Savage Arms

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cdb1 said:
Didn’t know you are in Spain. Did you state it somewhere and I just missed it? The reason I asked if you called them is because I’ve found I get faster and better service calling instead of Email or snail mail. Fortunately International phone rates in the US are a fraction of what they used to be. I started in Telecom in 1989 and to call Great Britain was over $3.00 a minute. Now it costs less than $.10 or is free.
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Oh, I just mentioned I was in Europe. Yes, phone rates used to be more expensive, ridiculously expensive until I discovered the call back services. Now US rates are cheaper too. Yes, I agree I perhaps should have rung the manufacturer, but OTOH it implied a nightmare of licenses and perhaps 6 months without the rifle and I needed it to compete in F-Class. The shortest way was to make shorter cartridges and they worked well :)
 
JO JO said:
you bought a savage rifle in spain ? new?used?
spain is not a gun friendly with a right to own gun place, is their a savage retail sales type gun store you bought it from ?
I dont know if savage can even ship a gun to you ?
lots of unknowns here perhaps vist your local gun store or smith if you have one a quick read makes me think spain is not like the USA where you can freely walk into a guns store a buy a gun ?
https://www.loc.gov/law/help/firearms-control/spain.php
savage maybe breaking a law if they sent parts or firearm to you ?
and I agree you need to call
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I bough a new Savage 12 F/TR at a gun store. To buy a gun here you need to have a license. There are restrictions preventing licenses to be granted to anybody but in general terms those guns that can be included in a hunting license are easier to acquire. In general terms, the only cases I know you can freely walk to a gun shop to buy a gun without a license are related to collectors and guns (or replicas) made before 1890 (up to two guns).

In the case you were asking, I can send neither a gun to the manufacturer nor to receive a gun from it. It has to be done through a special police office devoted to the control of guns. Once all the licenses and papers are done you must send in a courier to that office to pick the parcel and deliver it to the manufacturer. Yes, things related to guns are more difficult here.

These are the restrictions we face because our law. Let me add the fact I cannot buy even a humble trigger spring in the US is due to restrictive US export rules. Not to mention dies, stocks...
 
Owen said:
Franky, that price difference is doesn't go to Savage at all. It goes to the distributors and customs in your country, and the US. Because of ITAR (International Traffic in Arms Regulations) US companies can not discuss technical matters with you. The proper source of customer service will be through your dealer, or the company importing the guns into Spain.
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Yes, I agree, there are many people between the manufacturer and the customer, so they increase prices.
Paradoxically, in some cases SP -> US flow have the opposite effect. Spanish CETME, for instance were sold to US customers for less than the 50% of the Spaniards' cost. Magic effects of all those parts in the middle!
 
Franky50 said:
As I am writing these lines I have just checked today's prices for my rifle:
US $ $1,195.00; € 1,755.00 = US $ 2131,67 thus 78% more if I am not mistaken. One would expect higher price would imply better customer care but it is not the case.
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It's a smaller market and less profitable on volume, so it's not going to get specialty attention. The higher price likely doesn't reflect any longer profit margin to the company, just knowing what manufacturers have to deal with for ITAR and export excises.
 
Varminterror said:
It's a smaller market and less profitable on volume, so it's not going to get specialty attention. The higher price likely doesn't reflect any longer profit margin to the company, just knowing what manufacturers have to deal with for ITAR and export excises.
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I agree with you. My point was that if a high final price will keep manufacturer's market small then a bad communication with the end customer will only make it worse.
 
NIGHTLORD40K said:
Aside from letting the lawyers redesign their logo......I think Savage is the most get'r done, All-American gun company still around!
Now if only we could get them start making their neat-o pistols again.....:thumbup:
View attachment 774373
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Not a fan of lawyers, but the name and logo together could definitely be offensive, and I’m not even Native American. I think political correctness has certainly gotten out of control overall, but I have to admit I always cringed a little at the combination of Savage paired with an image of an Indian.
 
69Precision said:
Not a fan of lawyers, but the name and logo together could definitely be offensive, and I’m not even Native American. I think political correctness has certainly gotten out of control overall, but I have to admit I always cringed a little at the combination of Savage paired with an image of an Indian.
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I have no problem with their new logo.
 
