6mm CZ527 which one?

Which would you choose?

  • 6mm PPC

    Votes: 2 10.0%

  • 6mmAR

    Votes: 5 25.0%

  • 6mmAR Turbo

    Votes: 2 10.0%

  • 6mm BR

    Votes: 3 15.0%

  • 6mm Rat

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • 6mm FatRat

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • 6mm Dasher

    Votes: 5 25.0%

  • 6mm Grinch

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • 6mm HAGAR

    Votes: 3 15.0%
  • Total voters
    20
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F

fpjeepy05

Member
Joined
Nov 20, 2009
Messages
66
I would like to get a CZ527 in a 6mm. 6.5 Grendel or 224 Valkerie are much easier choices, but I want to be difficult. In short, 224 V isn't a legal deer cartridge in all states, and 6mm bullets of the same proportions of a 6.5mm will be 25% lighter and have the associated reduced recoil and faster velocity.

Problem is I don't like to reload. I have done a little bit of it, and I just don't have the time for it right now.

So of the available options (6mm PPC, AR, 40 Tubro, Fat Rat, Dasher, BR, etc) Are there any custom shops selling loaded ammo? I've seen some 6mm PPC, will that need a custom bolt? I don't think 243 WSSM is safe for the 527 and it is a little excessive in this context.

If you had to guess what wildcat would hit the mainstream in the next 5 years, which would you guess? Ideally, it would be nice to chamber in the cartridge that factory ammo becomes available for. But second best would be to chamber in something that could be reamed to the factory version in the future.

I feel like it would be silly for no one to release a 6mm to fill the void. And as a side note, I think an ultralight 527 chambered in it would be the ultimate mountain rifle, with minimal recoil even in a 5lb rifle. Also great for youths. With advanced powders and copper alloy bullets, it wouldn't be far behind the 243 win, possibly the most prolific youth cartridge. All in a gun 3oz lighter, 1/2" shorter, and faster cycling than short actions.

Last question... Should I just stop being impatient and wait till one is released?
 
I believe the 6 mm fatrat is the 6.5 Grendel necked down to 6mm, so it is probably the easiest other than 6x45. But guessing which 6mm wildcat will end up a popular factory samii approved cartridge is probably going to require a fortune teller or an audience with the Almighty...
 
adcoch1 said:
Getting a 6 creedmoor in a mini action would not be difficult, it would be impossible!
Click to expand...

I'll say! Like the Howas then. Is this a recent thing, or is my rock I live under that moss covered?!:D

When I looked it up it does seem to be as pretty as all of the CZs, just fun-sized! Who wouldn't like one of those in a Six FatRat? I don't mind necking down, but dislike fireforming slightly. So I shall change my mind yet again!:)
 
Difficult is right. I would never considering getting a rifle in a niche cartridge like that if I didn't reload.

None of those cartridges will hit the mainstream in the next 5 years.

If I were going to go that route I would get a 7.62x39, and if there is enough meat there to do it, have it shortened and chambered for 300 blackout.

Factory 125gr supersonic ammo will work fine for deer.
 
IndianaBoy said:
Difficult is right. I would never considering getting a rifle in a niche cartridge like that if I didn't reload.

None of those cartridges will hit the mainstream in the next 5 years.

If I were going to go that route I would get a 7.62x39, and if there is enough meat there to do it, have it shortened and chambered for 300 blackout.

Factory 125gr supersonic ammo will work fine for deer.
Click to expand...
The cz 527 comes in 7.62x39, 300 blackout, 222, 223, 22 hornet, and 6.5 Grendel. It used to come in 221 fireball also, and that is the one I want to go with my 7.62x39 carbine. Love the cz mini action!
 
IndianaBoy said:
None of those cartridges will hit the mainstream in the next 5 years.
Click to expand...

Well, that's just negative.

IndianaBoy said:
If I were going to go that route I would get a 7.62x39, and if there is enough meat there to do it, have it shortened and chambered for 300 blackout.

Factory 125gr supersonic ammo will work fine for deer.
Click to expand...

300 blackout is a varmint round that can be used on deer with some success. Plenty of deer have fallen from the .223 as well, doesn't make it a deer round. Sectional density is too light on the 125gr BLK it be counted on if a 180lb+ animal is quartering toward or away. Additionally not enough energy to be counted on past 100yds.

