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Old April 19, 2010, 11:46 AM   #2526
Foto Joe
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It's kinda like ridin' a chopper, you'd better be ready to work on it!!

Well...I had the opportunity to introduce Mr. Walker to my brother-in-law yesterday. I wish I'd have had a video running the first time he pulled the trigger, I think he about wet himself. (He's one of those smokeless people, but I think he might be coming around)

Unfortunately we did have some mechanical issues. The most irritating one being the caps. This is an ASM with what I assume are factory nipples. I use CCI #11's as that is what I have been finding the most of in my travels.

The problem is that: I can't really depend on the "BOOM" every time the hammer drops. Even when I do get the nipples on well enough to get the desired effect, recoil appears to be knocking unfired caps loose or off. A chain fire on a Walker isn't something I'm ready to experience, if ever.

I'm loading 50gr 3f with a .454 ball and I DON'T want to pinch the caps, I just feel like if I find the right combination I shouldn't have to. Also, I feel like a pinched cap is likely to leave a slight gap on each side of the cap setting me up for the situation mentioned in the paragraph above, chain fire.

My Dragoon is also an ASM and I note a vast difference in the "hammer pull" between the two, the Dragoon feels like its got a lot stronger spring. Also the nipples on the Dragoon are original as far as I know but they like CCI #10's and nothing else. The date of manufacture on these two is quite different though. The Dragoon being a 1977 and the Walker being a 1992, so I imagine that things changed a bit during those years even though they should have the same nipples. I haven't tried exchanging them.

Give me your ideas guys, I'm looking at ordering new nipples for the Walker. It would be great if I could avoid changing to Remington caps, but who knows they may work just as well on my other guns, I just don't have the experience yet to really know.

By the way: We were at a friends "Cabin" in Michigan that has ten acres. We originally set the target (an 8 1/2 x 11 piece of paper) at 110 yards on the other side of his pond. POA and POI were dead on in elevation but a little shaky on windage. I challenged our friend to make that shot with his .45 ACP but he just shook his head when 4 holes appeared in the paper from the Walker at that range, he said something about not wanting to embarass himself. I don't blame him, I wouldn't have put money on an open sight handgun hitting that either, at least until I picked up a Walker.
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Old April 19, 2010, 09:15 PM   #2527
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Change the nipples use TRESSO. if you have to fire twice on the same nipple. Well its a problem with the nipples as they may be getting mushroomed. A new set of nipples will ensure the caps stay on. Another trick i do along with the treso nipples. IS Grease. a small dab of vasoline or something. around the nipples. They will make the caps stick to the nipples. However your problem is with fitment and making sure you get a good fitment.
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Old April 19, 2010, 09:20 PM   #2528
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Quote:
Curious why you went with an R&D instead of a Kirst? I have an R&D for my ROA. Love it. However, for my Walker I'd probably seriously look into a Kirst with a load gate.
Simple. i have an 1858 that i got a kirst for with loading gate. did the whole 9 yards and it looks great. However i bought an R&D for two reasons. 1 the R&D with the massive size fits great on a walker. the chambers align very good with the barrel. much better than on an 1858. On my 1858 i went with kirst its a 5 shot but being a 5 shot the cylinder align with the barrel better than the R&D. The R&D cylinders go in at an angle to the barrel. then the webbing is a lot smaller on the R&D as it was not designed to be a 6 shot shooting 45 colt. Now the Kirst would also be very good. I just did not want to modify my gun to shoot 45 colt. My Walker looks like a regular Walker until i change the cylinder and shoot another 6 rounds with my 45 colt.
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Old April 19, 2010, 11:44 PM   #2529
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Foto Joe - I endorse scrat's advice to change to Treso nipples. The fact that caps fall off the unfired cylinders shows that the current nipples are not compatible with CCI No. 11 caps, and if you don't have any other caps to try, changing the nipples to Tresos is a step in the right direction.

However, it sure sounds like you have an inadequate mainspring, and that's probably the reason the caps aren't firing reliably. Unfortunately, you can't swap the Dragoon and Walker mainsprings to test that theory. You'll have to get a new one, probably from VTI Gun Parts.

Where in Michigan? If you're anywhere near Tawas or Oscoda, let me know in a PM. I'd be happy to take a look at the gun for you. And you'd get a chance to shoot at our ranges.
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Old April 20, 2010, 09:26 AM   #2530
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Quote:
However, it sure sounds like you have an inadequate mainspring, and that's probably the reason the caps aren't firing reliably. Unfortunately, you can't swap the Dragoon and Walker mainsprings to test that theory. You'll have to get a new one, probably from VTI Gun Parts.
Since we didn't get back from up north until around midnite, I didn't clean anything until the morning. I saved the Walker until last and did a complete dis-assembly. What I found was rather interesting.

When I pulled the hammer & hand out, they were accompanied by the remains of a cap. I suspect that part of my problem might be that cap fragment fouling the hammer. Usually on other guns when I get a cap foul it will be sitting right in the inside of the hammer and it will strike the frame padding the hammer. This one appears to have migrated itself down into the works. I can't say whether it was slowing the hammer fall or not, it just may have been sitting there minding its own business where it shouldn't have been.

