Caracal reliability, service - Page 2

plouffedaddy · October 15, 2012, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Had the Caracal been manufactured in a different country like Germany, we might be having a very different thread discussion ...

Just putting this out there---Caracals are produced in Germany and the UAE; but in the US we currently only import the UAE producd guns. Not sure if that makes a difference to anyone but maybe it does....

hardluk1 · October 15, 2012, 06:19 PM

Well i have my caracal C model in hand and I have to say the level of finsh from the milling to the metal finish is at a higher level than many handguns out there. I replaced a glock 17 with this. Shorter 2.63" reach to the trigger and thinner where you reach at the same 1.100" as the slide . Only fired a few shoots out back but what reviews have said about recoil seem true enought. Very little snap with +P 124gr loads. Tomorrow a trip to the range to run a few hundred rounds thru it. Mine was $431 with tax.

**Sam1911** · October 15, 2012, 08:28 PM

Remedial reading lesson:

Quote:

[Mod Talk: Let's drop the argument over the UAE and such. If you don't know anything about the CARACAL PISTOL itself, don't drag the conversation off into the weeds with off topic dross.]

C0untZer0 · October 16, 2012, 01:12 AM

They can be had for a smidge under $400.00

That's pretty cheap !

Water-Man · October 16, 2012, 02:11 AM

Caracal is supposed to be making a sub-compact available shortly.

Urban_Redneck · October 16, 2012, 11:18 AM

I just purchased a Caracal C ($419 shipped). Hopefully, it will arrive before the weekend

I have every confidence that it will be as accurate and reliable as my F that has put 2700+ malfunction-free rounds downrange. Extra mags were $26.95, I wish I had the forethought to buy some C mags when Centerfire Systems was blowing them out $19.99.

Caracal's marketing is still lacking. Hopefully, 2013 will be better.

YMMV

hardluk1 · October 16, 2012, 04:27 PM

urban redneck do you still have pay a ffl fee. Went to the range a got a 125 rounds fired and am more than pleased with my C model. Good trigger and easy to shoot well even when only there to simple run rounds thru it. Fits a old cross beerd glock holster great too. Mine came from lipsey thru waffen works, early pistol with a 2 digit serial number. Styer could do better getting it to the hands of more wholesalers. None of my lgs normal wholesale dealers stock or deal with them or styer .

Urban_Redneck · October 16, 2012, 09:36 PM

Long story short....The dealer I bought my F from in May, ordered two at that time. He charged me approx $490 out the door. He has $500

on the remaining F. I really wanted to try out the C, so I went to several other shops and the best I could do was $489 + Tax and they would have to order it.

Well hell, I asked around at my club and found a couple of dealers that do transfers for $20- $35. I checked on the www and found that the $20 transfer FFL dealer is on file with grab-a-gun... a couple of clicks... $419.99, shipped Done! I ordered some extra mags from JG sales.
http://images.thehighroad.org/smilies/shocker.gif
I'm taking a 500 round training course Saturday, that will be the most I've run it without cleaning -should be a good test. It would be great if the C would show up before then.

It would be nice to have more holster options. However, Steve at RKBA Holsters made me a nice Kydex rig for my F. If the C pistol is as good as the F, I'll get an IWB holster from him.

As to the marketing, aftermarket, etc. Remember; voices create choices Want (front) sight options? Call Brownells, Ameriglo, Trjicon, etc. Need a holster call your favorite holster makers. Manufacturers and dealers won't develop or stock products if there is no demand.

YMMV

JohnKSa · October 16, 2012, 11:27 PM

Quote:

...voices create choices...

My concern is that the aftermarket accessory market is going to be severely hampered by the roll-pins and other design choices. Changing the sights is probably the most common mod, next to changing grips, and the rear sight on the Caracal is part of the assembly that holds the firing pin & firing pin safety and that is roll-pinned to the slide. It's not that easy to change, and, my guess is that, given the critical parts it retains, it may never be considered a user-replaceable part by the manufacturer.

It's a great design if you like it just like it is, but it looks to me like it's going to be harder than most to accessorize. We shall see...

hardluk1 · October 17, 2012, 08:29 AM

I can say that with a old cross breed type holster i did not like for a glock 19 that the Caracal C I have fits it very well. They may not fit a full kydex holster like from black hawk but it looks that the leather/kydex IWB types will work fine.

