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Old August 29, 2014, 10:04 AM   #1
skyleader
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Is a suppressor and silencer one in the same?

I am in the process of getting my CCP and purchasing a Ruger Lc9S. However, I have some newbie questions...
Is a silencer the same thing as a suppressor? Is a silencer available for the Lc9S? Is it legal to have a "silencer" on one's pistol? Does such a silencer effect the trajectory/accuracy of the weapon?
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Old August 29, 2014, 10:06 AM   #2
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Suppressor is a PC version of silencer, which is what is actually in the NFA statute.

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Old August 29, 2014, 10:16 AM   #3
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Quote:
Suppressor is a PC version of silencer
Physically Correct?
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Old August 29, 2014, 10:19 AM   #4
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They are the same thing. Silencers are available for most any pistol or rifle. For a pistol you need to purchase a threaded barrel that extends past the end of the slide. For a rifle you can have the barrel threaded. It is legal on most but not all states. You full out federal paperwork and pay $200 prior to buying. The trajectory is affected by the fact that you should use subsonic ammo. The accuracy is affected by the fact you may not be able to see your sights. Talk to a silencer retailer for more info.
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Old August 29, 2014, 10:23 AM   #5
Jim Watson
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The inventor called it a silencer. The restrictive law calls it a silencer.
The Tactical Experts point out that it does not render the gun completely silent and therefore should be known as a suppressor. Tell it to Hiram P. Maxim who introduced them as silencers.

You can put a silencer on most any firearm. All that is needed is a threaded barrel. A lot of people will have one silencer and swap it around to whichever gun makes them feel the coolest today.

A silencer is legal but with many restrictions. You will pay several hundred bucks for the device, plus a $200 transfer tax and sextuplicate registration papers and a lengthy wait to get permission from the government to pick it up.

A silencer does not affect the trajectory of the bullet to any great amount. There is such a thing as "silencer boost" that can slightly increase the velocity.
It may or may not affect the mechanical accuracy; I have seen rifles being shot well at 1000 yards with silencers.
It affects the working accuracy. Unless you get a device with an eccentric bore - Ol Hiram made them that way, but it seems to be a recent rediscovery - you will have to have tall sights installed to see them and the target over the bulk of the silencer.

What it definitely does is affect the size and balance. Working silencers are pretty large, not the lipstick size devices seen in movies.
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Old August 29, 2014, 10:27 AM   #6
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Well, you got yer noise suppressor and you got yer flash suppressor, somewhat depending on who you're talking with.

To address other obfuscation, this link may be of interest...
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/201...a-flash-hider/
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Old August 29, 2014, 10:36 AM   #7
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thanks for replies

My knowledge of silencers/suppressors just went up 1000%. Your input is a great starting point for my further research.
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Old August 29, 2014, 02:23 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Watson
A lot of people will have one silencer and swap it around to whichever gun makes them feel the coolest today.
Yes, that's the only reason to own a suppressor.

As for Maxim, he also invented the silencer for the combustion engine but I've never seen an exhaust muffler sold as a silencer. He got the name wrong but then again he had a vested interest in selling his invention so named it to sell. Suppressor or muffler isn't quite as impressive as silencer. Suppressor is a far more accurate description as is muffler.
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Old August 29, 2014, 02:43 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1858
As for Maxim, he also invented the silencer for the combustion engine but I've never seen an exhaust muffler sold as a silencer. He got the name wrong but then again he had a vested interest in selling his invention so named it to sell. Suppressor or muffler isn't quite as impressive as silencer. Suppressor is a far more accurate description as is muffler.
In Europe, silencers are often called "mufflers". And car mufflers are often referred to as "silencers" in the UK.
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Old August 29, 2014, 02:50 PM   #10
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Even in the good old USA they call mufflers silencers.

http://www.nelsonglobalproducts.com/product_set/

I'll add that all of my suppressors are called silencers on the "type of firearm" part of the form 1's or 4's. Oh and you can also build them yourself, once you get the approved form 1 back.
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Old August 29, 2014, 02:57 PM   #11
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Does anybody have any experience with a suppressed M1 carbine?
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Old August 29, 2014, 03:22 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Theohazard
And car mufflers are often referred to as "silencers" in the UK.
Really? I was born in England, educated in England, lived there for 24 years, visit almost every year and the vast majority of my family is still in England, and yet I never heard, used or knew anyone else that used the term silencer for a car exhaust system or muffler.
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Old August 29, 2014, 03:43 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1858
I was born in England, educated in England, lived there for 24 years, visit almost every year and the vast majority of my family is still in England, and yet I never heard, used or knew anyone else that used the term silencer for a car exhaust system or muffler.
I admit that I've never been to the UK, but all I know is that many British English dictionaries mention it as an alternative definition, and many UK-based car parts websites use the term "silencer" to mean muffler.