I'm not real convinced about the weak mainspring (yet) since it's a totally different design than the later Colts, I'm much more suspicious of the nipples. I read a lot about people using Treso nipples on the forum but I haven't yet seen an explaination of why.

What are the advantages of Treso over Stainless Steel. Is it just personal preference?
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Old April 20, 2010, 10:25 AM   #2531
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foto Joe
What are the advantages of Treso over Stainless Steel. Is it just personal preference?
None that I'm aware of.

Tresco nipples have a smaller diameter flash hole that well reduce hammer blow back. I think many shooters use them because of the better cap fit.

I have over three dozen C&B shooters and only one has Tresco nipples. If I have a problem with caps fitting, and it's not uncommon, I take a file to the offending nipples. Mount the nipple in a drill and reshape as required.
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Old April 20, 2010, 07:05 PM   #2532
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When I pulled the hammer & hand out, they were accompanied by the remains of a cap. I suspect that part of my problem might be that cap fragment fouling the hammer. Usually on other guns when I get a cap foul it will be sitting right in the inside of the hammer and it will strike the frame padding the hammer. This one appears to have migrated itself down into the works. I can't say whether it was slowing the hammer fall or not, it just may have been sitting there minding its own business where it shouldn't have been.
Everytime i have had main spring problems it has been cap frags. i got so good on it that when i went on saturday it started acting up. So i just stripped it right there. I make sure i always take an old tooth brush and a bottle of warm water. so when i took it apart i cleaned it up removed frags. then put it back to gether. I usually get a lot of looks from everyone. even the range officers come a looking as they want to make sure they are not going to have problems on thier range. when i get it back together i check to make sure half cock, full cock work. The cylinder turns ok. gap between barrel and cylinder are ok. then i reload and shoot. after doing it a few times now nobody says anything they just let me be
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Old April 20, 2010, 11:04 PM   #2533
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If owning a walker means I can post here...well I just bought the rights.
I picked up a nice looking San Marco Walker. I have several other cap and ball pistols but always wanted a Walker to round out my fun.

Naturally I have already found a "stumper". I found that with .457 or 445 balls it shoots 5 inches high at 10 yards. I also varied the charge of Pyrodex from 28 to 60 grains. Same result. I know with a cartridge gun that heavier bullet weights take more time to exit the barrel allowing the muzzle rise to send them higher down range. Since one really cannot change the weight of the ball I figure I must use a taller front sight. Here are my questions: How does one remove the front sight? Are taller sights available? I found sights but in the drawing schematics they appear to be as low as the one one my gun. also, the sight doesn't appear to be soldiered, pinned or screwed in place. What is the secret?
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Old April 21, 2010, 09:23 AM   #2534
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Quote:
So i just stripped it right there. I usually get a lot of looks from everyone. even the range officers come a looking as they want to make sure they are not going to have problems on thier range.
I've found the same thing. Folks who shoot smokeless hardly if ever do a complete strip down even at home, let alone on the range. I've taken to carrying a "zip tie" that is pre-sized to compress the main spring. Before I pull the trigger guard/front strap I slide the "zip tie" up over the main spring to hold it down. Then when I re-assemble I don't have to wrestle with the thing with only two hands.

The other day I was getting more than my share of "cap jams". My wife and my sister-in-law both fired the Dragoon and had caps slide all the way down the hammer and gum up the works. The frags were getting into the back of the block and not allowing it to drop, that was a new one. That one shoots CCI #10's and I'm thinkin' that the batch was not of the best quality as I have never had that problem before with that gun.
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Old April 21, 2010, 05:38 PM   #2535
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Proper tools for the job:

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Old April 21, 2010, 06:30 PM   #2536
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Very nice i will take 2 of each
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Old April 21, 2010, 06:32 PM   #2537
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Member List
Scrat (Scott) 2 Gentleman of the Charcoal 3 Dixie Texian 4 Yankee John
5 Mykeal 6 Speckdds@bellsouth.net 7 Mukluk 8 BigBadGun 9 Mec 10Fineredmist
11HILDO 12Shanghai McCoy 13Tallship 14 A.WALKER 15 StrawHat
16 Mustanger1 17 Phantom Captain 18 Pulp19 Snaggletooth 20 RugerBob
21 J.T.Gerrity 22 BDFT 23 Peter M Eick 24 JCT 25 Old Wornout Soldier
26 Brett Dixon 27. Razorback 1010 28. Rebel Dave 29. sundance44s
30. Oddman 31. Xterminator 32. TexasRifleman 33. Gopguy 34. Elbert P Suggins
35. Old Hunter 36. Blacksmoke 37. ApacheJack 38. K.A.T 39. Fedaircop
40. Hooey 41. .50cal 42. Afy 43. Shung 44. Kevc 45. PRM 46. Madcratebuilder
47. Clermont 48. Double Deuce 1 49. Iamsniper1 50. AdmiralB 51. icy
52. SMOKIN GUN 53. QUICKDRAW Mc.Graw 54. SE olka.shooter 55. Jack Steele
56. Steven Youngblood 57. The Wall 58. Shawn Grear 59. Messerist 60. AK 47Ghost
61. Molasses 62. TMC4232 63. .44 Walker 64 Bugslayer 65 sltm1 66. SixShootinSam
67. NobleSniper 68 Gclefton 69. AZ_Rebel 70. Dmjung 71. Brotherlloyd 72. Walker944
73. Fingers McGee 74. Ginormous 75. Kiwiwalker 76. Ratdog68 77. shootmeinthehead
78. marlin_444 79. AussieTH 80. b55baron 81. Dbarrym 82. Oyeboten
83. Mat, Not Doormat 84. Das Jaeger 85. Electric Factory 86. Higene 87 Fivestrings
88. Big guy 49 89. JamesKelly 90. eastbank 91. Buddy 92. Kwetu 93. Husker
94. Two Gun Pete 95. Rifle 96. missuramoss
97. theotherwaldo 98. buckeyed 99. armyof1 100. TomADC 101. TheBigAr2003 102 Texas Moon 103. Dolk 104. don3 105. Opoche

106.CGN1771 107. ClemBert 108. Foto Joe 109.kwhi43@kc.rr.com 110.Tuckerp229

Need pics Tucker
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Old April 22, 2010, 06:04 PM   #2538
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You got a pretty one Pulp. I put a little "Gold Leaf" on the cylinder today.
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Old April 22, 2010, 07:16 PM   #2539
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So would I be on this Walker list if my Walker still had a 9 1/2 inch barrel?
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Old April 22, 2010, 07:30 PM   #2540
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Maybe scrat doesn't consider it a Walker without a front sight.
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Old April 22, 2010, 08:21 PM   #2541
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kwhi43@kc.rr.com View Post
You got a pretty one Pulp. I put a little "Gold Leaf" on the cylinder today.
Okay, now that is COOL!!

I'm assuming that you rubbed the gold leaf in with a popsicle stick or some such?? Where do you find the gold leaf?? And lastly, is it reasonably durable?? Or is the gold leaf something just for show??

And of course, did the gold leaf cost more than the gun??
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Old April 22, 2010, 11:36 PM   #2542
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Originally Posted by Foto Joe
Where do you find the gold leaf??
Gold Inlay Kit
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Old April 23, 2010, 11:59 AM   #2543
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No, No, I been doing it this way for 40 years. Take a small bottle of model
airplane "Gold Leaf" paint and a small brush and just smear it over the engraving then wipe gently with a paper towel. The paint will be where the
engraving is. It will last for quite some time. Be sure and de-grease first. As
a matter of fact, I didn't have a brush and just used a Q-tip and daubed it on.
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Old April 23, 2010, 12:10 PM   #2544
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Here's a little better picture of the cylinder.


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Old April 23, 2010, 02:09 PM   #2545
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Looks good. I've been thinkin' of doin' the cylinder, just hadn't got the nerve up yet. I used the Bonanza Gold kit. It's really a super fine bronze powder, just sorta looks like gold.
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Old April 24, 2010, 07:26 PM   #2546
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Wow that is soo cool. Gold Leaf. MMMMM
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Old April 24, 2010, 08:22 PM   #2547
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Any one have any advise

Took my WALKER out last week. Did it again today. Last week took a box of roundballs had my 1851 and my Walker with me. thought i mixed up the balls at first. As the ones i thought were the .451 loaded up good in the 1851. i loaded up the Walker and one of the cylinders the ball wandered out. so all i could do was eyeball them last week. Then at home i measured them out. the ones i thought were the .457 were. So i measured them out again today then went to the range. Yep i have one loose cylinder. .457 balls load up good on 5 cylinders cutting a good piece of lead ring. One chamber though loads kinda loose. How they heck did this happen. Now what. At first i was thinking of my Machining days. Where when we had a worn out cylinder in an engine we would sleeve it. Not too sure its worth doing on a revolver though. Same time finding a sleeve and cutting the cylinder probably are not worth it. Im thinking i am going to have to buy a new cylinder. Any one have any suggestions or advice on this one.
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Old April 24, 2010, 10:59 PM   #2548
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All 6 chambers are sleeved on my Remmy. Works well.


Last edited by kwhi43@kc.rr.com; April 24, 2010 at 11:04 PM.
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Old April 24, 2010, 11:08 PM   #2549
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Nice who the heck did it for you. INFO
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Old April 25, 2010, 07:26 AM   #2550
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Theoretically there's nothing wrong with sleeving a chamber, and obviously kwhi43@kc.rr.com's Remington is good evidence that it can work.

This is a very unusual incident; maybe it's Uberti's way of making you use one empty chamber for carry. Can you get the chambers miked? In the mean time I wouldn't use that one chamber.
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