Grab-a-gun sure has NO deals now with all higher prices than you show for your in hand price. . I did better with my LGS that there price are currently.

I thought I was going to hate the sights on my standard C model as my older eyes don't work well with most as basic 2 or 3 dot sights. I like a bit more light between the front and rear sight too. Gota say they work better than some I have now includeing glocks 17 sights.

All I think I want is a red fiber optic .100 wide front sight. That would be on my list with most any pistol. Caracal has red fiber optic sights just got to get the usa company to bring them here.

Urban_Redneck · October 17, 2012, 10:42 AM

Being a molded polymer frame, I don't think it is possible to change the grip

If you are referring to a product like the Grip Force Adapter for Glock pistols, it's not needed as there is no slide bite.

I like to tinker as well, though I have resisted up to this point doing a complete dis-assembly of the Caracal.

Roll pins are roll pins, as such roll pin punches and an armorers block should be used to remove and install them. Roll pins do have a finite life and should be replaced when damaged or exhibit signs of looseness. FWIW, HK, Sig, and many others also use roll pins, they became a standard in the late 20th century. Here's a roll pin punch set for $20 from Brownells.

The rear sight notch on my F IIRC is .118", the front sight width is .146", that makes for little light visible either side of the blade. I am fairly new to pistol shooting, I struggled with getting a consistent sight picture. At one point, I was shooting quite a bit high

, remembering my A5 slug gun... I realized I was "cheating" the front sight up to get a better look (I wear reading glasses) I digress

I thought almost daily about a new front sight or widening the rear .010". One day I channeled an old shooting buddy whose favorite refrain was "Just shoot the *&^$%#'n thing!" I focused a bit more on stacking the dots snowman style than trying to get the top of the blade level with top of the notch. POI came down and groups became smaller and rounder

I still think I will mod the rear or get a new front, but, I was relieved to confirm the old adage, "It's the Indian, not the arrow".

Without some better marketing, it will take some time yet for the shooting public to decide where Caracal will fit in the pantheon of combat pistols. I really like this pistol I bought virtually, sight unseen.

I believe the Caracal and the PPQ have seriously raised the bar for $500 combat pistols.

YMMV, Schools Open, Drive Carefully, etc

**Sam1911** · October 17, 2012, 11:11 AM

Wonder how many times I'll repost this:

Quote:

Remedial reading lesson:

Quote:

[Mod Talk: Let's drop the argument over the UAE and such. If you don't know anything about the CARACAL PISTOL itself, don't drag the conversation off into the weeds with off topic dross.]

hardluk1 · October 17, 2012, 04:10 PM

SAM1911 Who the heck is arguing

urban I to have to get some better punchs. Like you I will take it completely apart just to see whats up. Have blocks but my punchs don't have the right size.

I like the grips on these caracals ,a, or atleast the fit and angle. I did pull a inner tube sleave over the grip for a little added stickum.

Just got back from a buddies place and was shooting steel for the last couple hours. Those stock sights ain't bad but like you something needs a bit of help with more side light. I even like the straight 8 style. But I to wear glass and have " and have a old frame set with a lens for 27" focus to see the darn sights. Still only marjinal. bad eye sight su,a, makes it harder. A narrower front sight would be the simplist to muck around with for me. I called caracal usa this morn about sight options and the reply was !?!? He would have to check. Now after a couple hundred more rounds fired I am very pleased with how easy it is to shoot these pistols well. Got to weight now for the glock holster body to come in for my MTAC holster to see how that works out.

**Sam1911** · October 17, 2012, 04:21 PM

Quote:

SAM1911 Who the heck is arguing

Sometimes off-topic posts get "pruned" to keep the discussion focused. Sorry if the message is confusing after the thread is cleaned up.

If your post is still here, nothing to worry about.

Urban_Redneck · October 17, 2012, 04:29 PM

I need some glasses, I find it difficult to get clear focus on the top line of the rear sight. Jeeze, I'm only 47 and I'm looking for the geezer forum

tomrkba · October 17, 2012, 05:21 PM

I never buy newly designed guns. I have seen too many bugs across many designs from various manufacturers. I like to wait at least two years or more. I will wait on this gun, let some folks shake out the bugs and let a few people win competitions with them.

