suspicious reply from armslist

Sounds like a scam. Also sending anything firearms related to California these days is just to much trouble.

cslinger said:

Postal money order. Once I have cash in hand I will ship. Funny how many “buyers” that runs off.

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Once the cash is in hand? Then you never see the purchase or hear from the seller again. That's why I'd avoid as a buyer.

P5 Guy said:

Once the cash is in hand? Then you never see the purchase or hear from the seller again. That's why I'd avoid as a buyer.

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Suppose a person wanted to buy a gun from someone across the country: what payment method would you suggest the buyer use? What should the seller accept?

My point is that there is no risk-free way to do a private transaction between strangers.

This is a common scam on EBay. Report it.

I would sell it. So long as the buyer sends a postal MO that you can cash along with a copy of his dealer’s FFL, what’s the difference between selling like this or selling a gun on Gunbroker?
Once you have cash in hand, what is the risk?

If no one is willing to ship to CA, even legitimate deals, we are in reality helping the anti gun agenda there.

There are ways, some mentioned here already, to ensure a safe transaction.

Go to the ATF FFL ez check site to verify you’re dealing with a real FFL. Contact that FFL and get their assurance that the deal is legit, and the gun is legal to ship to CA. At that point, if the money is right, why not proceed?

Speedo66 said:

If no one is willing to ship to CA, even legitimate deals, we are in reality helping the anti gun agenda there.

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CA is a lost cause, and I'm not about to put my neck on the chopping block, risk getting sued into oblivion because of some minuscule, arcane detail of compliance for "importing" firearms into their state I wasn't aware of or able to find in double checking. CA gun laws are a minefield; one firearm is good to go, while an identical model with a different finish or some minor feature variation, are not approved.

MachIVshooter said:

CA is a lost cause, and I'm not about to put my neck on the chopping block, risk getting sued into oblivion because of some minuscule, arcane detail of compliance for "importing" firearms into their state I wasn't aware of or able to find in double checking. CA gun laws are a minefield; one firearm is good to go, while an identical model with a different finish or some minor feature variation, are not approved.

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Well if California is a lost cause you have to realize that Colorado is next. We should try to support the good people of CA as much as we can, they have an up hill battle that may never be won. This deal appears to be done but I would like to think that I would treat a gun person in CA the same as I would if they were in FL. You have to check the FFL and check the money as has been mentioned several times but wouldn't you do that in any transaction?

Allen One1 said:

Well if California is a lost cause you have to realize that Colorado is next.

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Well aware. We've been getting California for years, 2018 elections kicked it into high gear. I'm outta here as soon as I can be without putting myself in a bad spot.

EH1 said:

Thank you all for the insights into possible scams. Now I'm even more nervous about trying to sell other guns through armslist or gunbroker. Today I was fortunate to find a local buyer and sold the gun using the transfer service of a LGS for $20.00. Guess that will be my preferred method.

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It’s pretty easy to avoid the scam we’re talking about. The reason the scammers are successful with their scams is because often a bank will quickly clear a fake check or money order and the money will post to the seller’s account. That makes the seller think everything is legit so they send the scammer the item (sometimes along with the leftover extra money). Then the bank realizes the check or money order was actually fake and they take their money back.

So all you have to do is tell every suspicious-sounding buyer that you’re going to wait three weeks after the deposit to make sure it’s real before you send them them gun. Every time I do that I never hear from them again.

A 700 in 222 Magnum is not exactly to most common of the breed. Always be cautious on these kinds of sales anyway. I can understand potential buyer wanting the rifle. A friend of mine collected odd or usual Remington bolt action rifles. These people really get lathered about these rifles.

Elkins45 said:

Suppose a person wanted to buy a gun from someone across the country: what payment method would you suggest the buyer use? What should the seller accept?

My point is that there is no risk-free way to do a private transaction between strangers.

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Well, I have never thought about this, so. Since I am more of an impulse buyer and have only once bought a gun thru an internet ad which was a local F2F. No idea.
All this does is remind me of the father that lost his life selling his son's dirt bike to dirtbags.

Scammers like russian agents are everywhere?

Once the cash is in hand?...these days that is no guarantee . Many times these documents are cashed in a bank the recipient holds an account in. If the order turns out to be fraudulent..and that's happening more and more, the cash is then taken from your account.

