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Old September 16, 2014, 03:26 PM   #1
RustyShackelford
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Coye Knives....

Any members own or use www.coyeknives.com ?
The QC looks good. The shop doesn't offer a lot of choices & the prices are steep.

I'm a tad leery of a few of the "tactical" & "prepper" lifestyle guys after checking www.graymanknives.com a few months ago.

PM me if you want to keep your reviews/remarks private.

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Old September 16, 2014, 04:04 PM   #2
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The prices for the fixed blades are more than twice what I would consider reasonable.

$235 for this.



$325 for this:

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Old September 16, 2014, 04:26 PM   #3
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Note that these are machine finished (tumbled) knives so there isn't any time intensive finish work being done on them.

Also, it looks like these are from waterjetted blanks. Not that there is anything wrong with that but it vastly speeds up the process.
It would be interesting to know if he jobs out heat treatment.

If so they are asking $345 for a knife that consumes $25 worth of materials and has maybe an hour of labor.
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Old September 16, 2014, 06:23 PM   #4
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I'm curious....

Id like to know why he has such a limited selection. I like tanto & serraded/half serrations. High quality steel is worth it too.
The site says he offers a lifetime warranty so it doesn't seem like they will leave you in the dust.

I'd add that he doesn't claim to to be some super trooper DEVGRU or SAS super ninja.
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Old September 16, 2014, 06:39 PM   #5
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High quality steel can be had lots of places. It isn't really all that expensive to buy or to heat treat.

That first one that Sam posted is just CPM154 which is a fine steel, but nothing exclusive or exotic.

I won't denigrate someone's work, or the prices they ask for it. I mean, in the end the price is whatever someone will pay for it.

Why doesn't he offer an American style tanto or serrations? Well...probably because he doesn't like them.

I don't offer them either. Wouldn't want them, won't make them.
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Old September 16, 2014, 06:45 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RustyShackelford View Post
Id like to know why he has such a limited selection.
He probably stays busy with orders for his current line up and doesn't want or need to complicate his production schedule. Especially if he is making knives in large batches and not one at a time as orders come in.


Quote:
High quality steel is worth it too.
Steel is cheap vis-ŕ-vis the cost of a knife.


http://newjerseysteelbaron.com/shop/cpm-154cm/


Quote:
Originally Posted by RustyShackelford View Post
The site says he offers a lifetime warranty so it doesn't seem like they will leave you in the dust.
If folks are paying that kind of money a lifetime warranty from the manufacturer is a no-brainer.

Most folks don't use their knives, those that do usually don't try to break them.
Per unit profit margins are HUGE at the prices that Coye is asking so eating a replacement isn't a big deal, especially if the dude that broke the knife immediately tells the internet how awesome the warranty is.
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Old September 16, 2014, 09:09 PM   #7
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Moot point....

It's all moot.
Most of the blades are either out of stock or N/A so I'm not going to hold my breath.
It looks like the company has a strong following in the knife/custom hunting knife community so they can afford to be like "take it or leave it".

The Coye dark ForeRunner is impressive but I'm not waiting forever & 2 weeks for some knife.
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Old September 16, 2014, 09:16 PM   #8
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Mr. Coye has only been making knives for 5 years, yet seems to be asking prices that a much better established maker might expect.
His Forerunner/Ridgeback design is "reminiscent" of Bob Kasper's Polkowski fighter and the CRKT Companion.

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Old September 16, 2014, 09:55 PM   #9
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The Kasper/Polkowski stuff was sensibly thin and had a full (though flat) grip.


The Coye might be a bit overbuilt for a stubby three finger knife.



...$325.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg thick.jpg (117.8 KB, 127 views)
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Old September 16, 2014, 10:01 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RustyShackelford View Post
The Coye dark ForeRunner is impressive
In all seriousness, without any snark from me, what specifically appeals to you about the knife?
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Old September 17, 2014, 10:51 AM   #11
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ForeRunner....

I like the thick blade & the ergonomics of the handle.
It seems small for a field or outdoor knife but could be useful for minor camp chores or CQB defense.
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Old September 17, 2014, 11:40 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RustyShackelford View Post
I like the thick blade & the ergonomics of the handle.
It seems small for a field or outdoor knife but could be useful for minor camp chores or CQB defense.

Interesting. Now, I look at that knife and the first thing I think is that the blade is overly thick to the point that it is going to be hampering performance.
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Old September 17, 2014, 08:35 PM   #13
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Quote:
useful for minor camp chores
No, that thing is too thick and the angle is too obtuse. The grip is too short also. Heavy and point heavy as well.
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Old September 17, 2014, 09:01 PM   #14
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Well, it would be good for batonning. ...







<Ducks and runs for cover>
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Old September 17, 2014, 09:16 PM   #15
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You better run, boy!

Lessee, too short and that hollow grind is going to act like a stopper instead of a wedge.
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Old September 17, 2014, 09:31 PM   #16
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I swear there must be an un-ending supply of folks who buy knives to own something they can show their friends -as opposed to something actually useful in the real world...

Oh well, whether its particularly useful is a minor point if a guy is making a buck...

