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Old May 1, 2012, 02:48 PM   #1176
Tinker
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Flintnapper,

Just found this thread an hour ago.....yesss...I been reading it an hour ....still haven't waded through a third of it. Thanks.

Like your Hog Hammer, but got to thinking about early on in the thread where you had most of the pigs in the trap, but the two alphas would not go in. Saw Hickok45 (Youtuber) a few weeks ago with a new Slide Fire stock on his Blackout AR. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peTBG0FmOwI&feature=plcp One of those on your HH would make some bad hog ju-ju for a biggun that is trap smart.
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Old May 1, 2012, 02:52 PM   #1177
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Quote:
One of those on your HH would make some bad hog ju-ju for a biggun that is trap smart.
A bump-fire .450 SOCOM.......the only bad ju-ju it would make would be for Flint's shoulder
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Old May 1, 2012, 04:33 PM   #1178
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allaroundhunter wrote:

Quote:
A bump-fire .458 SOCOM.......the only bad ju-ju it would make would be for Flint's shoulder
You got that right! Even with some of the ‘lesser’ rounds it wouldn’t be any fun.

I just worked up a new ‘Heavy Hitter’ load for the SOCOM:

540 gr. WLNGC “Pile-Driver” bullet by Beartooth.






Not a lot of room left for powder once this bullet has been seated.




Maximum loads will rock your world ….so I guess whoever gets up first (me or the pig), is declared the “winner”.

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Old May 1, 2012, 04:42 PM   #1179
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oh dear christ. That takes the wind out of me just thinking about it!
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Old May 1, 2012, 06:36 PM   #1180
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OUCH! That is a huge bullet!
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Old May 1, 2012, 07:22 PM   #1181
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Guess it'd be hard enough to hang on to the treestand without a slidefire....

"He went to SHOOT....and the hogs ate him."
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Old May 1, 2012, 07:37 PM   #1182
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Ok, not to sound too goofy here...

But isn't it a bad idea to have a gas checked bullet seated below the neck?
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Old May 1, 2012, 09:53 PM   #1183
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Twmaster wrote:

Quote:
Ok, not to sound too goofy here...
But isn't it a bad idea to have a gas checked bullet seated below the neck?
Not a problem, believe me…I thought of that before loading them.

The Beartooth bullet has a BHN of (21) so we need right at 30,000 psi in order to obturate the base of the bullet.

The copper gas check (crimped on BTW) has a BHN of approximately (40), so over 50,000 psi necessary for it obturate (expand/change shape).

The SOCOM is limited to 35,000 psi (MAX) so its impossible for the gas check to “grow” in size. It can only be pushed into the base of the bullet which does obturate slightly with most loads.

As long as the gas check does not come off during the seating process (ever try to pull a crimped on gas check off) then I have nothing to worry about at the pressures I run.

So long as the gas check is reasonably square to the base, it has nowhere to go except against the base of the bullet. The high pressure from the gases insures this.

Typically…the speed of most modern propellants (while expanding) exceeds bullet speed by 3-5 times. Trust me…the gas check WILL be firmly planted against the bullet base.

As long as the gas check does not obturate (grow in size) while below the cartridge neck (bottle necked cartridge) then there is no concern.

Additionally, I do not roll crimp the cartridge into a cannelure, I use a LEE FCD to very lightly apply a “squash” crimp to the entire neck of the cartridge. Not enough to deform the bullet, just enough to create some tension.

Remember the entire cartridge case expands as pressure rises (it literally sticks against the chamber wall until pressure subsides and the brass springs back a bit). Internal cartridge specs are getting 'bigger', not 'tighter' under pressure, the exception being slight cartridge stretch towards the last part of the pressure curve.

No pressure spike will be created by the gas check in this cartridge…at the pressures I run.

There may be examples (with some loads), (in some bottle necked cartridges) where someone gets everything wrong and potentially creates a problem for themselves, but not here.

Good question though!

Flint.
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Old May 1, 2012, 10:21 PM   #1184
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Thanks, as always, for the detailed reply.

I've only been reloading for about a year. I've read not to insert a gas check below the neck. I had assumed the issue would be losing the GC.