If it seems shady, it probably is. and the lose of the item is never going to be made up. Interstate investigations are not going to happen for a small amount.

The request for shipping itself isn't valid under CA law. Any wonder a FFL isn't going to want to bother or only at a increased fee.

California Penal Code Section 27555 prohibits all Federal Firearms Licensees (FFLs), other than Type 03 or 06 FFLs, from shipping firearms to an FFL in California unless, prior to delivery, the FFL intending to deliver, sell or transfer the firearms obtains a verification approval number from the California Department of Justice (CADOJ) Bureau of Firearms. This includes transfers that occur at gun shows.

The verification approval number, which the Bureau of Firearms provides in a Firearms Shipment Approval letter, confirms that the intended recipient of the firearm shipment is properly licensed and listed in the state's database of persons/entities authorized to receive firearm shipments. If the intended CA FFL recipient is not listed in the state's database, the transaction will result in a Do Not Ship letter, and it is a crime for the intended recipient to receive the firearms (Penal Code Section 28465).

https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/cflcoverview

P5 Guy said:

Well, I have never thought about this, so. Since I am more of an impulse buyer and have only once bought a gun thru an internet ad which was a local F2F. No idea.
All this does is remind me of the father that lost his life selling his son's dirt bike to dirtbags.

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I have never purchased a gun that required shipping from an individual, and I doubt I ever will. All of the guns I have bought on GunBroker have been from an FFL and I paid with a card. I have sold a handful of guns to people on forums anD one through GB. The buyers sent postal MO or personal checks. If they weren’t comfortable doing so then they simply weren’t going to be able to buy the gun, as I had no other way to receive payment. PayPal won’t allow gun transactions and I wouldn’t use them even if they did because they make it too easy to screw the seller.

I have bought and sold several FTF using Armslist, and in every case we set up an exchange in a public place during daylight hours. I was also armed every time. Still, in every case something could have easily gone wrong.

It’s an unfortunate fact that gun transactions can be attractive to criminals. Vigilance is always required.

Tell them you will take a personal check and it ships when it’s cashed.

If you are worried about shipping have an FFL near you ship it to the FFL in CA.

Armslist is a haven for scammers. Beware!

CapnMac said:

I'm still waitign to every see a non-suspicious reply from armslist.

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ho, brah you still get em?

No number, just that....i committed it to memory, since it short, made me laugh, and literally was the only time i wasnt suspicious at all of an email with so little info or call back number. I usually have my phone number in my posts, tho, so usually I get texts.

Postal money order. Once I have cash in hand I will ship.

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USPS money orders can be counterfit too. You only find out after it's too late. Anything but cash I'd delay 2 weeks before shipping.

EH1: That looks Exactly like the impatient, bizarre reply to my ad to sell a WW2 Mauser Hsc handgun. There's a 99% chance that your 'buyer' would have committed felony fraud.
Except for ignoring our "no shipping" terms, they look like perfect solutions, don't they?

First, they wanted my gun sent from TN to FL. No way.... Armslist is created for local deals, and I've done at least 12-14, which went very well, with clear communications from all buyers and sellers.
Second: the guy had no questions about which Mauser Hsc components actually match, the condition, and no request for photos. Very weird for a WW2 gun.

**Don't misunderstand me, Armslist has been quite a blessing**. It allowed numerous sales and access to milsurp guns which either were not available in Memphis retail gun shops (without losing large chunks of money), certainly not at our small gun shows.

ford8nr: Among the other advantages of FTF deals, at least we don't run the risk of counterfeit money orders etc. I had the impression that because some sellers (Gunbroker etc) prefer Postal Money Orders, they must be very difficult to counterfeit...?

ford8nr said:

USPS money orders can be counterfit too. You only find out after it's too late.

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But if the post office accepts it and pays you the cash, what’s going to happen? The post office comes after you?

Wisco said:

But if the post office accepts it and pays you the cash, what’s going to happen? The post office comes after you?

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The PO in my small town doesn’t have the cash on hand to cash a big MO. They tell you to take it to the bank.

I would think it wouldn’t be easy to spoof the holographic strip and watermark on a genuine postal MO.

A number of posts have been in reference to hypotheticals on how to deal with a bogus payment —-

If it quacks like a duck it’s probably a duck!

Reject fishy deal proposals and you won’t have to deal with bogus payments.