PabloJ · October 17, 2012, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimherb

I handled a Caracal at the gunshow today and was really impressed with how it fit my hand. I've read a number of review and comments that speak favorably of it. My concern is with parts and service. Are parts available?
Is there reasonably competant customer service somewhere?

The two I looked over had superior ergonomics and finish to the Glock. I chose the Glock because of track record, service, aftermarket add ons, and resale value. I switch guns like others do socks or underwear and do not want to loose half gun value right after purchase. I am surprised the Glock is still with me.

hardluk1 · October 17, 2012, 07:24 PM

urban redneck maybe change your handle to urban redneck geezer- hehe . Welcome to the bad eye sight club. I need to find the stick on lenes to put at the top of my shooting glass's instead of rocking my neck up to see my shooting bifocal.

tomrkba How long does a nato approved firearm need to be around to prove it any good?? NATO approved in 2006. Only new here.

pablo . understand for the quick to sell guys. I still have my firearms for the mid 1970's. Just keep adding few to the pile.

HighRoadRover · October 17, 2012, 07:28 PM

The Caracal F is going for $424 on Bud's internet page.

It is an appealing looking pistol -- very clean lines. Early reviews indicate good fit and finish.

A lot has been said about the low bore axis, which to me is a real plus.

In a lot of ways, this is THE standard design today - striker fired, high capacity, polymer. Close to the FNH FNS-9, the Ruger SR-9, the S&W SD-9, etc. So execution becomes critical.

The key points to be considered are the sights (which are a little different) and aftermarket support. If we have a downturn in gun sales following the election -- if gun sales just flatten out -- will there still be a place in the market for Caracal in the future? At the prices cited -- perhaps.

TennJed · October 17, 2012, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomrkba

I never buy newly designed guns. I have seen too many bugs across many designs from various manufacturers. I like to wait at least two years or more. I will wait on this gun, let some folks shake out the bugs and let a few people win competitions with them.

Then consider the Caracal. It has been around for over 5 years

barnbwt · October 17, 2012, 09:55 PM

Quote:

I switch guns like others do socks or underwear and do not want to loose half gun value right after purchase. I am surprised the Glock is still with me.

Used Caracals for ~200$? Sign me up

TCB

PabloJ · October 17, 2012, 10:03 PM

You will have to part with $325+/-25 to get one. The $200 is the trade in value at LGS.

JohnKSa · October 17, 2012, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Being a molded polymer frame, I don't think it is possible to change the grip If you are referring to a product like the Grip Force Adapter for Glock pistols, it's not needed as there is no slide bite.

No plans or desire to change the grips--my comment was about changing the sights and I was just pointing out that next to changing the grips, changing the sights is probably the most common mod made to pistols.

Quote:

Roll pins are roll pins, as such roll pin punches and an armorers block should be used to remove and install them. Roll pins do have a finite life and should be replaced when damaged or exhibit signs of looseness. FWIW, HK, Sig, and many others also use roll pins, they became a standard in the late 20th century. Here's a roll pin punch set for $20 from Brownells.

I have a roll pin punch set--probably the one you mentioned although it's been awhile and I can't remember now where I purchased it.

What I don't have is a set of replacement roll pins for the Caracal. And it's not for lack of trying. I was able to locate a source for some of the pins (although they wanted minimum orders in the hundreds of pins the prices were fairly reasonable) but at least one pin size is nonstandard in the roll pin standard used for the particular part and I can't find it anywhere.

You are correct that roll pins are commonly used, but that doesn't make me like them any more.

You are also correct that they should be replaced when they are damaged or exhibit signs of looseness. The problem is that you typically find those things out when you remove the pins--which means that the prudent course of action is not to remove the pins until you have replacements on hand.

Shuler13 · October 21, 2012, 05:16 AM

So, there is a recall on "a small number" of the C and F models. For those affected, you get a free mag for sending it in. Seems like they are trying to do right. Here is the release from Www.caracal-usa.com:

CARACAL F AND C PISTOL SAFETY WARNING AND RECALL NOTICECaracal USA has determined a potential condition of the trigger unit in a very limited number of Caracal F and C pistols that could possibly allow the pistol to fire when dropped onto a hard surface with a round in the chamber. Although Caracal USA has not received any reports of injuries, it is initiating this voluntary recall to protect the safety of its customers because of the remote possibility of an unintentional discharge occurring. The affected Caracal pistols have serial numbers that begin with B, C, F, L, or M. If your pistol's serial number begins with one of these letters, please follow the following steps. Only the Caracal F and C pistols with the serial numbers identified above are affected by this recall. If your pistol has a different serial number, it is not subject to the recall. If you own a Caracal F or C pistol with a serial number identified as being affected by this recall, please do not load or fire your Caracal F or C pistol and contact us immediately to arrange to have the trigger unit replaced, completely free of charge, using the following steps: Step 1 - Contact us at 205-655-7050 (Monday-Friday 8-5 Central Standard Time), or at info@caracal-usa.com and provide the model and serial number of your pistol. Step 2 - After contacting us, we will send you a prepaid overnight shipping box with instructions so that you can return your pistol to us, free of charge. Step 3 - Your firearm will be returned as quickly and efficiently as possible. We apologize for any inconvenience that this may cause, and to thank you for your patience and cooperation, we will send you a free magazine when we return your pistol to you. For more information, you may visit www.caracal-usa.com or call Caracal USA at 205-655-7050

breacher · October 21, 2012, 12:11 PM

way back a few years ago when the rumors about this pistol started over at the Steyr Club forum (they now have a Caracal sub-forum) they were talking about a 40 cal and a 357 Sig caliber version to soon follow the 9mm. still waiting....................

after handling one at the LGS I was pretty impressed but a little concerned on how to install night sights. never seen a striker pistol with the rear sight incorporated into the slide striker plate cover.

October 16, 2012, 02:11 AM	#30
Water-Man Member Join Date: March 22, 2008 Location: North Georgia & South Florida Posts: 1,577	Caracal is supposed to be making a sub-compact available shortly. __________________ PROUD TO BE A VETERAN

October 17, 2012, 05:21 PM	#41
tomrkba Member Join Date: May 30, 2010 Posts: 750	I never buy newly designed guns. I have seen too many bugs across many designs from various manufacturers. I like to wait at least two years or more. I will wait on this gun, let some folks shake out the bugs and let a few people win competitions with them. __________________ A people who live by The Golden Rule have no need for gun control laws, TSA checkpoints, a welfare system, or government run healthcare.

October 17, 2012, 10:03 PM	#47
PabloJ Member Join Date: October 17, 2010 Posts: 2,888	You will have to part with $325+/-25 to get one. The $200 is the trade in value at LGS. Last edited by PabloJ; October 17, 2012 at 10:17 PM.

October 15, 2012, 06:19 PM	#27
hardluk1 Member Join Date: March 27, 2009 Location: nc mountains Posts: 3,627	Well i have my caracal C model in hand and I have to say the level of finsh from the milling to the metal finish is at a higher level than many handguns out there. I replaced a glock 17 with this. Shorter 2.63" reach to the trigger and thinner where you reach at the same 1.100" as the slide . Only fired a few shoots out back but what reviews have said about recoil seem true enought. Very little snap with +P 124gr loads. Tomorrow a trip to the range to run a few hundred rounds thru it. Mine was $431 with tax.

October 16, 2012, 01:12 AM	#29
C0untZer0 Member Join Date: December 7, 2010 Location: Illinois Posts: 891	They can be had for a smidge under $400.00 That's pretty cheap !

October 16, 2012, 11:18 AM	#31
Urban_Redneck Member Join Date: May 10, 2012 Posts: 101	I just purchased a Caracal C ($419 shipped). Hopefully, it will arrive before the weekend I have every confidence that it will be as accurate and reliable as my F that has put 2700+ malfunction-free rounds downrange. Extra mags were $26.95, I wish I had the forethought to buy some C mags when Centerfire Systems was blowing them out $19.99. Caracal's marketing is still lacking. Hopefully, 2013 will be better. YMMV

October 16, 2012, 04:27 PM	#32
hardluk1 Member Join Date: March 27, 2009 Location: nc mountains Posts: 3,627	urban redneck do you still have pay a ffl fee. Went to the range a got a 125 rounds fired and am more than pleased with my C model. Good trigger and easy to shoot well even when only there to simple run rounds thru it. Fits a old cross beerd glock holster great too. Mine came from lipsey thru waffen works, early pistol with a 2 digit serial number. Styer could do better getting it to the hands of more wholesalers. None of my lgs normal wholesale dealers stock or deal with them or styer .