I learn something new every day if I pay attention.

Thank you sir!
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Old May 1, 2012, 10:56 PM   #1185
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Quote:
I've read not to insert a gas check below the neck.
Google it again...you'll find it is common practice (with certain caveats).

Anyway, we are getting quite off the subject matter. Thanks for your question, Mike.
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Old May 2, 2012, 11:28 AM   #1186
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I've not gone hog hunting (yet) but, Flint, you have me really wanting a .458 upper.
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Old May 2, 2012, 01:54 PM   #1187
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Hello, all. This is my FNG first post on THR... What a thread, holy cow.
OK, I'm a (fairly) recent returned vet, and I haven't owned a proper hunting rifle in over a decade. I don't remember the Texas hill country even HAVING hogs, and now we do, and all I can think about is getting a new rifle, a hunting license, and lots of good advice. This seems like the place, but jeez, there's too many posts to even search through! As I seem to have a least found the right hunting threads, would somebody here be kind enough to point me to a good thread on .30-30s? (It's what I know, and I don't want to start a new thread when the knowledgable folks are already on the old ones). Thanks!

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Old May 6, 2012, 11:13 PM   #1188
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find a good old marlin ( I am partial I know) at a pawn shop or local GS and get to shooting. I shoot lots of hogs with my marlin 336. the 30-30 has plenty of "crunch" for the all but the biggest hogs.

About a month ago i dropped a big boar in his tracks with the ol' 30-30. I never got to weigh him but i think he was in the 200lbs-250lbs range.

Thanks for your service and welcome home
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Old May 6, 2012, 11:23 PM   #1189
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Flint, how does the velocity and FPE of your new "heavy hitter" compare to rounds that you have previously been using?
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Old May 8, 2012, 12:02 AM   #1190
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AAH wrote:

Quote:
Flint, how does the velocity and FPE of your new "heavy hitter" compare to rounds that you have previously been using?
It's slower (no surprise) and muzzle energy is less than most other rounds I load for the SOCOM. BUT...don't let the energy figures (on PAPER) fool you.

The Pile-Driver will keep on going when the other bullets have given up, curled into the fetal position... and are crying for their Momma's!

At the velocity I load the P/D...it produces only 1876 ft. lbs of energy.

I also have a 100 gr. Aluminum bullet ...that leaves the muzzle right at 3,000 fps and makes just over 2010 ft. lbs of energy (a little more than the 540 gr. P/D), so on "paper"...its the winner, right?

But... we have that pesky little thing called Sectional Density.

In "real life" I sometimes pick the aluminum bullets up off the ground behind my targets, and never find one more than 2"-3" into the clay bank.

I had to dig 26" into HARD clay the other day to find just one of the P/D's, I gave up on the others.

But to further address your question, most of my loads (300 to 405 gr. bullets) churn up between 2300-2500 ft. lbs of muzzle energy.

Roughly the equivalent of the 7mm-08 (140 gr bullet) I was using before...but I get MUCH better results with the Big Bore.

Heavy, large diameter bullets....at moderate speeds, is just the ticket for hogs.

ANY hog under 200 yds. had better be moving for cover...and doing it quickly.

Flint.
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Old May 9, 2012, 10:56 AM   #1191
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Waiting on word about a possible new "evening in the wallers" I decided to stop by a LGS and stumbled upon a Savage Model 10 .243 w/scope for exactly the amount of cash I had in my pocket (after haggling of course) as an alternative to the Ruger, Bushmaster and 'ole trusty' Winchester 94. Dialed her in at 150 yards and I do believe this lil feller will fill a niche for those pesky hogs. I managed to walk away with an assortment of cartridges too....75gr, 85gr and 110gr. Now we'll see
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Old May 10, 2012, 11:31 PM   #1192
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My brother's ranch near Thurber, Texas is infested with the porcine problem children. I do believe he is training them by using traps with too large of mesh and too short panels. However, he owns the property and he gets to train the animals.

