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Old July 14, 2014, 02:18 PM   #1
js8588
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Beretta ARX100 or Tavor?

In a few months, I'll be purchasing a 223/5.56 battle rifle. I generally prefer an AK style semi auto but AKs don't take AR mags unless you buy a magwell adapter. I don't want a DI AR and Piston ARs leave a bit to be desired from what I've heard. I'd love an AUG but the mags are proprietary and I prefer something that will take the ubiquitous AR 15 and STANAG mags widely available.

I thought about a SCAR 16 but the buttstock is a little more flimsy than I'm comfortable with for a rifle that's north of $2k. Bushmaster's ACR would be interesting (love that it comes with a heavy barrel) but they're owned by Remington. Given their spate of QC issues of late, nein danke.

I was absolutely set on the Beretta ARX100. Reviews are solid, it's light, accurate enough, and proven in the field (albeit on a limited scale). Then, one of my coworkers (an Air Force vet) decided to get a Tavor. I won't deny, I think they're sexy, but the accuracy reports have me wary. Then again, if they are good enough for Israel...

Here's my thinking at the moment:

ARX100-
Pros
Not ammo sensitive
easy to change charging handle to the right side (what I prefer)
reciprocating charging handle (again, personal preference)
light weight
2 moa or better

Cons
mag sensitive (won't take surefire or 3rd gen PMags)
16 inch barrel

Tavor-
Pros
18 inch barrel
takes all AR mags
Better BUIS
Home base is in my state
Israeli awesomeness
Shorter OAL

Cons
Ammo sensitive till after break in period
Questionable accuracy
Difficult to change charging handle to right side
Non reciprocating charging handle

In the end, the Tavor has more "cons" but the mag concern with the ARX100 is a big one for me. This is being bought with SHTF versatility, reliability, and durability in mind. My pet peeves with the charging handle isn't a huge issue and if the Tavor is accurate enough for Israel...

well, what do you folks think?
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Old July 14, 2014, 03:07 PM   #2
Jackal
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100% Tavor. I'd rather have a high end AR than the Beretta. The polymer Beretta uses feels like a first gen polymer AR lower, aka gumby. You can pinch the mag well together with 2 fingers, no thanks. At a price point of around $800, I'd consider the Beretta, but the quality isnt up to par with quality built AR's or the Israeli machine, especially at $1500. Both rifles are going to need an aftermarket trigger to be acceptable (which is pretty sad considering how easy it is to produce a decent trigger nowadays, heck, even $150 rimfires have great triggers now).
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Old July 14, 2014, 03:13 PM   #3
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I've handled and fired the Tavor before. Almost broke down and got one a while back. I didn't because I figured I could build 2 or 3 ARs for the same price.

I don't think the Beretta gives me anything over a standard AR in functional ability. If anything it's hindered by it's mag well. However if being able to quickly change the charging handle side is important it has that.

Between these two I'd choose the Tavor. Otherwise I'd build 2-3 DI AR style rifles and arm just as many people in my SHTF situation.
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Old July 14, 2014, 03:18 PM   #4
js8588
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The charging handle issue is only a problem insofar as I'm used to it being on the right in my VEPRs. So far, a compelling case is being made for the Tavor. The Beretta magwell issue really is a hangup.
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Old July 14, 2014, 03:28 PM   #5
HOOfan_1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by js8588 View Post
In a few months, I'll be purchasing a 223/5.56 battle rifle. I generally prefer an AK style semi auto but AKs don't take AR mags unless you buy a magwell adapter. I don't want a DI AR and Piston ARs leave a bit to be desired from what I've heard. I'd love an AUG but the mags are proprietary and I prefer something that will take the ubiquitous AR 15 and STANAG mags widely available.
If you want an AK that takes AR mags...SIG 556
They make AUG's that take AR mags
The FN FS2000 takes STANAG mags (not Pmags though..only stangard GI type mags)...and I personally would buy it over the Tavor.
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Old July 14, 2014, 04:54 PM   #6
1KPerDay
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Quote:
Originally Posted by js8588 View Post
In a few months, I'll be purchasing a 223/5.56 battle rifle.
Sorry, no such thing.

/troll
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Old July 14, 2014, 05:27 PM   #7
Fishbed77
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I'd choose the Tavor all day long.

I really don't see what the ARX-100 offers over a quality AR-15 that costs half as much. Even if you are a lefty, it's pretty easy and inexpensive to install ambi controls on an AR.

Quote:
I don't want a DI AR and Piston ARs leave a bit to be desired from what I've heard.
A quality DI AR (DD, Colt, BCM) will run as reliably as any other military-inspired semi-auto design.

Piston ARs designed to run a piston operating system (HK or PWS for example) are good-to-go, but very pricy.


.

Last edited by Fishbed77; July 14, 2014 at 05:48 PM.
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Old July 14, 2014, 08:27 PM   #8
briansmithwins
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You'd be doing good with either.

The Tavor had been out longer than the ARX, and there have been some early reports of loose rails on the ARX.

Personally, given your criteria, I'd do the NATO stock AUG.

Give the forward mounted left hand CH a try, you'll probably get to like it. It's not like the AR where the CH is up your nose or in your armpit when in use.

BSW
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Old July 14, 2014, 09:51 PM   #9
Highcaliber
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My vote goes to the Tavor.

