Quantcast
Bowie knife help! - Page 2 - THR
THR  

Go Back   THR > Tools and Technologies > Non-Firearm Weapons

Welcome to THR
You are currently viewing our site as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions, articles and access our other FREE features. By joining our free community you will have, access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!


If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please visit the help section.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old July 19, 2014, 08:28 PM   #26
hso
Moderator
 
 
Join Date: January 3, 2003
Location: 0 hrs east of TN
Posts: 39,523
Cooldill,

The Case is far from a practical design, but it helped define what folks commonly think of as a "bowie" in spite of the fact it has no historical accuracy.

Glock Doctor,

I don't think anyone is questioning whether Randalls are any good or not, they're just not "bowies" (with the exception of the one intentionally done as such).


Sam,

For forged Randalls I'd disagree and say $200 is shy of value by about $100 if you didn't take their reputation and quality into account.
__________________
SAF Life Member/NRAILA Contributor
******************
Please Read The Forum Rules

TheHighRoad exists to provide a higher grade of discussion than is found on some other gun forums so antis and undecideds can see that gun owners and RKBA advocates are not the reckless misanthropes they tell everyone we are. Personal attacks, group stereotyping, macho chest-thumping, and partisan hackery are low road and hurt all of us.
hso is offline  
Old July 19, 2014, 08:36 PM   #27
Sam Cade
Moderator
 
 
Join Date: September 9, 2005
Location: Rural Kentucky, surrounded by Amish
Posts: 5,179
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cooldill View Post
I've seen the Case Bowie knife before, it to me is exactly what I'm wanting in terms of style. I LOVE Case knives. But, is this a real working knife, or just a decoration piece? Is it made of good steel that holds an edge, etc. ?
It's 420HC so while it is possible that it could be a functional knife (IMACASA makes great machetes from 420HC) I've seen half a dozen broken Case bowies over the years so I suspect that Case is running them too hard for much use.

I'd recommend you the Ontario raider Bowie for about 1/3rd the price but it has a durable modern handle construction so does not conform to your specs.

http://www.amazon.com/Ontario-Spec-M...s=raider+bowie


Quote:
Originally Posted by Cooldill View Post
Von Tempsky Bowie! <snip> Would it also be a good "working" knife?
You can do stuff with it, it is well constructed of quality materials but I don't enjoy using mine at all. It hasn't seen the light of day in two or three years.
__________________
Resolve to serve no more, and you are at once freed.-Étienne de La Boétie

Love THR? Help support it (and never see advertisements again) by becoming a Contributing Member.
http://www.thehighroad.org/payments.php
Sam Cade is online now  
Old July 19, 2014, 09:06 PM   #28
Glock Doctor
Member
 
 
Join Date: January 20, 2011
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 108
hso, I might agree with you; but, as I've already pointed out, nobody really knows what Jim Bowie's knife actually looked like. The most that can be said is that it was a large knife and, probably, had quillons on it.

That's it! There's little more that can be authentically stated. The Randall Model 14 is a much of a, 'Bowie' as any other large early American knife. Do I think that the original Bowie knife was closely designed after one of the early Colonial trade knives? No, I don't think Bowie would have spent his money on anything quite so basic.

So your best guess, or mine is as good as anyone else's. Perhaps what we're actually discussing here is THE POPULAR CONCEPTION of what a Bowie knife should be.
Glock Doctor is offline  
Old July 19, 2014, 09:26 PM   #29
ugaarguy
Moderator
 
 
Join Date: March 19, 2006
Posts: 10,491
Quote:
For forged Randalls I'd disagree and say $200 is shy of value by about $100 if you didn't take their reputation and quality into account.
hso, are Randall's really worth $100 more than a comparable Blackjack?
ugaarguy is offline  
Old July 19, 2014, 09:33 PM   #30
Sam Cade
Moderator
 
 
Join Date: September 9, 2005
Location: Rural Kentucky, surrounded by Amish
Posts: 5,179
Quote:
Originally Posted by hso View Post
The Case is far from a practical design, but it helped define what folks commonly think of as a "bowie" in spite of the fact it has no historical accuracy.
I call that pattern the "North American Falchion". They are pretty good choppers and the tang shape gives good grip security unlike the Von Tempsky.

An old carbon steel W49 was a much more functional version of the same basic design, especially with a short guard. The OP should be able to find one of those pretty cheap.