69Precision said:
Not a fan of lawyers, but the name and logo together could definitely be offensive, and I’m not even Native American. I think political correctness has certainly gotten out of control overall, but I have to admit I always cringed a little at the combination of Savage paired with an image of an Indian.
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You don't say.
 
I think my Ojibway-Chippewa children would be proud to be associated with strength, power and accuracy. Fortunately they have the protection of squeamish "Caucasians", who would smite their image and history from the Earth. History is not for the squeamish. Nor is the future.
 
I’m sure they would be proud to be associated with those attributes, as would anyone. Of course we both know I wasn’t referring to that. The question is would they be proud to be called savages, especially in the context in which it was coined. But if they are cool with it, great.
Demi-human said:
I think my Ojibway-Chippewa children would be proud to be associated with strength, power and accuracy. Fortunately they have the protection of squeamish "Caucasians", who would smite their image and history from the Earth. History is not for the squeamish. Nor is the future.
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I am proud to see an effort toward ownership such that @Franky50 has put forth. Many would have been discouraged by such savage circumstance.
Unthwarted, he assailed his problem like a savage, using all skill and knowledge posessed to him. Strong from years of experience in the handloading "wilds", he adapted and over came what some would call a flaw. Pressing forward with unyielding prowess toward his goal.

Savage is glad to have you. I have no doubt they would have tried to see you happy right out of the box. But that is in the past now.

How about some pictures of your rig?
 
69Precision said:
I’m sure they would be proud to be associated with those attributes, as would anyone. Of course we both know I wasn’t referring to that. The question is would they be proud to be called savages, especially in the context in which it was coined. But if they are cool with it, great.
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I suppose it depends on if one tries to denigrate another with it's use. Just as you used condecension in this post.

It is a little like a hou-li coming down to eight mile and telling them the N-word is profane and won't be used anymore.

It's cute.:) Then they would be reminded to go home, before they hurt themselves.

Now that we had our segue through interpersonal oppression, I would like to say that Savages customer service is among the best, barring none.
 
69Precision said:
Not a fan of lawyers, but the name and logo together could definitely be offensive, and I’m not even Native American. I think political correctness has certainly gotten out of control overall, but I have to admit I always cringed a little at the combination of Savage paired with an image of an Indian.
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Well, the image is not just some random Native American, but Lame Deer's personal likeness which he granted to Arthur Savage as part of their endorsement deal. Although I'm sure the word association was not lost on either of them, the name and likeness were both personal property and used consensually.
 
True enough. The Washington redskins is perfectly legal too, Just seems there could be a better name for a football team, but apparently enough people think it’s a great name, because they’re not changing it.
NIGHTLORD40K said:
Well, the image is not just some random Native American, but Lame Deer's personal likeness which he granted to Arthur Savage as part of their endorsement deal. Although I'm sure the word association was not lost on either of them, the name and likeness were both personal property and used consensually.
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Savage is derogatory and everyone here knows it. Redskins is just a dumb name that reflects more poorly on the person using it, than the one it refers to.
 
Newtosavage said:
Savage is derogatory and everyone here knows it. Redskins is just a dumb name that reflects more poorly on the person using it, than the one it refers to.
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Arthur Savage's name is derogatory? What was he supposed to call his company -Arthur's Arms?
How bout Siemens Electronics?
Or FAG Corp.? (The largest German maker of ball bearings).
Its only derogatory if it was meant to offend. Since, by all accounts, the agreement between Mr. Savage and Lame Deer benefitted both parties I hardly think there was any derision there. A play on words? Certainly. But there was no malice or intent to defame. And by the standards of that time, the term was not used to exclusively refer to American Indians, but most tribal societies would have been considered savages by Western Europeans of the late 1800s.
Incidentally, I would agree with you on the use of the term "Redskin" but I think that needs to be arbitrated between the Tribes of Washington State and the owners of the team.
 
Its only derogatory if it was meant to offend. Since, by all accounts, the agreement between Mr. Savage and Lame Deer benefitted both parties I hardly think there was any derision there. A play on words? Certainly. But there was no malice or intent to defame.
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You actually make a very good point.
by the standards of that time, the term was not used to exclusively refer to American Indians, but most tribal societies would have been considered savages by Western Europeans of the late 1800s.
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But then make an even better point citing the "standards of that time" which in this case, are relevant.
 
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