I currently own two of them. A 16" lefty for the Wifey and an 18" right hand model. I like the fact that the charging handle does NOT reciprocate.

You can swap the Tavor charging handle to the other side without changing ejection side.

Don't see any accuracy problems that the OP mentioned and the 16" model is shorter than a 10" SBR fully collapsed.

IMHO, the ARX architecture is not in the same league as the TAVOR.

Last edited by Highcaliber; July 15, 2014 at 01:25 AM.
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Old July 14, 2014, 10:15 PM   #10
Auto426
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Quote:
A quality DI AR (DD, Colt, BCM) will run as reliably as any other military-inspired semi-auto design.

Piston ARs designed to run a piston operating system (HK or PWS for example) are good-to-go, but very pricy.
This. A good AR-15 is hard to beat, especially when you consider than a simple Colt 6920 can be had for half of what most of your other options would cost you.

However, if you want something different, the AUG you mentioned also comes in a NATO variant that accepts AR-15 mags. They may not be the easiest thing to find right now, as I understand that Steyr is transitioning from the current A3 variant to their new M1 variant with features different upper rail configurations.

Between the ARX-100 and the Tavor I would probably pick the Tavor. The ARX-100 is still relatively new and untested and I'm not 100% sold on the almost entirely polymer upper receiver just yet. The Tavor is much more proven and is already starting to garner aftermarket support here in the U.S.
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Old July 14, 2014, 10:44 PM   #11
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Do not ask me why, because I do not know, but there have been precious few end-user reviews of ARX's even though they are actively selling on GB and have been out for weeks. No idea why. As best I can tell, most purchasers seem to be either turned off by its "ugly" looks, or turned off because it is not ugly enough (i.e. not "divergent" enough from an AR to be worth the extra coin, unlike an AUG or Tavor). Also, conflicting reports about build stiffness, with a number of people saying it is markedly stiffer than the 22LR Umarex version (which makes me wonder if some of the people stating 'flimsiness' are in fact describing a 22LR which they assumed matched the full-power model).

As far as 'build quality,' it looks to be about on part with any other 'next gen' rifles; all of them AR-180's with carrier guide rails molded into plastic or aluminum receivers (G36, SCAR, etc.). Aluminum has certain benefits over plastic, but also certain shortcomings.

TCB
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Old July 14, 2014, 10:54 PM   #12
Cooldill
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I'm not sure what you mean by "Israeli awesomness" LOL, care to elaborate?

I am really liking the Beretta ARX100. I love how fast and easy it is to change ejection AND charging handle side, all without tools (except the tip of a cartridge).

I'm in the market for a 5.56mm carbine, and if the Beretta can be had for a reasonable amount of $ I would purchase that myself. The Tavor, while cool, doesn't really strike me for some reason. I'd probably go FNS2000 if I were going the bullpup route, but no doubt the Tavor is excellent and appears to be very well established by now in Israeli service.

Both guns are great, but I'm a big Beretta fan and I think the ARX100 is just a more appealing rifle. JMHO.

YMMV.
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Old July 14, 2014, 11:56 PM   #13
js8588
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Cooldill,

reasonable amount of $ is subjective. They are available for around $1700 http://eurooptic.com/beretta-arx-100...-jxr11b00.aspx
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Old July 15, 2014, 12:02 AM   #14
js8588
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This is a purchase that I will be making in early 2015 so, lots of time to mull it over and see how things pan out with the ARX100. The mag issue really bugs me and it's why the FN is out of the running. I frankly didn't know the AUG came with the option of a NATO stock but that, plus the availability of a 24 inch barrel has piqued my interest.

Leaning towards the Tavor at the moment but the Steyr has my consideration now as well. Keep the advice coming.
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Never believe anything written about you on the internet. This applies even, or perhaps especially when you yourself wrote it.

1942 Izzy Mosin Nagant
1936 Hex Receiver Tula Mosin Nagant
Vepr 7.62x54r
Rossi 45 Colt/410 Circuit Judge
Tula SKS
VZ 24
VZ 22/98
Super Vepr 308
Beretta PX4 Storm 9mm Subcompact
Ruger LC9
Winchester M70 Alaskan Stainless Laminate 300 Win Mag
Zastava M70 270 Winchester
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Old July 15, 2014, 01:22 AM   #15
FrankCastleThePunisher
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The Aug3 NATO stock version doesn't have bolt close release lever. You have to use the charging handle. I have both the Tavor 18" and the Aug3 CQC NATO, and am glad I have both but I give edge to the Tavor slightly b/c of its compactness and being able to hold against shoulder one handed for long periods of time without tiring.
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Old July 15, 2014, 03:19 AM   #16
briansmithwins
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I wouldn't describe the SCAR buttstock as flimsy. It has a plastic shell with the adjustment in length being done on a aluminum core that's notched.

Will it break if you beat on someone with it? Probably. But so will most other modern rifles and you can get much cheaper clubs.

BSW
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Old July 15, 2014, 03:28 AM   #17
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Spent some time on a FOB with Italian troops. Their run of the mill guys liked their ARX160s, some were still issued AR70s or whatever the previous weapon was designated as. The 160s were pretty sexy looking, never got to put one through its paces on the range.

For what it's worth, as noted above the conventional Italians on the FOB carried ARX160s and some AR70s -- the Italian SOF who were also on the FOB carried M4s.
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