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trks...at=0&_from=R40

In a bit of parallel cutlery evolution:


https://antiqueswords.com/product-27...htm#ad-image-0
__________________
Resolve to serve no more, and you are at once freed.-Étienne de La Boétie

Love THR? Help support it (and never see advertisements again) by becoming a Contributing Member.
http://www.thehighroad.org/payments.php
Sam Cade is online now  
Old July 19, 2014, 09:53 PM   #31
Cooldill
Member
 
 
Join Date: November 19, 2011
Location: Kansas
Posts: 1,181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Cade View Post
It's 420HC so while it is possible that it could be a functional knife (IMACASA makes great machetes from 420HC) I've seen half a dozen broken Case bowies over the years so I suspect that Case is running them too hard for much use.

I'd recommend you the Ontario raider Bowie for about 1/3rd the price but it has a durable modern handle construction so does not conform to your specs.

http://www.amazon.com/Ontario-Spec-M...s=raider+bowie



You can do stuff with it, it is well constructed of quality materials but I don't enjoy using mine at all. It hasn't seen the light of day in two or three years.
Care to elaborate?

I have done some more research on the Von Tempsky Bowie and I really am liking it. It is made of L6 tool steel... is that a good thing?

So far I'm liking it the best of the knives I've seen, but if it isn't good for actual use than I'm not interested.
Cooldill is online now  
Old July 19, 2014, 10:23 PM   #32
R H Clark
Member
 
 
Join Date: September 11, 2011
Location: Alabama
Posts: 311
I don't know of a good bowie under $200. This is pretty close for a good 5160 blade.
http://www.shrewbows.com/bowieknife/


I wanted one so bad I started making my own. But I charge about twice that and you will know why if you build yourself one. 5160 is cheap and easy to work at home if you want to give it a try. I'll be happy to talk you through it. Just shoot me a PM and we can trade phone numbers.

Here are some of mine I made the first year I started.


R H Clark is offline  
Old July 19, 2014, 10:50 PM   #33
hso
Moderator
 
 
Join Date: January 3, 2003
Location: 0 hrs east of TN
Posts: 39,523
Quote:
is that a good thing?
Lord, YES, L6 is a "good thing", but that handle on that thing would produce enough hot spots to cook your blisters to a nice medium well.
__________________
SAF Life Member/NRAILA Contributor
******************
Please Read The Forum Rules

TheHighRoad exists to provide a higher grade of discussion than is found on some other gun forums so antis and undecideds can see that gun owners and RKBA advocates are not the reckless misanthropes they tell everyone we are. Personal attacks, group stereotyping, macho chest-thumping, and partisan hackery are low road and hurt all of us.
hso is offline  
Old July 19, 2014, 11:05 PM   #34
Sam Cade
Moderator
 
 
Join Date: September 9, 2005
Location: Rural Kentucky, surrounded by Amish
Posts: 5,179
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cooldill View Post
Care to elaborate?
Since the scales are prefect flat and smooth retention on hard cuts is poor. The scales are also relatively sharp edged and make for hot spots during heavy use.
It isn't exactly useless but there are lots of better choices for a serious tool.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cooldill View Post
It is made of L6 tool steel... is that a good thing?
Yup.



https://www.hudsontoolsteel.com/technical-data/steelL6
__________________
Resolve to serve no more, and you are at once freed.-Étienne de La Boétie

Love THR? Help support it (and never see advertisements again) by becoming a Contributing Member.
http://www.thehighroad.org/payments.php
Sam Cade is online now  
Old July 19, 2014, 11:07 PM   #35
hso
Moderator
 
 
Join Date: January 3, 2003
Location: 0 hrs east of TN
Posts: 39,523
Quote:
are Randall's really worth $100 more than a comparable Blackjack?
While that's a discussion for another thread - You're going to have to define what that means a bit more. Current Blackjacks? Current prices for Effingham Blackjacks? Original prices for Effingham Blackjacks? How about that Effingham Blackjacks were too low in price to begin with? Of course, neither the Randalls or the Blackjacks are any more accurate Bowies than any other wide range of what are called Bowies these day and a far sight less accurate.