Those of us that actually use a blade daily as part of our work or lifestyle probably don't have much patience for many of the knife-like objects that seem to come with a price tag all out of proportion to their actual worth.

I'd better quit right now --- "if you can't say anything nice...."

Y'all can probably remember the rest of that line from that old Disney movie.
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Old Yesterday, 04:55 PM   #17
sneedb82
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Knife collector/Knife user

..... It's apparent that me being gone for an extended hiatus was for good reason.


First of all, even if Bill does use a water jet to cut out his blanks for his knives, that doesn't make him any LESS of a knife maker. Many knife makers, guilded or not, use a water jet because it's simply easier to profile, hone and shape. Are either of you knife makers, currently?

Secondly, the production line up that he has is because he has obtained such a large book of business for his "popular" knives keeps him so busy. The point is, a one man shop can only produce so many knives... Take Ramos Knives for example. Mr. Ramos has a 2-1/2 year back log for his knives... and his knives are very limited in terms of "profiles" and models. Reason? These are so popular because that's what his customers want. They all serve a purpose. To eliminate such wait times, they're water jet or cut out of strips of CM154 and sat aside for each order. Handles are then procured. Tapering, profiling, etc., are all done for each knife. In the case of the ForeRunner(TM) it was a design that was procured and refined from the Ridgeback. From there, the notoriety of the knife speaks for itself. Having owned both a Ridgeback and now a ForeRunner, I know what it's for: it's not for chopping wood. It's for EDC; and as a hunter/guide, it comes in quite handy when gutting a deer, or cutting tails off coyotes; ears off of pigs, whatever I want it to do... but I'm not chopping wood with it;

I think that the presumptuous attitudes of MODERATORS belittling a knife maker for producing products that are in such high demands that the auctioning off of one obtains several hundred dollars over the retail value speaks for the intrinsic value/demand that one knife has.


Ask Ken Onion, Marcus Lin, or any other knife maker that collaborate with big name companies why they allow their knives to be "produced" rather than custom made....The idea is volume. Bill is not a volume..

Reading the comments made my head hurt... the same comments being said about an American knife maker producing homegrown knives rather than sending them off to China or Mexico or any other sub-par country to do the work for them at a smaller price.


I think the professionalism could have been handled considerably more maturely than was presented... and quite honestly, expected it more out of THR moderators than on some other forums...
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Old Yesterday, 05:20 PM   #18
hso
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Brandon,

I've been collecting and using knives for quite a while and you and I both know that the popularity of a particular model or even a maker isn't always about the performance of their knives and that financial success does not always equate great performance either. Success is a fickle thing and that's why one maker can make a living at what they do and another with a similar or "better" performing knife can't. Almost every knife design has been done in the thousands of years that blades have been being made and even if a maker's work isn't directly derivative of another's they're all influenced by that history. Nothing new under the sun and all that.

The performance of a knife is dictated by the design and the final state of the materials used. If the design doesn't fit an application it won't perform as well as another that is intended for that use. A fighter doesn't lend itself to camp use as well as a knife designed and shaped and heat treated for the application. That's not automatically an indictment of the design itself as long as a user instead of the maker didn't try to misapply the design for the use. If someone's critical of a design vs. application then those that disagree can address the specific criticism where they disagree. Point by point the features and characteristics can be debated based on knowledge and experience. That's why people come to forums.

With today's ready availability of EDM, water jet, and LASER cutting services to produce blanks the idea that a custom maker has to use a bandsaw to blank a blade to be custom is as outdated as insisting on using a hand saw to blank the blade instead of the band saw or those that would insist that you have to forge the basic shape instead of cutting away material from the billet (we won't even get into the making of the steel to make the billet to forge the blank to ...). BUT convention still says that a custom knife still has to involve the maker holding the piece or the tool by hand in the steps working the blank to blade. Even that is becoming blurred as mills come into play more and more these days and will intensify as they become smaller and more affordable. Collectors and makers will intensify their debate of what a custom knife is or isn't along with it. But debate what makes a knife is part of what collectors and makers do.

There's no legitimate criticism of blanking by a supplier from my perspective. It is in the steps following that a craftsman's hands create something unique whether it is optimized for an application or not. How that item performs is purely a function of geometry and metallurgy and arguing the points around that also are part of the community.
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Last edited by hso; Yesterday at 10:25 PM.
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Old Yesterday, 09:53 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sneedb82 View Post
First of all, even if Bill does use a water jet to cut out his blanks for his knives, that doesn't make him any LESS of a knife maker.
No one said it did, did they?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sneedb82 View Post
Are either of you knife makers, currently?
I'm an advanced hobbyist. I average about one knife a day start to finish. Usually stock removal but I'm slowly learning to forge.

hso forges the occasional knife as time permits.


Quote:
Originally Posted by sneedb82 View Post
Having owned both a Ridgeback and now a ForeRunner
How do they do on turnips?