October 16, 2012, 09:36 PM	#33
Urban_Redneck Member Join Date: May 10, 2012 Posts: 101	Long story short....The dealer I bought my F from in May, ordered two at that time. He charged me approx $490 out the door. He has $500 on the remaining F. I really wanted to try out the C, so I went to several other shops and the best I could do was $489 + Tax and they would have to order it. Well hell, I asked around at my club and found a couple of dealers that do transfers for $20- $35. I checked on the www and found that the $20 transfer FFL dealer is on file with grab-a-gun... a couple of clicks... $419.99, shipped Done! I ordered some extra mags from JG sales. http://images.thehighroad.org/smilies/shocker.gif I'm taking a 500 round training course Saturday, that will be the most I've run it without cleaning -should be a good test. It would be great if the C would show up before then. It would be nice to have more holster options. However, Steve at RKBA Holsters made me a nice Kydex rig for my F. If the C pistol is as good as the F, I'll get an IWB holster from him. As to the marketing, aftermarket, etc. Remember; voices create choices Want (front) sight options? Call Brownells, Ameriglo, Trjicon, etc. Need a holster call your favorite holster makers. Manufacturers and dealers won't develop or stock products if there is no demand. YMMV

October 17, 2012, 08:29 AM	#35
hardluk1 Member Join Date: March 27, 2009 Location: nc mountains Posts: 3,627	I can say that with a old cross breed type holster i did not like for a glock 19 that the Caracal C I have fits it very well. They may not fit a full kydex holster like from black hawk but it looks that the leather/kydex IWB types will work fine. Grab-a-gun sure has NO deals now with all higher prices than you show for your in hand price. . I did better with my LGS that there price are currently. I thought I was going to hate the sights on my standard C model as my older eyes don't work well with most as basic 2 or 3 dot sights. I like a bit more light between the front and rear sight too. Gota say they work better than some I have now includeing glocks 17 sights. All I think I want is a red fiber optic .100 wide front sight. That would be on my list with most any pistol. Caracal has red fiber optic sights just got to get the usa company to bring them here.

October 17, 2012, 10:42 AM	#36
Urban_Redneck Member Join Date: May 10, 2012 Posts: 101	Being a molded polymer frame, I don't think it is possible to change the grip If you are referring to a product like the Grip Force Adapter for Glock pistols, it's not needed as there is no slide bite. I like to tinker as well, though I have resisted up to this point doing a complete dis-assembly of the Caracal. Roll pins are roll pins, as such roll pin punches and an armorers block should be used to remove and install them. Roll pins do have a finite life and should be replaced when damaged or exhibit signs of looseness. FWIW, HK, Sig, and many others also use roll pins, they became a standard in the late 20th century. Here's a roll pin punch set for $20 from Brownells. The rear sight notch on my F IIRC is .118", the front sight width is .146", that makes for little light visible either side of the blade. I am fairly new to pistol shooting, I struggled with getting a consistent sight picture. At one point, I was shooting quite a bit high , remembering my A5 slug gun... I realized I was "cheating" the front sight up to get a better look (I wear reading glasses) I digress I thought almost daily about a new front sight or widening the rear .010". One day I channeled an old shooting buddy whose favorite refrain was "Just shoot the *&^$%#'n thing!" I focused a bit more on stacking the dots snowman style than trying to get the top of the blade level with top of the notch. POI came down and groups became smaller and rounder I still think I will mod the rear or get a new front, but, I was relieved to confirm the old adage, "It's the Indian, not the arrow". Without some better marketing, it will take some time yet for the shooting public to decide where Caracal will fit in the pantheon of combat pistols. I really like this pistol I bought virtually, sight unseen. I believe the Caracal and the PPQ have seriously raised the bar for $500 combat pistols. YMMV, Schools Open, Drive Carefully, etc

October 17, 2012, 04:10 PM	#38
hardluk1 Member Join Date: March 27, 2009 Location: nc mountains Posts: 3,627	SAM1911 Who the heck is arguing urban I to have to get some better punchs. Like you I will take it completely apart just to see whats up. Have blocks but my punchs don't have the right size. I like the grips on these caracals ,a, or atleast the fit and angle. I did pull a inner tube sleave over the grip for a little added stickum. Just got back from a buddies place and was shooting steel for the last couple hours. Those stock sights ain't bad but like you something needs a bit of help with more side light. I even like the straight 8 style. But I to wear glass and have " and have a old frame set with a lens for 27" focus to see the darn sights. Still only marjinal. bad eye sight su,a, makes it harder. A narrower front sight would be the simplist to muck around with for me. I called caracal usa this morn about sight options and the reply was !?!? He would have to check. Now after a couple hundred more rounds fired I am very pleased with how easy it is to shoot these pistols well. Got to weight now for the glock holster body to come in for my MTAC holster to see how that works out.