On the contrary, I would be confident taking a 200yd quartering shot on a 180lb+ animal with a 95gr Barnes from a 6mmAR @2850
 
I personally like the blackout sub 200 yards with a 147 grn boattail. They don't fly very fast but they are cheap to load and hit a bit harder on targets than 110 or 125 grn bullets. Yet to take any substantial game with the blackout yet though
 
I have a 40 Turbo upper. I fired my best 5 shot group ever out of that rifle while fire forming the brass. But, you need to reload. I’ve got a receiver and will try and get it barreled next year.
 
fpjeepy05 said:
Well, that's just negative.



300 blackout is a varmint round that can be used on deer with some success. Plenty of deer have fallen from the .223 as well, doesn't make it a deer round. Sectional density is too light on the 125gr BLK it be counted on if a 180lb+ animal is quartering toward or away. Additionally not enough energy to be counted on past 100yds.

On the contrary, I would be confident taking a 200yd quartering shot on a 180lb+ animal with a 95gr Barnes from a 6mmAR @2850
Click to expand...


I wonder if there will really be any appreciable difference in recoil vs. 6.5 grendel.

70gr Barnes TSX from a 223 is sufficient for deer if your state allows it.
 
IndianaBoy said:
I wonder if there will really be any appreciable difference in recoil vs. 6.5 grendel.

70gr Barnes TSX from a 223 is sufficient for deer if your state allows it.
Click to expand...

Below I calculated the recoil for 123gr 6.5mm @2650 and a 95gr 6mm @2850 both using 24.5gr of powder in a 6lb rifle. 23% reduction in recoil
Bar-graph

Bar-graph


22 hornet is sufficient for deer, and has killed plenty of them... but if I'm hunting for trophies, and I am only going to get one opportunity to take a shot at the buck of a lifetime... I don't want to be standing there with a gun that is incapable of making the shot that another gun could.

I think 0.23 is a minimum SD for hunting deer with copper bullets. (0.25 for lead) Again, the only time you will need the extra penetration is when you have to take a shot that is less than ideal but still need to poke two holes so you can track it.
 
Do you guys think there is a need for a caliber between the 224 Valkyrie and the 6.5 Grendel?
 
Not exactly my thing to predict the future accurately, but I agree a mini action throwing 6 mm copper pills would make a nice mountain deer rifle.

Just like my stuff, a .270 Winchester BAR or my .30-30 Winchester 94, or even my .30-06 Springfield Encore (26" barrel, what good could come out of such bulky gear, really?) do it for me, but with less recoil, less weight, less length and less unnecessary killing power, which would not make yours a lesser rifle in any way.

I agree there is room for more modern calibers and rifles. My vintage stuff must be quite unappealing to the younger lads contemplating the idea of buying their first deer rifle, carefully weighting costs of powder and bullets to accomplish better with less. Some rifles lighter and wore efficient per ounce carried afield will replace those odd old things in time.

Not so long ago (but still a moment before me), the musket was the very best there was. The people evolve, their guns do just the same.

And then, Henry comes out with traditional designs, and I find myself looking at Single Shot in .243 much more than at the latest Predator in 6.5 Grendel with its detachable 10 rounds magazine. There is only one plausible explanation for this: slowly, I have become an old fart; last week, I traded a semi for a bolt action... Beware kids, life is short, enjoy it as much as you can while you are at it!
 
IndianaBoy said:
Difficult is right. I would never considering getting a rifle in a niche cartridge like that if I didn't reload.

None of those cartridges will hit the mainstream in the next 5 years.
Click to expand...

Yep, I definitely wouldn't be trying to set myself up with mini 6mm wildcats if I didn't reload. The standard Grendel should do most of what the OP wants while still having factory ammo available (a pretty hard requirement given that he doesn't reload).
 
Last edited:
mshootnit said:
I don't know but 6mm HAGAR sounds like it would really rock and roll.
Click to expand...

So just add primer, powder, bullet, and shoot?

What is the difference between that and 6mm x 6.8? 6mmAR has a wider case body? All things equal, a 50-100fps difference between 6 Hagar and 6mmAr? Easier to neck up 224V to 6 or neck down 6.5G to 6?
 
Unrelated... I recently had an argument over email with everyone's buddy, Huck Chawks, over his unnecessary bashing of the 224V.
I couldn't convince him that all the deer killed with the 224V didn't understand the 224V doesn't work for class 2 game. :rofl:
 
With respect, and while acknowledging your desire to be difficult, if you don't reload, this whole thing is just silly. Buy a light, handy rifle chambered in 243 Win and enjoy. :D
 
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