To paraphrase Jeff Randall of ESEE:
Quote:
"So, the point is for the most part we're buying and selling bullcrap when it comes to the knife business."
Indeed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hso
There's no legitimate criticism of blanking by a supplier from my perspective.
Nor mine. Hogging steel sucks.
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Old Today, 10:43 AM   #20
sneedb82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Cade
No one said it did, did they?
it was insinuated several times that he was less of a knife maker by the fact that he charges "so much" for his knives, but yet, it's so simple in design, and finish...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Cade
I'm an advanced hobbyist. I average about one knife a day start to finish. Usually stock removal but I'm slowly learning to forge.

hso forges the occasional knife as time permits.
So as a hobbyist, you understand that perfecting the "model" you want consistently, over and over, to provide the highest possible outcome takes practice... and that practice, if you were to sell your knives, would result in a capitalized cost formation to obtain some sort of return on your investment and eventually turn a profit?



Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Cade
How do they do on turnips?
Wouldn't know... I despise Turnips; but it will turn a deer or a hog inside out; as I suppose it would do the same to anything I decide to turn it loose on.


I'd even suppose that when you talk to Jason Fry (www.frycustomknives.com) you'd say the same thing about his work, as well? An apprentice guilder, and custom knife maker. He will either cut his out on a band saw, or use water jet, but the entire process is his from blank to finished grind... Bill is no different. The point I was making is you guys, as Mods, had no issue going to task with making your opinions fact, and essentially creating libel against a knifemaker you've never done business with, or ground metal with.

As a hobbyist yourself, I'm quite disturbed at your mentality and lack of professionalism in responding to the OPs questions.

Keep your opinions, and voice them. That's great. Stepping over the threshold and touting the opinion as "fact" is disingenuous.
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Old Today, 10:46 AM   #21
Yo Mama
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Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

..... It's apparent that me being gone for an extended hiatus was for good reason.


First of all, even if Bill does use a water jet to cut out his blanks for his knives, that doesn't make him any LESS of a knife maker. Many knife makers, guilded or not, use a water jet because it's simply easier to profile, hone and shape. Are either of you knife makers, currently?

Secondly, the production line up that he has is because he has obtained such a large book of business for his "popular" knives keeps him so busy. The point is, a one man shop can only produce so many knives... Take Ramos Knives for example. Mr. Ramos has a 2-1/2 year back log for his knives... and his knives are very limited in terms of "profiles" and models. Reason? These are so popular because that's what his customers want. They all serve a purpose. To eliminate such wait times, they're water jet or cut out of strips of CM154 and sat aside for each order. Handles are then procured. Tapering, profiling, etc., are all done for each knife. In the case of the ForeRunner(TM) it was a design that was procured and refined from the Ridgeback. From there, the notoriety of the knife speaks for itself. Having owned both a Ridgeback and now a ForeRunner, I know what it's for: it's not for chopping wood. It's for EDC; and as a hunter/guide, it comes in quite handy when gutting a deer, or cutting tails off coyotes; ears off of pigs, whatever I want it to do... but I'm not chopping wood with it;

I think that the presumptuous attitudes of MODERATORS belittling a knife maker for producing products that are in such high demands that the auctioning off of one obtains several hundred dollars over the retail value speaks for the intrinsic value/demand that one knife has.


Ask Ken Onion, Marcus Lin, or any other knife maker that collaborate with big name companies why they allow their knives to be "produced" rather than custom made....The idea is volume. Bill is not a volume..

Reading the comments made my head hurt... the same comments being said about an American knife maker producing homegrown knives rather than sending them off to China or Mexico or any other sub-par country to do the work for them at a smaller price.


I think the professionalism could have been handled considerably more maturely than was presented... and quite honestly, expected it more out of THR moderators than on some other forums...
Honestly it sounds like your attached to this company or something. The way you almost take it personally. The blades are overpriced period. If someone with a lot of money to blow buys one great, but I don't see any street cred at that price with those materials no matter what the wait time is.

Then to attack mods and put down users here for disagreeing with you? Way out of line.
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Old Today, 12:06 PM   #22
hso
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Quote:
essentially creating libel against a knifemaker
Come now, that's hyperbole of the most absurd level.

I'm an ABS Apprentice and I've been collecting custom knives for over 20 years. I've participated in dozens of hammer-ins and started attending the Blade Show when it first started in Knoxville. I've handled thousands of knives and discussed them with hundreds of people for over 20 years. I've had manufacturers and makers bring knives to me to critique and I've had my blades critiqued. Some of those critiques have been very critical (both of my blades and of other makers) and no one complained about it or thought it unfair. Knifemakers have expected their work to be critiqued all the time I've been involved and before. You look at people's work and critique the grind and profile and balance and materials and even price. That's all part of making and collecting.
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Old Today, 01:58 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sneedb82 View Post
I'd even suppose that when you talk to Jason Fry (www.frycustomknives.com) you'd say the same thing about his work, as well?
Well, actually, those look pretty nice and reasonably priced too, for the most part. Nice high grind, cleaned up plunge line for folks who are into that sort of thing. Tapered tang for balance. Spiffy.



The description:
Quote:
The blade is D2 steel at 61 RC with flat ground bevels and a nice thin tapered tang. The handle material is contoured green canvas Micarta. I have not been as tempted to keep a knife in a long time. Price on one like this starts at $175
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