October 17, 2012, 04:29 PM	#40
Urban_Redneck Member Join Date: May 10, 2012 Posts: 101	I need some glasses, I find it difficult to get clear focus on the top line of the rear sight. Jeeze, I'm only 47 and I'm looking for the geezer forum

October 17, 2012, 07:24 PM	#43
hardluk1 Member Join Date: March 27, 2009 Location: nc mountains Posts: 3,627	urban redneck maybe change your handle to urban redneck geezer- hehe . Welcome to the bad eye sight club. I need to find the stick on lenes to put at the top of my shooting glass's instead of rocking my neck up to see my shooting bifocal. tomrkba How long does a nato approved firearm need to be around to prove it any good?? NATO approved in 2006. Only new here. pablo . understand for the quick to sell guys. I still have my firearms for the mid 1970's. Just keep adding few to the pile.

October 17, 2012, 07:28 PM	#44
HighRoadRover Member Join Date: September 19, 2012 Posts: 20	The Caracal F is going for $424 on Bud's internet page. It is an appealing looking pistol -- very clean lines. Early reviews indicate good fit and finish. A lot has been said about the low bore axis, which to me is a real plus. In a lot of ways, this is THE standard design today - striker fired, high capacity, polymer. Close to the FNH FNS-9, the Ruger SR-9, the S&W SD-9, etc. So execution becomes critical. The key points to be considered are the sights (which are a little different) and aftermarket support. If we have a downturn in gun sales following the election -- if gun sales just flatten out -- will there still be a place in the market for Caracal in the future? At the prices cited -- perhaps.

October 21, 2012, 05:16 AM	#49
Shuler13 Member Join Date: December 13, 2011 Location: Austin Posts: 225	So, there is a recall on "a small number" of the C and F models. For those affected, you get a free mag for sending it in. Seems like they are trying to do right. Here is the release from Www.caracal-usa.com: CARACAL F AND C PISTOL SAFETY WARNING AND RECALL NOTICECaracal USA has determined a potential condition of the trigger unit in a very limited number of Caracal F and C pistols that could possibly allow the pistol to fire when dropped onto a hard surface with a round in the chamber. Although Caracal USA has not received any reports of injuries, it is initiating this voluntary recall to protect the safety of its customers because of the remote possibility of an unintentional discharge occurring. The affected Caracal pistols have serial numbers that begin with B, C, F, L, or M. If your pistol's serial number begins with one of these letters, please follow the following steps. Only the Caracal F and C pistols with the serial numbers identified above are affected by this recall. If your pistol has a different serial number, it is not subject to the recall. If you own a Caracal F or C pistol with a serial number identified as being affected by this recall, please do not load or fire your Caracal F or C pistol and contact us immediately to arrange to have the trigger unit replaced, completely free of charge, using the following steps: Step 1 - Contact us at 205-655-7050 (Monday-Friday 8-5 Central Standard Time), or at info@caracal-usa.com and provide the model and serial number of your pistol. Step 2 - After contacting us, we will send you a prepaid overnight shipping box with instructions so that you can return your pistol to us, free of charge. Step 3 - Your firearm will be returned as quickly and efficiently as possible. We apologize for any inconvenience that this may cause, and to thank you for your patience and cooperation, we will send you a free magazine when we return your pistol to you. For more information, you may visit www.caracal-usa.com or call Caracal USA at 205-655-7050

October 21, 2012, 12:11 PM	#50
breacher Member Join Date: August 16, 2009 Posts: 151	way back a few years ago when the rumors about this pistol started over at the Steyr Club forum (they now have a Caracal sub-forum) they were talking about a 40 cal and a 357 Sig caliber version to soon follow the 9mm. still waiting.................... after handling one at the LGS I was pretty impressed but a little concerned on how to install night sights. never seen a striker pistol with the rear sight incorporated into the slide striker plate cover.