Glock Doctor, I completely agree that THE POPULAR CONCEPTION of what a Bowie knife should be is what the thread is about and not the historical bowie either wielded by Jim Bowie at the 1827 fight that made him famous, the knives he and his brother had made in the decade subsequent to that, or even the popularized "Bowies" of the 1850/60s that capitalized on his fame since very few people are interested in the history that contrasts with their popular image of the bowie.
__________________
SAF Life Member/NRAILA Contributor
******************
Please Read The Forum Rules

TheHighRoad exists to provide a higher grade of discussion than is found on some other gun forums so antis and undecideds can see that gun owners and RKBA advocates are not the reckless misanthropes they tell everyone we are. Personal attacks, group stereotyping, macho chest-thumping, and partisan hackery are low road and hurt all of us.
hso is offline  
Old July 19, 2014, 11:14 PM   #36
Cooldill
Member
 
 
Join Date: November 19, 2011
Location: Kansas
Posts: 1,181
Quote:
Originally Posted by hso View Post
While that's a discussion for another thread - You're going to have to define what that means a bit more. Current Blackjacks? Current prices for Effingham Blackjacks? Original prices for Effingham Blackjacks? How about that Effingham Blackjacks were too low in price to begin with? Of course, neither the Randalls or the Blackjacks are any more accurate Bowies than any other wide range of what are called Bowies these day and a far sight less accurate.

Glock Doctor, I completely agree that THE POPULAR CONCEPTION of what a Bowie knife should be is what the thread is about and not the historical bowie either wielded by Jim Bowie at the 1827 fight that made him famous, the knives he and his brother had made in the decade subsequent to that, or even the popularized "Bowies" of the 1850/60s that capitalized on his fame since very few people are interested in the history that contrasts with their popular image of the bowie.
Yes I agree.

I should have said that! Sorry!
Cooldill is online now  
Old July 19, 2014, 11:18 PM   #37
hso
Moderator
 
 
Join Date: January 3, 2003
Location: 0 hrs east of TN
Posts: 39,523
Cooldill,

Not to worry, but that does put the ball back in your court to find images of "bowies" you like to toss up for us so we can actually help you find something in the price range you can tolerate.

I'm assuming you want a cross guard and a clip point? I recommend googling "bowie knife" and hitting images to sift through what's out there in the form of blade heights (big bellied vs slim), clip styles (long vs. short, flat vs. half moon), guards (S vs straight, flat vs rounded), grips (round/flat, coffin/straight/palm swell/...), length. After that we can talk about materials.

Makes your head hurt, don't it!
__________________
SAF Life Member/NRAILA Contributor
******************
Please Read The Forum Rules

TheHighRoad exists to provide a higher grade of discussion than is found on some other gun forums so antis and undecideds can see that gun owners and RKBA advocates are not the reckless misanthropes they tell everyone we are. Personal attacks, group stereotyping, macho chest-thumping, and partisan hackery are low road and hurt all of us.

Last edited by hso; July 19, 2014 at 11:23 PM.
hso is offline  
Old July 19, 2014, 11:39 PM   #38
hso
Moderator
 
 
Join Date: January 3, 2003
Location: 0 hrs east of TN
Posts: 39,523


As much as it pains me, the new Cold Steel Frontier Bowie might be about what you're looking for, after fixing the grip.
__________________
SAF Life Member/NRAILA Contributor
******************
Please Read The Forum Rules

TheHighRoad exists to provide a higher grade of discussion than is found on some other gun forums so antis and undecideds can see that gun owners and RKBA advocates are not the reckless misanthropes they tell everyone we are. Personal attacks, group stereotyping, macho chest-thumping, and partisan hackery are low road and hurt all of us.
hso is offline  
Old July 20, 2014, 01:29 AM   #39
Cooldill
Member
 
 
Join Date: November 19, 2011
Location: Kansas
Posts: 1,181
Quote:
Originally Posted by hso View Post
Cooldill,

Not to worry, but that does put the ball back in your court to find images of "bowies" you like to toss up for us so we can actually help you find something in the price range you can tolerate.

I'm assuming you want a cross guard and a clip point? I recommend googling "bowie knife" and hitting images to sift through what's out there in the form of blade heights (big bellied vs slim), clip styles (long vs. short, flat vs. half moon), guards (S vs straight, flat vs rounded), grips (round/flat, coffin/straight/palm swell/...), length. After that we can talk about materials.

Makes your head hurt, don't it!
I apologize, I did not realize that the term "Bowie knife" was such a touchy subject!

I guess I should state it better like this... I am in the market for a large, perhaps 19th century patterned or inspired, knife with a full cross guard. A 10-12" blade is preferred. A clip point is not necessary. I would prefer to pay no more than $250. Also I am looking for something able to do light tasks like cut cord wood and brush, vines, etc. and to provide emergency self defense against wild animals and human beings. The knife in quesiton may or may not conjure up the popular image of the word "Bowie knife".