I have been building rifles and helping shorten the life spans of said children. An LR308 in 7.62 X 51 has claimed several. My nephew appreciates the way it puts down the bacon. I can't get him to use my bolt .358 Win as follow up shots are not as fast as the Stoner inspired .308 caliber pill pusher.

I recently built up two .300 Blackouts on the AR platform, soon to be on hog patrol. Both are fairly light weight, under 7 pounds with optics. A quick description of the .300 Blackout would be a "30-30 in the AR15 platform". The advantage I imagine is quick followup shots for a relatively low-recoil gun with enough power, given proper bullets and placement for hogs to several hundred pounds.

Like Flint, I decided the .458 SOCOM might be the ultimate hog dispatching tool. I haven't had time to go on pig patrol with it but, I have 300 gr Remington HP rounds and the 325 gr Hornady red-tipped 'pig missiles' loaded . I hope to put the SOCOM to work soon.

Ron

Last edited by wdyasq; May 10, 2012 at 11:33 PM. Reason: spelling
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Old May 11, 2012, 09:11 AM   #1193
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Mr. Flintknapper,

Has every hog/deer/animal you have shot with the .458 SOCOM been a DRT? Has anything moved after being hit with that behemoth?

Thanks,
LeonCarr
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Old May 11, 2012, 01:26 PM   #1194
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L/C wrote:

Quote:
Has every hog/deer/animal you have shot with the .458 SOCOM been a DRT?
Has anything moved after being hit with that behemoth?
Every animal (to date) that I have hit where I intended...has been DRT.

BUT, I have had a few pigs run for a ways. NOT the ones that were struck where I was aiming though. Let me explain that statement:

I have had several instances where hogs were "lined up" (partially or entirely).

Sometimes I have waited for that happen and taken the shot, other times another hog moved into the sight picture just as the shot broke.

Additionally, one night when there was a low hanging fog, I shot a boar (it dropped dead) but also found a sow the next day... that apparently had been standing behind it. She had made it 10-15 yds. into the brush, I had no idea she was there at the time of the shot.

EVERY hog that was the 'primary target' has been dropped in it's tracks.

Additional/Collateral hogs...are not always struck exactly where I would like...but I have not failed to retrieve any yet.

The 458 SOCOM is a powerful cartridge and will dispatch hogs with ease PROVIDED they are hit well.

But, as with any cartridge, you can't hit hogs (or anything else) "around the edges" and expect good results.

The Deer, Coyotes, (and one Horse I had to shoot)...have all folded up immediately.

Last edited by Flintknapper; May 14, 2012 at 11:50 PM.
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Old May 11, 2012, 02:15 PM   #1195
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Nice
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Old May 14, 2012, 08:42 PM   #1196
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"I don't remember the Texas hill country even HAVING hogs."

My father brought home two hogs with deer from a hunt near San Saba. This would have been before 1966 as I remember helping skin the things at a house that burned down in January 1966. It might have been the 1965 deer season.

He also shot a large boar in Brazoria in 1952, loading it down with lead from a .300 Savage.

The multiplication ability of the pigs is simply amazing.

Ron
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Old May 14, 2012, 09:05 PM   #1197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wdyasq View Post
The multiplication ability of the pigs is simply amazing.
Yeah, but how are they at algebra?
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Old May 14, 2012, 09:27 PM   #1198
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I guess I should have said I don't remember having a hog PROBLEM. I remember reading my small-town newspaper from home back in like 2006, and an article about fences making reference to "the hog problem", and being surprised...
Now, I'm trying to explain to my wife how buying a new rifle and spending whole weekends away from home is really kind of an important part of my duty to our state and community.
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Old May 14, 2012, 11:56 PM   #1199
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You are correct Scott.

I grew up in Austin and traveled nearly all of the Hill Country for 25 ys. and rarely heard of anyone (or any place) having a hog population.

A small group of Feral Hogs on Lake Travis near the town of Volente (as early as 1968) are the only ones I can recall.
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Old May 15, 2012, 11:13 AM   #1200
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Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by wdyasq View Post
The multiplication ability of the pigs is simply amazing.
Yeah, but how are they at algebra?
I think Flint has been trying to teach them subtraction.
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