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Old August 24, 2014, 08:05 PM   #76
bikemutt
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I've read i-594 cover to cover and am wondering what other Washingtonians consider the most innocuous elements, and the most odius?
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Old August 25, 2014, 01:57 PM   #77
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There is nothing in the 18 pages of this proposed law that I like. There is not one thing in it I would vote for if it was all by itself. So, nothing more innocuous or odious.

Last edited by 2bfree; August 25, 2014 at 02:32 PM.
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Old August 25, 2014, 11:04 PM   #78
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Originally Posted by 2bfree View Post
There is nothing in the 18 pages of this proposed law that I like. There is not one thing in it I would vote for if it was all by itself. So, nothing more innocuous or odious.
I'm not voting for it either but you and I plus two or three friends aren't going to make it go down to defeat. Even the best Trojan horse has an Achilles heal, if we don't identify that come November, you know the rest of the story. These guys have mega millions to push their message, we don't.
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Old August 26, 2014, 11:35 AM   #79
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I read Bill Gates is jumping on the Bloomberg wagon contributing $1M. I wonder where the pro 2A Billionaires are.
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Old August 26, 2014, 03:07 PM   #80
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I'm not voting for it either but you and I plus two or three friends aren't going to make it go down to defeat. Even the best Trojan horse has an Achilles heal, if we don't identify that come November, you know the rest of the story. These guys have mega millions to push their message, we don't.
The Trogan here is all media, radio, tv, print, is being sold as just a background checks law. No mention that it also includes registration with the state all future handgun transfers, a 10 day waiting period, no longer being able to take a friend to the range and let him try your gun, being able to loan a hundgun to a daughter if she is being stalked, also no exclusion for those who have a CPL having already passed a more intensive BGC + finger printing.
Those are just a few of the things I 594 will do. I have no idea at this point how to beat it. They have over 6 million so far and the media is not going to change.
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Old August 26, 2014, 04:00 PM   #81
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Yep, it's terrible.

Share this information with all WA voters.

https://www.voteno594.com/initiative-594/
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Old August 26, 2014, 08:56 PM   #82
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Click here for Nasty anti-gun opinion propaganda piece

(URL actually contained foul language so I embedded the link)


Ugh. Definitely confirms Bill gates at 1 million, but also indicates Paul Allen (microsoft co-founder) kicked in another $500,000.
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Old August 26, 2014, 09:03 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TMCCOY View Post
I read Bill Gates is jumping on the Bloomberg wagon contributing $1M. I wonder where the pro 2A Billionaires are.
Here is the article

Bill Gates, wife give $1 million to gun control

This story even made the website of the local NBC affiliate in Cincinnati, WLWT.

http://www.wlwt.com/money/bill-gates...739896#!bKMBbA

"Previously, Microsoft co-founder Paul Allen gave $500,000 to the group, while recently retired Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer gave $250,000 and his wife Connie contributed $330,000.

It's not just Microsoft billionaires throwing big bucks at the gun control campaign. Tech venture capitalist Nick Hanauer contributed an additional $1 million, according to the filing, on top of his earlier contributions of $335,000."


.
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Old August 26, 2014, 09:25 PM   #84
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One theory I have for this "giving" is the NRA has traditionally been the 800 lb giving gorilla in the room, essentially swooping in to convince voters and congress critters to dump the proposal de jour at the last minute.

Well, NRA went bat-breath after President Obama, they still do. I always figured this was a bad idea on their part, but I'm just a lowly member. Doesn't matter who your guy is, the group pounding him is the enemy.

Think about it for a minute, this is payback. They've watched the NRA-won game plays, they get it, timely big money wins every time.
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Old August 27, 2014, 01:21 AM   #85
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What are the chances of this passing?
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Old August 27, 2014, 05:22 AM   #86
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What are the chances of this passing?
Let's see - in one of just two states that managed to legalize pot, WA is fairly liberal. Colorado has fallen to anti-gunners in the last decade. There's a good chance WA falls too unless people get out in droves to fight these idiots.
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Old August 27, 2014, 10:34 AM   #87
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Originally Posted by Praxidike View Post
What are the chances of this passing?
The best hope for defeating I-594 is passing I-591. 591 essentially says WA will not adopt any transfer requirements that exceed those required under federal law. It would effectively neuter 594. The rabid anti-gunners will vote for 594 and against 591, the reverse is true for pro-gunners.

So, as usual, it will be the folks in the middle who decide the outcome, that's who the 594 ad campaign will be targeting, the ads I've seen so far are slick and decidedly mainstream in nature.

