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Old August 30, 2014, 02:46 AM   #1
TimboKhan
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On the utter uselessness of stun guns.

I have long railed about the uselessness of stun guns. Watch and see my point. The reactions range from apparent shrieks to something akin to delight. Certainly, none of the reactions indicate anything remotely useful in stopping a threat. Plus, it's just sort of funny.



The Taser Photoshoot Original: http://youtu.be/94Gw8WzHsRc

MOD NOTE: No Tasers were harmed, or even used, in the making of the video (regardless of what the video shoot title says).
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Old August 30, 2014, 07:49 AM   #2
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Yep, useless.
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Old August 30, 2014, 08:39 AM   #3
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Ok. So is this the effect you get with a LEO-type taser gun that shoots wired, barbed electrodes into a threat and then stuns multiple times as necessary? Don't think so. However, I agree about the handheld unit as shown. Useless!
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Old August 30, 2014, 12:54 PM   #4
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Timbo, did you mean to post this in non-Firearms Weapons instead of the NFA Firearms forum?
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Old August 30, 2014, 02:52 PM   #5
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I have one of those stun guns. I don't imagine I'd ever find it useful as a self defense weapon, but it certainly has made my more recalcitrant livestock straighten right out. I have a pig that got in the habit of biting my thigh muscle above the knee whenever I got in the paddock. I gave him a good whack with the stun gun, and he keeps a respectful distance these days. Likewise with my buck goat, who thought it was funny to push me into the electric fence at feeding time.
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Old August 30, 2014, 02:58 PM   #6
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That's not a TASER. That's a "stun gun." A Taser is much more effective.
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Old August 30, 2014, 03:47 PM   #7
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0MY...ion_3660193041

Background video.

We can clearly see that there are plenty of people who jump, but aren't freaked out when shocked. Clearly showing these stun guns are worse than useless since they delude uninformed people into thinking they can defend themselves with them.
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Old August 30, 2014, 10:15 PM   #8
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I did mean to post it in NFW, Ken.

Also, I KNOW its not a taser. Tasers are effective. Every once in a while though, someone will ask about the viability of a stun gun and my answer is always "not viable at all".

That the guy filming this called it a Taser... well, sadly that has become the catch all word for electric weapons such as these, but I am completely aware of the difference, which is why I said "stun gun" not taser.
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Old August 30, 2014, 11:21 PM   #9
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I cannot speak to the effectiveness of the stun gun in the Youtube. It allegedly puts out 300,000 volts. Notice that the focus of the photographer is to capture fun reactions - and his extended video is almost entirely about the photographic process, camera, equipment, lighting, etc.

I can speak to the 100% effectiveness of the Taser (R). http://www.taser.com/products/law-en...ent/taser-x26p

In 2010 or so I was in a military course and we were certified on the Taser x26. In a group of about 50 big, strong, brave Special Forces and support staff Soldiers, we had to shoot each other. All 50 (including myself) dropped like sacks of rocks for the 5 seconds of the pulses. There was no - meaning zero - ability to laugh, resist, fight back, or do anything other than lock up and fall down during the duration of the charges (5 seconds, 19 pulses per second, total of 95 pulses in 5 seconds). Zap, zap, zap 95 times in 5 seconds. It was the most horribly painful experience - it felt like what you imagine being electrocuted would feel like. The effects were largely worn off immediately afterward. The shockee felt 'weird' but could otherwise function within moments after the shock with no issues.

Watching others ahead of you only added to the horrific anticipation. The x26 - for APPREHENDING an individual or gaining compliance while making an ARREST is an excellent short range tool.

It is not well suited for civilians - we don't have backup, it is cumbersome and short range, no fast reload ability if you miss (and they are not very accurate - even at 10 feet on a still target, there were some people who managed to miss), and we aren't making arrests or apprehending others.

Hence, I would not carry or incorporate one for myself as a civilian. If there is a threat (perhaps a non-lethal but still serious threat, or an animal that I don't want to shoot like a bear or neighbors dog), I may use non-lethal pepper spray if I have it, allowing me to escape or avoid further escalation. Pepper spray - in my experience - is quite effective at debilitating nearly every person. Not to derail this, PS does have limitation on distance, wind, indoor/outdoor considerations, etc.

I assume this is directed largely at the female or anti-gun population who think a stun gun is a good alternative. We see these in gun shows regularly. I agree they are a poor alternative. If there is a lethal threat then the appropriate response is lethal IMO, and that means a firearm in most cases due to their proven effectiveness.
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Old August 31, 2014, 09:54 AM   #10
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Quote:
I assume this is directed largely at the female or anti-gun population who think a stun gun is a good alternative.
I don't know what you mean by "this is directed largely at...". They make it pretty clear in all three videos that it was driven by curiosity and the desire to capture people's reactions.
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Old August 31, 2014, 03:37 PM   #11
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"This" meaning the marketing and sale of stun guns. My next sentence, "We see these in gun shows regularly. I agree they are a poor alternative," was meant to further explain "this."
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Old August 31, 2014, 04:50 PM   #12
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Gottcha!

