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Old March 16, 2016, 01:16 PM   #1
anothernewb
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Grrr. Wifes company changed their policies. make sme furious

My wife is a pharmacist, and she works at the local store, and is often there till close, 9pm. Not that our town is a bad town, but that parking lot is the local hangout for the kids and the punks to gather before they go do whatever it is they do these days. Most of the time it's the usual high school kids trying to look tough and cool- but there have been 3 incidents in the last couple years where either cops or punks have fired shots there.

She carries, but the company has recently changed its rules. It used to be that employees were not able to carry while working, but you could still have one. Now they went all draconian and blatantly stated if they carry on any company property- even in their vehicles, it will be immediate termination.

Gah. so frustrated. Wife doesn't want to get fired - it's known that she carries, but there are a few niggysobs that also love to be tools and get people fired - just because they can. On the other hand, it's tempting to say forget it and carry anyway since there's precedent for the need and life>job.

What really bakes me is they're friendly towards customers carrying. What a mess.
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Old March 16, 2016, 01:25 PM   #2
W L Johnson
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Originally Posted by anothernewb View Post
even in their vehicles, it will be immediate termination.
What's MN stance on the matter? In Kentucky state law states that your employer can not prevent you from keeping a gun in your vehicle.
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Old March 16, 2016, 01:26 PM   #3
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Bear spray is the answer.
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Old March 16, 2016, 01:35 PM   #4
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Tough situation. My wife's a pharmacist but owns her own store. She and two of her employees carry. Medical professionals are fortunate in that our licenses are like commodities. As long as whatever transgression she's getting fired for doesn't jeopardize her licensure (i.e. As long as she's violating a store policy and not and state/federal law), the she needs to weigh the risk vs benefit of carrying because there's always a job available for a pharmacist (currently at least). I would carry and not say anything. My wife's store is large (5000ft^2). She was once robbed and didn't even know it was going down. She was armed. The bad guy was actually using a pellet gun. The cashier was petrified and kept quiet. He handed over a note and the tech gave him bottles of drugs. He was gone before my wife knew what happened. I believe she would have shot him if she was aware of what was going on. I hope she would have at least. It might not be a pellet gun next time. Incidentally, the guy was desperate and withdrawing. He'd abstained to pass the drug test to work at a good company. His address was on the note he handed the cashier. They caught him several hours later.
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Old March 16, 2016, 01:37 PM   #5
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Since they allow customers to carry, it is a matter of company policy, and not law. I used to work for a company with a similar policy. I could have been fired if I ever had to save my own life. Otherwise, they could not search my vehicle without consent, and employees cannot be body searched when entering, nor did I walk through a metal detector.

My point being that if there were ever a reason for them to know I was carrying, losing my job would have been a small price to pay.

My question is, is this a chain store, where the decision was made by a company person in some faceless removed position, or was this policy made in the place where you actually work? It would seem to me that you are in a profession where your skills are in high demand. You may have more leverage than you know if working for a competitor was an option.
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Old March 16, 2016, 01:49 PM   #6
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Sabre 3 in 1 pepper spray and an exceedingly bright light with a strobe mode are one respectable alternative if she chooses to comply.
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Old March 16, 2016, 07:33 PM   #7
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Quote from TimSR:
Quote:
Since they allow customers to carry, it is a matter of company policy, and not law.
Not necessarily so. In WI it is written into state law that no employer can prohibit employees from having firearms in their vehicles when parked on company property. Yes, employers can prohibit carry inside their facility, but not within employee's vehicles on company property.
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Old March 16, 2016, 08:37 PM   #8
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It feels really good to fire a boss you disagree with. I've done it more than once.

Life will go on if you have to move to a job or a city more agreeable to both of you. If you really think she is unsafe in her present position, why would you hesitate?
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Old March 16, 2016, 09:02 PM   #9
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The place sounds dangerous and the boss has made a stupid policy. Time for her to go elsewhere. May not be easy or convenient, but might be the best direction if it's that upsetting.
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Old March 16, 2016, 09:09 PM   #10
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Is the parking lot company property? If it is not, other state laws or rules may apply.
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Old March 16, 2016, 09:26 PM   #11
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In Indiana you can have it in your vehicle. There are only certain situations where you can't, like an international shipping port, court house, etc.
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Old March 16, 2016, 09:29 PM   #12
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Pharmacist don't generally have any problem finding an employer. Time to send out resumes.
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Old March 16, 2016, 09:37 PM   #13
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A weapon on your car 100m away is of little use to you if you're being fired upon in the store.

She has a high demand skill set. I would find another place to work.
Or, ask them to hire an armed guard to protect her since they have stripped her of her ability to defend herself.
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Old March 16, 2016, 09:56 PM   #14
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This is really difficult. No clue how much demand there is for pharmacist or what she stands to lose? If she knows there are people who would rat her out I would be coy about it. I would not carry for awhile till the newness of the rule change passes over but would not say one way or the other if I was carrying a gun. Then once the dust settles make a decision. There is no maybe as she will either be in violation of company policy and face termination or she won't. She can decide or she can look elsewhere for a job, again, no clue as to the demand for pharmacist. During the interim? Maybe a spray.

