7mm Rem vs. .300 Win. Magnums

If you are thinking elk at long range as an upper limit then 7 mag is more than enough. If you include the large 1000 lb + brown bear of Alaska then the heavier 200-250 gr bullets available then the 300's make sense. The 7 mags shoot bullets with good BC's fast enough to have a slight edge over 30-06 with virtually the same recoil. Most people can't tell the difference in recoil with similar bullet and rifle weights. To get the same ballistics the 300's have to move up to at least 20-25 gr heavier bullets and shoot them at about the same speeds which means much more recoil. The 30-06 with 150's, the 7 mags with 160's and the 300WM with 180's all leave the muzzle at about the same speeds. But the 160's from the 7mm will have much better aerodynamics and at 300-400 yards or farther will be moving faster than the other 2 beating 30-06 and coming pretty close to 300WM with 180's.

I've had both, as well as a lot of others in the past. My only current magnum is a 300 WSM and I doubt if I'll ever hunt with it again. Honestly I'd not recommend one anymore. There are hunters killing elk at 500-700 yards with 243's and 6.5mm rifles. I can't see putting up with 2X-3X the recoil to be able to kill one at 800-900 yards. I'd be very confident in my 308 at 400 yards or my 30-06 at 500 yards on anything in NA except the big bear. I'm not good enough to hit one any farther regardless of the caliber. Todays better bullets, optics, and powder have made the need for magnums under 375 caliber largely obsolete. The bigger calibers have a place on truly large game, but almost none are on this continent.

the 7mm mag will be able to handle any animal incountered in the usa and canada with the right bullets, it may be a little light for the big bears, while the 300 winchester will also handle any animals in the usa and canada and be better with the heavier bullet for big bears. i used the 7mm mag and the 300 win mag in africa on plains animals with good bullets with no problems, the bigger ones i used a ms 9.3x62 and the 375 H&H mag with big heavy bullets. it would be a hard choice for me to just own one, so i own several 7mm mag,s and several 300 win mag,s. eastbank.

Honestly? Neither, belted magnums are just becoming a joke, there's nothing in north America that a hot 6.5 (especially for long range), a 7-08/.280/.280AI/.284, or a .308/30-06 can't kill. I've been playing with copper solids on my .243 and the playing field is no longer tilted to the magnum boys. For way less recoil, the hottest 6.5 non magnum cartridges (-284 Norma and -06) will kill WAY out there with the appropriate bullets and the Swede is a moose killing machine. For competition, we're back to best b.c. low recoil. If you want to go magnum, go all out and get an ultra Mag or the STW because they're the only ones that might make it worth it. That being said, if you MUST have one of the two, go with the 7mm. I have the 300 and shoot the stw. You'll be equipped to kill anything at any distance YOU'RE capable of with a 175 gr pill with better b.c. and s.d than a 300 200 gr bullet and less recoil at about the same or better velocity if you load it right.

Barrel life of the 300 will be 50% longer than the 7mm.

The 7mm will be easier to shoot precisely; less recoil.

Both can have the same intrinsic accuracy capability.

Both are harder to reload fired cases to improve accuracy compared to the modern rimless bottleneck rounds producing the same muzzle velocities with same bullet weights. Damned belt is a nuisance.

I have both and have shot elk and deer with both. I prefer 30 caliber for hunting but as has been said I would not get either nowadays. If you must have a magnum go with the new short magnums. As someone else has stated I use a 308 for almost everything nowadays. My last three elk and numerous deer have not noticed that I wasn't hitting them with a 30 caliber magnum. If I thought I would be shooting beyond 400 yards then I would go with a magnum.

isher2000 said:

I'm planning to add 1 magnum rifle to my battery. The 2 mentioned above should both handle the game I plan to hunt at the ranges I can handle.

I'd like opinions on which of the 2 calibers in rifles of equal quality is inherently more accurate (some informal gun club match shooting is also on tap.)

If you want to discuss this in terms of shooting available commercial loads vs. shooting optimally constructed hand loads please feel free.

Thanks all.

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My wife shoots a semi-custom 7mm Rem Mag. Obviously, I shoot a custom .308 Norma Mag - virtually the ballistic twin of a .300 Win Mag. I'd guess that both rifles are equal in terms of inherent accuracy, but we've never really put them up against each other, let alone compared their inherent accuracies with commercial loads. We handload for both rifles, and either rifle will put 3 in an inch at 100 yards. When both rifles are loaded to their full potentials, my .308 Norma kicks a little harder than my wife's 7mm Rem Mag, even with virtually the same weight bullets (160gr 7mm vs. 165gr .308). But that's because when it's loaded to its full potential, my .308 Norma kicks 165gr bullets out 200fps faster than my wife's 7mm Rem Mag is capable of with 160gr bullets.
Anyway, either rifle will kill anything that walks in America, at any reasonable range. And if I was going to go to Alaska to hunt brown bears, I'd leave my .308 Norma at home and take my old .338 Win Mag anyway.
But I'm not sure how much of anything I've written so far answers your questions, so I'll just add this - there's a heck of a lot greater variety of .30 caliber bullets than 7mm bullets. Therefore, I'd have to guess, and it's ONLY a guess, that a person could eventually find a more accurate load for a .300 Win Mag than he could for a 7mm Rem Mag. - MAYBE.

For match shooting, the 7mm is lighter recoiling, which to me has always meant I could run a lighter rifle to sneak under the same level of recoil for stringing shots together on target.

