus Join Date: December 20, 2002 Location: SLC Posts: 10,346	I see Steve's point. In Andrew's match that may be true, but many 3 gun matches have extreamly high rifle count stages. Usually you will see one long range, one medium range, and one short range stage. The short range stage will usually be CQB style stuff with tons of targets hot and fast.

January 14, 2003, 09:09 PM	#10
Jon Coppenbarger Member Join Date: December 25, 2002 Location: co Posts: 789	your cav arms is very nice but it kinda stopped functioning at about the 2,300 round mark? could just need to be cleaned as it was really windy and alot of dust on sunday. it kinda wanted to stop after about 1,500 but a good dose of wd-40 down the barrel and in the action it it seemed to work ok for another couple of mags. I really like the weight of it as its nice but even the lower kinda got hot after bump fireing it so much. I wonder what kind of finish they use on the barrel as it sure smoked when it got to hot to touch. when it kinda froze up, you know thats what I said it looked like but earl and the other guys said it looked like something much worse but after banging it on the bench alot of times to free the bolt up I just gave up on it as I did not want to have to clean it as I know you like to clean your own rifles. hey hows ca. anyway. your friend jon

January 14, 2003, 11:10 PM	#11
Andrew Wyatt Member Join Date: December 25, 2002 Location: Bakersfield, California Posts: 3,546	IIRC, this thread is about Cross discipline weapons, not about using your Highpower guns on ipsc courses.

January 15, 2003, 08:29 PM	#14
Jon Coppenbarger Member Join Date: December 25, 2002 Location: co Posts: 789	sorry you are right I get caught up in my highpower thinking sometimes. its hard to get one rifle to do all you wish and as another poster said and its a great ideal is that with a ar15 all you need is one lower and you can get several uppers to fit what ever sport you want to compete in. not sure about about some of them but you could cover a few of them anyway. sorry if I was on my soapbox as I have under in alot of stress lately. sorry again as you guys gave some good answers. thanks and if anyone is here in colorado and needs any help on highpower I will give free leasons on any aspect of it you wish. thanks jon

January 15, 2003, 10:20 PM	#15
Steve Smith Moderator Emeritus Join Date: December 21, 2002 Location: Southeastern US Posts: 4,402	Sorry, guys, but let me try to explain why I said what I did. First off, Perfessr, the original poster, put HP in all caps, and I took it that he was especially interested in that. In addition, HP is a 1 MOA at 600 yard sport. If all the sports he listed were close range "tactical target" or silhouette target sports, then I wouldn't have said what I did. It just seems to me that if you shoot a bullet hose and then expect to shoot wings off of flies at 600 yards, you're hoping for too much. Yes, of course you can (Webster's definition of "can") shoot a high-grade HP gun as fast as you can pull the trigger, and you can do it with beta-c mags if you want. Where I come from, that's called throwing good money after bad. Even most bargain HP uppers have the capability of taking a guy or girl to Master class (I know this is true with the RRA!) Why would you cut off your nose to spite you face by shooting a gun like that at 10 MOA targets at 25 yards? While the initial investment of two uppers IS more, the long term benefit and savings outweigh it considerably. __________________ I'm strapped like a car seat. TFL Alumnus, THR Plankowner, NRA Life Member

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