Here are a couple of British English dictionaries that say "silencer" is another term for a car muffler:

http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/de...glish/silencer

http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dict...itish/silencer


And here are some UK muffler companies that refer to them as "silencers":

http://www.powerflowexhausts.co.uk/products/

http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/motors...aust-silencers

http://www.franklinsilencers.co.uk/products


And if you Google "exhaust silencer" you'll see a lot more results just like those.
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Old August 29, 2014, 03:54 PM   #14
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Theohazard, I can't argue with those links but I will continue to refer to a device that only offers 20 to 40 dB of sound reduction as a suppressor regardless of Maxim, the NFA, ATF or automotive parts companies. Had they been correctly named, perhaps they wouldn't have been classified as Title II firearms in the first place.
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Last edited by 1858; August 29, 2014 at 04:03 PM.
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Old August 29, 2014, 03:58 PM   #15
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Yeah, maybe it's a regional thing or something, or maybe it's a term that's mostly used amongst gearhead types. That might explain why you don't remember hearing it.
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Old August 29, 2014, 04:07 PM   #16
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It's probably because I could never afford to buy a car until I moved to the US and my older relatives are/were well to do and never worked on their own cars. I did own a pistol though.
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Old August 29, 2014, 04:07 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1858
I will continue to refer to a device that only offers 20 to 40 dB of sound reduction as a suppressor
Yeah, "suppressor" is more technically correct and "silencer" is more historically and legally correct. Both are fine.
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Old August 29, 2014, 04:48 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Jim Watson View Post
The inventor called it a silencer. The restrictive law calls it a silencer.
And internet trolls insist on calling it a suppressor.

Internet trolls are always right.


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Old August 29, 2014, 04:54 PM   #19
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As for Maxim, he also invented the silencer for the combustion engine but I've never seen an exhaust muffler sold as a silencer.
The Maxim Silencer Company is still in business making "silencers" for engines and industrial equipment. Not for guns, though.

"MAXIM® SILENCERS
Maxim Silencers engineers and manufactures industrial grade silencers for noise control in the oil & gas industry, the power generation market, and other industries needing dependable, long-lasting silencers."

"Founded by Hiram Maxim over 100 years ago, Maxim has extensive experience in design and development of noise control devices."
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Old August 29, 2014, 05:57 PM   #20
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The term most used in the circles I run around in is "can"...
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Old August 29, 2014, 07:03 PM   #21
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Jim Watson .....You will pay several hundred bucks for the device, plus a $200 transfer tax and sextuplicate registration papers....
Nonsense.
It's one easy to complete form with less questions than a 4473.
And completed in duplicate, not "sextuplet".
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Old August 29, 2014, 10:31 PM   #22
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OK, I am out of date. Copiers are cheap so you don't have to do as many carbon copies.

Does that mean the feds get through them any sooner?
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Old August 30, 2014, 09:37 PM   #23
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Quote:
Is a silencer the same thing as a suppressor?
Muffler and silencer are the terms used in the US code to describe a sound suppressor.

Quote:
Is a silencer available for the Lc9S?
Any 9mm silencer should work fine if you can find a threaded barrel to attach it with. I don't know of anyne who makes a threaded barrel for this pistol though.

Quote:
Is it legal to have a "silencer" on one's pistol?
Yes. Silencers are legal in all states but you must have a license in 13 of them. Where do you live? The rest either do not regulate them at all or require that they be registered with the BATFE. All legal silencers are registered anyway.

Quote:
Does such a silencer effect the trajectory/accuracy of the weapon?
Yes and no. Most modern silencers are made with baffles which do not contact the bullet as it passes through so accuracy is not affected unless the silencer is misaligned. The added weight affect point of impact so the sights must be adjusted for anything but very short range.

Quote:
A silencer is legal but with many restrictions. You will pay several hundred bucks for the device, plus a $200 transfer tax and sextuplicate registration papers and a lengthy wait to get permission from the government to pick it up.
Not that many. It must be registered and there are restrictions on repairs and parts replacement. It must be under the control of the owner(s) at all times; such as in hand or locked or with an authorized carrier (UPS, airlines)
The 22lr cans can be had for as low as $200 plus tax, and made for as little as $20. 9mm cans are more expensive though.
There is one registration form (in duplicate) with attached photos and fingerprint cards along with a single form 5330.20 attesting to your legal residence in the USA. Using a trust eliminates the mug shots and prints.
The wait is down to 3 weeks now. I got my last ATF e-form s approved in August in 3 weeks.

Quote:
Does anybody have any experience with a suppressed M1 carbine?
I do, it sucks. I attached a high volume 300 whisper can to my Universal carbine and I get so much blowback from the chamber it moves my hair and I have to wear double eye protection to keep from tearing up.

Ranb

Last edited by Ranb; August 30, 2014 at 09:45 PM.
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Old August 30, 2014, 09:58 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Ranb
Silencers are legal in all states but you must have a license in 13 of them.
This is incorrect: Silencers are only legal for individual possession in 39 states. And I don't know of any states that require a specific license to own one, but I believe that CA and IA allow you to own silencers if you're a dealer with the proper FFL.
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Old September 1, 2014, 06:25 AM   #25
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dealer with the proper FFL.
That's the license I was talking about. Until recently FFL/SOT's in MN could not own them either. The police had to obtain them from out of state.

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