The Svord Von Tempsky Bowie looks great, and I really like the profile of the blade. I like how the grips look but they don't very utilitarian. They look pretty slippery. Still I am digging the knife and I like it's rugged old world style a lot. I find these more traditional designs far more appealing than anything with black rubber grips slathered in matte black tacti-paint.

I am really sorry! I didn't know what I was getting into with this one. Thank you so much for the help! !
Cooldill is online now  
Old July 20, 2014, 08:23 AM   #40
hso
Moderator
 
 
Join Date: January 3, 2003
Location: 0 hrs east of TN
Posts: 39,523
I wonder if anyone has taken a BK-9 and put a guard on it?
__________________
SAF Life Member/NRAILA Contributor
******************
Please Read The Forum Rules

TheHighRoad exists to provide a higher grade of discussion than is found on some other gun forums so antis and undecideds can see that gun owners and RKBA advocates are not the reckless misanthropes they tell everyone we are. Personal attacks, group stereotyping, macho chest-thumping, and partisan hackery are low road and hurt all of us.

Last edited by hso; July 20, 2014 at 10:52 AM.
hso is offline  
Old July 20, 2014, 10:40 AM   #41
Derry 1946
Member
 
 
Join Date: June 27, 2011
Posts: 325
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cooldill View Post
I am in the market for a large, perhaps 19th century patterned or inspired, knife with a full cross guard. A 10-12" blade is preferred. A clip point is not necessary. I would prefer to pay no more than $250. Also I am looking for something able to do light tasks like cut cord wood and brush, vines, etc. and to provide emergency self defense against wild animals and human beings.

You may like to check out Sam Cade's excellent articles on machetes. It may be that the functions you describe above are better spread among several blades. Chopping wood and clearing brush sound like jobs for bigger tools. Emergency self defense sounds like it might call for a blade you carry at all times (since attacks are not always on a schedule of your making), and might call for a smaller blade.
Derry 1946 is offline  
Old July 20, 2014, 10:57 AM   #42
bubba in ca
Member
 
 
Join Date: November 15, 2010
Posts: 261
I got rid of most of my bowies when I discovered that a $10 machete works just as well. The only one I kept was a 40 year old veteran of yardwork campaigns and camping trips, a Western model 49. I trimmed the handguards because they got in the way, and added a lanyard.

If I were buting a ``modern collectible`` i would favor the coffin handle design or an original Boulder Western Bowie with the original swivel sheath. Neither with a high historical pedigree, but part of the culture and attractive knives.

If I wanted a whacker for field use, I`d look an an Ontario bowie, a cheap Western post-Boulder, or a Condor Hudson bay. i don`t buy chicon, so Cold Steel is usually not on my list, although I hear they are pretty good.

Meanwhile, I have a 12 to 16 inch machete in every shed and my truck tool box, my old Western is doing emergency letter opening duty in my desk, and my Hudson Bay is avaiting sharpening and will eventually get used for yard work or BBQs to test it out before it gets squirreled away in an emergency kit.
__________________
Birdshot is for birds;
Target ranges are for targets
bubba in ca is offline  
Old July 20, 2014, 11:32 AM   #43
Cooldill
Member
 
 
Join Date: November 19, 2011
Location: Kansas
Posts: 1,181
Thanks for the replies gang.

The Von Tempsky Bowie is just really calling my name. It's pretty much exactly what I'm looking for. I think it will do well for light camp work and as a defensive knife in the rare occasion it's needed, plus I just want it because it looks so cool!

The only thing that's keeping me away are the smooth wooden handles.

Is there any way to wrap leather around the handles to improve the grip? I've heard of some people using rubber or "tentacle wrap" but I'd rather keep it traditional if at all possible.
Cooldill is online now  
Old July 20, 2014, 12:04 PM   #44
Sam Cade
Moderator
 
 
Join Date: September 9, 2005
Location: Rural Kentucky, surrounded by Amish
Posts: 5,179
Cooldill, you could cut some checkering or other texture into the scales easily, but I think the real problem is the lack of a positive stop at the pommel end.
__________________
Resolve to serve no more, and you are at once freed.-Étienne de La Boétie