The 591 side needs to figure out how to get through to the same voter block. I wish them luck, most of those voters probably don't care one way or the other.
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Old August 27, 2014, 02:30 PM   #88
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the ads I've seen so far are slick and decidedly mainstream in nature.
All the TV ads that are currently running supposedly have no connection to I 594 . I have not been able to find out where they get their money. http://www.backgroundchecksmakeadifference.com/
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Old August 27, 2014, 04:21 PM   #89
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Ah yes, it's the old connect-the-dots scheme. Convince as many as possible that "universal" background checks reduce crime, save lives, then later, when time is getting tight, connect 594 with "universal" background checks. Never mind what else it does, the positive connection has been made.

About the only counter point I can imagine is connecting Bloomberg with an overbearing nanny, then connect him with 594 later, who knows, it might work.
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Old August 27, 2014, 09:49 PM   #90
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How about some out of state help? I for one sent money to Colorado.

https://www.voteno594.com/

https://www.voteno594.com/initiative-594/

Donate Here: http://wagunrights.org/
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Last edited by OilyPablo; August 28, 2014 at 07:07 AM. Reason: Typo
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Old August 28, 2014, 02:12 AM   #91
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This is a good example where certain people have more "dollars" than "cents" (sense)!
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Old August 29, 2014, 11:23 AM   #92
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Here is a list of myths about I-594:

http://pws.cablespeed.com/~pablomail//small594.pdf

By all means, print and distribute.
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Old August 29, 2014, 08:51 PM   #93
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thanks OilyPablo, good reference.
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Old August 29, 2014, 08:56 PM   #94
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Since Bill Gates has donated a gazillion bucks to the cause in WA, shouldn't we be boycotting Microsoft?
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Old August 29, 2014, 09:08 PM   #95
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Bloomberg just kicked in (another?) million dollars today according to local news sources.

Maybe boycott Bloomberg news too?

Look, boycotts will not work in this case. Maybe unwrapping outrage over having constitutionally protected rights sold down the river to the highest bidders will.

I smell the Achilles heal.
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Old August 29, 2014, 09:17 PM   #96
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I think both are a start.
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Old August 30, 2014, 01:09 AM   #97
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I was concerned at first, but now I believe that voters there should get what they are asking for. All they hear is "background checks for criminals" and "closing thew loophole for criminals" without reading or understanding the ramifications of the other things that are purposely NOT being promoted. To that, I say that they should get what they deserve which is going to be them or a family member with a criminal record. Once they realize everything they voted for, it will be too late.

Even CA isn't this strict when it comes to allowing other (friends, partners, family, etc) borrow or shoot firearms... I hope they get what they bargained for and the negative publicity, ranting, raving, and stories about WA soccer moms and dads who never been in trouble but are suddenly felons will work in our favor.
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Old August 30, 2014, 01:31 AM   #98
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I believe that voters there should get what they are asking for.
Who is this "they" you are speaking about pancho?

Methinks if this was you, you would not so willingly wish this on yourself. And gee thanks for that.
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Old August 30, 2014, 08:59 AM   #99
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Originally Posted by Praxidike View Post
I was concerned at first, but now I believe that voters there should get what they are asking for. All they hear is "background checks for criminals" and "closing thew loophole for criminals" without reading or understanding the ramifications of the other things that are purposely NOT being promoted. To that, I say that they should get what they deserve which is going to be them or a family member with a criminal record. Once they realize everything they voted for, it will be too late.

...
Most gun control advocates in WA are not worried as they don't expect to be affected by 594 passing as they don't typically have a firearm in the first place. (Yes, we all know there are gun control hypocrites who are against everyone else owning firearms) But anyhow, all the money being pushed towards 594 passing is not going to affect the pro-gun 10% or the ant-gun 10% vote. 594 backers are going after the votes of 80% who may own a firearm, but are undecided on how strict the law should be.

As a non-WA resident... I am hoping that if 594 passes that at least 591 passes as well ... just to gum up the works. Just making the numbers of each initiative close to one another (594 vs. 591) in the same election will undoubtedly cause some level confusion. As I am very far from WA and don't see local advertising, I wonder if 594 backers are advocating just "594 passage" OR "594 passing along with voting NO on 591" (??).

Polls don't matter; it's voter turn-out that maters.

chuck

Last edited by steelerdude99; August 30, 2014 at 09:11 AM. Reason: typo
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Old August 30, 2014, 05:44 PM   #100
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I vote in WA, but don't live there and haven't seen any of the ads. I'm sure they are completely sensationalized with lots of young kids playing and short on factual information. I wish we could pass a law requiring TV and print ads for political issues to only state the facts about the law without the spin. That might make people actually think about what they are voting about.
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