Maybe I'm stubborn by nature, maybe I'm still young enough to be obstinate about it, but despite how many rifles I own/shoot/build for hunting and match shooting which are either non-belted mags or are smaller case cartridges - I will always have a 7mm and 300wm.

Lotta good info and advice already.
Personally I MUCH prefer shooting a fast 7 to a fast .30
While ive shot alot of game most of it is sub 200lbs. The 7mm kills as well as the .300 for game in this weight range, and does so more comfortably. My only experience on heavier animal are feral cows, and both my 7mag and 7stw delivered first shot kills with behind the shoulder hits (on 3 different trips, two of us were using my guns). My buddy with the .300 (he just bought it from me) shot one and lost it, and killed two others with one or 2 shots each.
Only difference was bullet positioning, so while the .300 delivers more energy its not immune to poor, or marginal (i think he got tue lungs on the one he lost, but once it crossed the fence we couldnt recover it), bullet placement.

Ive never shot competition, but ill volunteer to shoot targets with my 7s. Never would with my .300s, as they are just over my recoil comfort level.

I would buy a .338 Winchester Magnum. It really isn't that much over bore. Wish it didn't
have a belt. It is a fine cartridge for shooting just about anything in North America.

Zeke

Are you looking for a factory, big-brand rifle or a custom/semi-custom rifle?

I have to agree with the folks that are steering you toward a belt-less cartridge. 280 AI can be loaded to 7RM velocities and the 300 WSM with a long free-bore can do amazing things. But if I had to pick between the two cartridges you listed, it would be the 300 WM. Barrel life, match ammo, plethora of data and components.

Varminterror said:

Maybe I'm stubborn by nature, maybe I'm still young enough to be obstinate about it, but despite how many rifles I own/shoot/build for hunting and match shooting which are either non-belted mags or are smaller case cartridges - I will always have a 7mm and 300wm.

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Well, I turn 69 in a couple of weeks, and I'm still "obstinate" about my belted magnums. I'll admit it's a sentimental thing though, not a practical thing.

LoonWulf said:

Never would with my .300s, as they are just over my recoil comfort level.

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They're real easy to load down, LoonWulf. That's what I do. My .308 Norma doesn't kick bad at all with most of the loads I run through it.

Orcon said:

280 AI can be loaded to 7RM velocities

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So can other 28 caliber cartridges with less case capacity than the 7mm Rem Mag with higher max pressure specs.

I don't think the .300WM kicks overly hard. If you'd like to shoot something that might eat you, get it.

I like the 7mm RM for numerous reasons. If you don't plan on shooting something that can/will eat you, I would make that my largest rifle (says the guy with the .338 WM and getting a .375H&H...).


My $.02

Greg

.308 Norma said:

They're real easy to load down, LoonWulf. That's what I do. My .308 Norma doesn't kick bad at all with most of the loads I run through it.

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True, and thats not a bad way to do it. I always end up shooting heavy bullets and moderate to high velocity...its a personal quirk, failing, what have you, but i cant seem to NOT go for max or near max loads.

I run my 06 pretty hot, so loading down the 300 would bring it into 06 territory.

Like i said tho i DO def agree, loading down makes sense. In fact ive worked up some loads for my buddy with the same bullets and velocities i run in my 06. He seems quite enamored to the rifle.

zb338 said:

I would buy a .338 Winchester Magnum. It really isn't that much over bore.

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It's powder charges are 20% over 33 caliber's bore capacity of 55 grains of powder.

The 7mm has the most very low drag bullets made for it , with G7 drag coefficients below 1.0 , more than any other caliber & so are better at cutting the wind & easier to hit with at longer ranges. Check out Brian Litze article in the Berger's reload manual on G7 BCs. There aren't any .30s with a drag factor below 1. Now this is from memory & therefore is not as precise as Litze article. Read it & you will choose the 7mm REM mag

outlawjw said:

There aren't any .30s with a drag factor below 1.

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How about Sierra's 30 caliber 240 grain HPMK bullet?

Or Warner Tool Company's 30 caliber 200 grain Flat Line bullet?

Both are harder to reload fired cases to improve accuracy compared to the modern rimless bottleneck rounds producing the same muzzle velocities with same bullet weights. Damned belt is a nuisance.

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Since when? I neck size after each firing only bumping the shoulder back with a Redding shoulder die .002" when needed. There's nothing hard or troublesome about loading belted cases and it's very easy to achieve excellent accuracy. I load two belted cartridges, namely the .300 Win Mag and .375 H&H Mag. No problems here!

Neither, belted magnums are just becoming a joke

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Really? I wouldn't give up my .375 H&H for all the tea in China ... or my two .300 Win Mag rifles for that matter. .300 Win Mag sales are still going strong, and for good reason.

MCMXI said:

Really? I wouldn't give up my .375 H&H for all the tea in China ... or my two .300 Win Mag rifles for that matter. .300 Win Mag sales are still going strong, and for good reason.

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Absolutely!

Bart B. said:

How about Sierra's 30 caliber 240 grain HPMK bullet?

Or Warner Tool Company's 30 caliber 200 grain Flat Line bullet?

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Don't forget about the ALCO bullets, now.

MCMXI said:

.300 Win Mag sales are still going strong, and for good reason.

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And, I might add - there have been a few of those short, and super short magnums that pretty much fell on their faces before they even got started.

I say get a 7mm08 and be happy. It's only 200-250fps behind the 7mag, and does anything it will to 400yds.
If you're going after the big bears, you need a .375 anyhow.
I've got a .300RUM, but it stays home. My 7mm08 or lightweight.30/06 gets the nod for elk, the .375Ruger goes to Alaska...