Love THR? Help support it (and never see advertisements again) by becoming a Contributing Member.
http://www.thehighroad.org/payments.php
Sam Cade is online now  
Old July 20, 2014, 12:23 PM   #45
Gordon
Member
 
 
Join Date: December 26, 2002
Location: central Kali.
Posts: 7,233
Ideas ......
__________________
Bring me two 1911s,
I want one for each hand,
We'll set sail with Colonel Cooper,
Though we never leave dry land,
All the goblins, I've forgot 'em,
I buried them in the sand
So give me two 1911s,
one for each hand.
Gordon is offline  
Old July 20, 2014, 12:42 PM   #46
jerkface11
Member
 
 
Join Date: October 27, 2005
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 4,744
Couldn't you replace the scales with something with a little texture and a bit of a hook at the end?
__________________
we can work together to enact commonsense improvements—like reinstating the assault weapons ban and closing the gun show loophole—so that guns do not fall into the hands of those irresponsible, law-breaking few. DNC party patform.
jerkface11 is offline  
Old July 20, 2014, 01:18 PM   #47
Cooldill
Member
 
 
Join Date: November 19, 2011
Location: Kansas
Posts: 1,181
I really like the one fourth from the left, with the brass crossguard.
Cooldill is online now  
Old July 20, 2014, 02:52 PM   #48
Piraticalbob
Member
 
 
Join Date: June 26, 2008
Location: Matthews, NC
Posts: 409
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cooldill View Post
I really like the one fourth from the left, with the brass crossguard.
That's a Western Cutlery W49. Used to be one of the few factory-made Bowies, along with the Case. It's no longer made, but it's easy to find on eBay.
__________________
Of course, that's just my opinion; I could be wrong. - - Dennis Miller
Piraticalbob is offline  
Old July 20, 2014, 02:58 PM   #49
hso
Moderator
 
 
Join Date: January 3, 2003
Location: 0 hrs east of TN
Posts: 39,523
Yeah, I was thinking a W49 would be about what you were looking for. Ebay has several and you want to stick with the pre W49s for the quality.
__________________
SAF Life Member/NRAILA Contributor
******************
Please Read The Forum Rules

TheHighRoad exists to provide a higher grade of discussion than is found on some other gun forums so antis and undecideds can see that gun owners and RKBA advocates are not the reckless misanthropes they tell everyone we are. Personal attacks, group stereotyping, macho chest-thumping, and partisan hackery are low road and hurt all of us.
hso is offline  
Old July 20, 2014, 03:00 PM   #50
Dirty Bob
Member
 
 
Join Date: July 10, 2003
Location: The Great State of Texas
Posts: 925
I'm pretty durn' sure that's a Western Bowie. They're available on the used market, and probably are well within your price range. I think it's a great choice for you, if you like the look. The blade is thinner than some other bowies, so it's light and fast. It can also slice and do more "useful" things than one of the bowies with blade thickness of 1/4-inch or 5/16" or even more. I have one of the old Westerns and love it.

I suggest you may also want to pick up a 12-14" machete for the weed-whackin', etc. I use an Ontario 12" a lot around the house, as well as a heavily-modded Cold Steel Heavy Machete and a Tramontina 13" bolo-style. I find that occasionally I encounter a nail in some wood, or wire snarled up in branches, or a rock when taking off stuff near the ground. A machete can shrug off this abuse and can be replaced if heavily damaged. The edge of a well-used 'shete often looks pretty rough, even though the dings have been filed out and the blade is sharp and ready for work. It would be a shame to beat up a nice knife with such abuse.

All my best,
Dirty Bob

Last edited by Dirty Bob; July 20, 2014 at 03:18 PM.
Dirty Bob is offline  
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:37 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
vBulletin Optimisation by vB Optimise.
This site, its contents, Shooting Reviews, and its contents are Copyright (c) 2010-2013 Firearms Forum, Inc.
IMPORTANT DISCLAIMER
Although The High Road has attempted to provide accurate information on the forum, The High Road assumes no responsibility for the accuracy of the information. All information is provided "as is" with all faults without warranty of any kind, either express or implied. Neither The High Road nor any of its directors, members, managers, employees, agents, vendors, or suppliers will be liable for any direct, indirect, general, bodily injury, compensatory, special, punitive, consequential, or incidental damages including, without limitation, lost profits or revenues, costs of replacement goods, loss or damage to data arising out of the use or inability to use this forum or any services associated with this forum, or damages from the use of or reliance on the information present on this forum, even if you have been advised of the possibility of such damages.