She is a victim of a criminal justice system more enmeshed with criminal rights than victims rights. That new company policy was likely driven by their legal department.

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Old March 17, 2016, 09:18 AM   #15
anothernewb
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Job opportunities in the pharma industry are actually at an all time low thanks to obamacare, although there are a few places still doing well. Changing jobs would require both of us to move, sadly. More realistic would be to look for a totally different job in town, but to give up 25 years of time in benefits, and 6 weeks of vacay a year at this place - at our age - to start over with nothing really sucks as well.

We're digging through options. The simplest idea short term might be that she rides her bicycle into work (about a mile or so, and we're both sick of our winter fat) and her husband picks her up at night.
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Old March 17, 2016, 09:25 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by anothernewb View Post
Job opportunities in the pharma industry are actually at an all time low thanks to obamacare, although there are a few places still doing well. Changing jobs would require both of us to move, sadly. More realistic would be to look for a totally different job in town, but to give up 25 years of time in benefits, and 6 weeks of vacay a year at this place - at our age - to start over with nothing really sucks as well.

We're digging through options. The simplest idea short term might be that she rides her bicycle into work (about a mile or so, and we're both sick of our winter fat) and her husband picks her up at night.
Then all things considered I play by their new rules. Towards my own retirement I saw plenty of change I opposed but simply went along with it. When I hit 63 I walked. It was a good ride but I was happy to get out. Sometimes you just have to bite the bullet.

Ron
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Old March 17, 2016, 09:46 AM   #17
anothernewb
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I am also going to research MN law regarding this. it is a company parking lot, but shared with the city as well.. might be some wiggle room on it. Sucks not being able to carry in the store, but one advantage of her position is that she's almost never the person working the pharmacy register, and is behind the bullet resistant glass. One good thing about their setup, the register is actually sort of around the side from the actual location where they do their work, so there's a lessened chance of someone getting back to where she is. The store has never been directly robbed - other than the usual shoplifting - However, it's still a stupid policy for the store though. But the headquarters for the chain is in Denver, and they are representative of that mentality.

Spray is likely as good of a stopgap as we're going to get at this point though. A number of other co workers are equally unhappy with the new rules - will be interesting to see what shakes out.

The funny thing is - I'm just as screwed at my job. I work in a Gov't office in a prohibited building. Mine stays in the truck. There are several of us who talk often that we should be allowed to carry - if someone is going to flip, they'll likely do it in our building. Between people headed to court, and others ticked off about gov't expenses and permits. Many of us feel it's only a matter of time before someone snaps. We've done many active shooter drills, so I guess I have to give the higher ups some credit for at least keeping us somewhat trained.
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Old March 17, 2016, 10:07 AM   #18
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So then what is the company providing as far as protection for its employees?
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Old March 17, 2016, 10:43 AM   #19
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So then what is the company providing as far as protection for its employees?
Wonderful question. She should confront her employer as to what methods will be taken to protect her while leaving the store late at night. Also ask what is the legality of them not offering her any protection while on "company property".

I think I would encourage her to comply. It sounds like you are in a small town and good jobs may not be plentiful. Jealous co-workers coulc really screw her job. I would buy her a very large can of spray and an ASP.
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Old March 17, 2016, 10:44 AM   #20
anothernewb
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So then what is the company providing as far as protection for its employees?
short answer? looks like bending over and joining the badwagon of

"just let the criminals take what they want and they'll go away, we don't want them to sue us"
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Old March 17, 2016, 10:46 AM   #21
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Hmmm... never thought of the baton. that's actually a pretty good idea. My wife hasn't shot me with her carry piece - even when we've been at the bar, so I guess she won't hit me with a stick either if I make her mad!

340PD

yep, smallish town. 13k people. largest town within an hour in any direction by a factor of 5. Closest town is Moorhead, MN which is a bit over an hour away and I'll go back to one income, no vehicle, ramen noodles and water, and we'll rent a room in my mothers basement before I move back there.

Last edited by anothernewb; March 17, 2016 at 10:52 AM.
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Old March 17, 2016, 11:09 AM   #22
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A simple fact that no law or corporate rule can contradict; you are ultimately responsible for your personal safety.
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meh
I reckon she was looking for a job when she found that one.
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Old March 17, 2016, 02:38 PM   #23
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Have about 100 people write letters and tell them that they will go to a competitor that respects the constitution and their employees. Lobby the government that allows this disarmament.

Alternatively, that's why it's called concealed carry..
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Old March 17, 2016, 02:49 PM   #24
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Screw the stupid policy. Carry anyway, but be discreet about it. A person can get away with quite a bit if they only keep their mouths shut!
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Old March 17, 2016, 03:17 PM   #25
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I haven't found any indication as to what your wife's thoughts are on this. I mean, it mostly effects her.

You're getting advice that she should just ignore this policy change and take the chance of being fired, which sounds probable, since there are weasels for co-workers that would inform on her. You're also getting advice to just up and move, or change jobs, to avoid the situation, but that isn't so easy and is a major life change. It's easy to give advice....for other people.
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