Thanks
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Old September 1, 2014, 11:04 AM   #13
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Quote:
that's not a taser. That's a "stun gun."
right!
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Old September 1, 2014, 11:27 AM   #14
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Folks buy these. I went to the gun show with some buddies and their wives. We separated to look at guns and the wives at the jewelry and junk.

They came back with stun guns. I told the husband of one of the side that they were useless. Let him deal with it.

Some folks don't want to use lethal force and think these are a better alternative.

I've been shocked with them in a H2H class to demonstrate how they are worthless. The instructor also recommended a gun class to the folks.
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Old September 1, 2014, 01:08 PM   #15
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redacted
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Old September 1, 2014, 01:55 PM   #16
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Blew up my B.S. meter

I was very curious about the O.P's heading.

Now I see that it was pure b.s. as they did NOT use a Taser at all.

A "hand stunner" is NOTHING like a Taser as was stated above.

I was Tased to pass Taser instructor school,and I watched my whole class get Tased.

NO ONE smiled or was able to do more than FALL DOWN !!!.

I then got to Tase my students to pass and be able to carry one ion the job .

I saw the results of the few hundred that I got to Tase,and the results of using it on the streets on perps as well as dogs.

NO ONE was standing or smiling after being Tased.

It is not the perfect tool to stop a violent attack as it can be bypassed.

BUT to any who would like to try it,I strongly that you go to your local police dept and ask to be a dummy for them,you will NOT ask twice if they allow you !.
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Old September 1, 2014, 04:20 PM   #17
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Quote:
I was very curious about the O.P's heading.

Now I see that it was pure b.s. as they did NOT use a Taser at all.
The OP title I read says "stun guns." Stun guns are useless. Tasers are quite a bit more effective.

On topic, the only time I see stun guns as a good idea is in states where it is hard to carry anything better.
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Old September 1, 2014, 04:35 PM   #18
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Stun guns are never a good alternative. Honestly, a yawara or a tactical pen or a kubotan is better.
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Old September 1, 2014, 07:50 PM   #19
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I agree with Timbo, a stun gun is a piece of junk and you're far better off with any other option.
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Old September 1, 2014, 07:58 PM   #20
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Stun guns are little battery-operated torture tools that serve little purpose than to make someone who wants to do bad things to you extremely enraged. And since the user must be at contact distance to use one, that's a really bad idea.


TASERS on the other hand. Tasers don't deliver pain, which is really all a stun gun does. Tasers drop your butt. Involuntarily. We evaluated some of the personal defense Tasers a few years back at the NTI. I voluntarily took three rides. I was completely incapacitated on each one. It ranks right up there with the twilight drugs the doc gives me for my colonoscopies. I don't care how strong your will is, you cannot fight that science.

Tasers are a valid option. Stun guns are novelties.
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Old September 1, 2014, 10:06 PM   #21
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I don't care how strong your will is, you cannot fight that science.
Seen it done.
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Old September 1, 2014, 10:48 PM   #22
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Care to elaborate on that AM?

Ken, a taser can be used for pain compliance if the cartridge is removed. A drive stun does not give total neuromuscular incapacitation like a probe deployment will, but it will cause a massive amount of pain and make you seriously rethink your behavior. I have personally experienced this.
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Old September 1, 2014, 11:50 PM   #23
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The three rides I volunteered to take weren't the pain compliance function.


I took three rides on the leads. First was for the experience. Second was to see if I could actually overcome it. Third was at the NTI as a volunteer to display the effectiveness.

I'm intimately familiar with pain.


Tasers aren't pain compliance. Taser hits controll you, and you are unable to resist if those barbs hit. Now, I know how to defeat that. I just won't post it publicly; not even here.
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Old September 2, 2014, 12:37 AM   #24
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I did before - watched an inmate take 4 Taser hits, two barbs, two contact hits, and all he did was yell and yank out the barbs. He gave up when he got bored. Saw another guy being handled by officer on the street, and it took two Tasers going at the same time to drop him. It's a HECK of a lot better than OC, and I wish I had more staff equipped with Tasers, but they aren't perfect.
Don't forget that Florida inmate who got soaked with oil based pepper spray, then Tased...he ignited. We lost our good OC to cheesy stuff over that. But, as The Joker said, "It's a hot time, in the old town tonight!"
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Old September 2, 2014, 04:37 PM   #25
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I saw another good video (I can't find it right now) talking about the differences. One thing I remember was the guy said even if you could get a stun gun that could unleash the intensity of a real Taser, you still have to be, like Ken said, right up in their personal space - and them in yours - to employ it. And you eventually have to turn it off when, again, they're well within arm's grasp.

And they don't just enrage the person they're being used against. They also enrage the vast majority of gun show attendees and vendors who know their ineffectiveness.

I like Lemmy's idea.

ETA: Tasers really work, but you still have to aim them and make good contact with the probes. Not perfect, but another good tool to have in your box, especially those who have a duty to engage in the situation.
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