Can I send my cousins pistol to him?

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Hasaf

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My cousin left his pistol in my safe when he left the country. He is now back. He wants me to fed-ex his pistol to him.

When I look, it looks like I can not, it needs to go to an FFL. He is convinced that, because it is his, I can send it straight to him.

Before I do something illegal, can I send it straight to him?
 
You are currently in possession of the firearm. That is what matters.

You cannot legally transfer possession of a firearm to another individual across state lines without the services of an FFL.

18 USC 922 (a) (5)
(a)It shall be unlawful
...
(5)
for any person (other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector) to transfer, sell, trade, give, transport, or deliver any firearm to any person (other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector) who the transferor knows or has reasonable cause to believe does not reside in (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, does not maintain a place of business in) the State in which the transferor resides; except that this paragraph shall not apply to (A) the transfer, transportation, or delivery of a firearm made to carry out a bequest of a firearm to, or an acquisition by intestate succession of a firearm by, a person who is permitted to acquire or possess a firearm under the laws of the State of his residence, and (B) the loan or rental of a firearm to any person for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes;
 
Federal firearms law keys on possession, not on ownership. When your cousin left his gun in your safe, to which you had access, he effectively transferred possession to you. To transfer the gun back to him, across state lines, you must go through an FFL.

Actually, strictly speaking, if your cousin was a resident of another state when he originally left his pistol in your safe, an FFL should have been involved in that transaction as well. But it's too late to do anything about that now.

To be honest, this is the sort of situation in which the letter of the law is widely ignored.

ETA: The situation would be different if the storage medium had been a rental locker or bank safe deposit box to which only your cousin had the key. In that case possession would not have been transferred.
 
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Yeah. I held a pistol for a friend while he trotted the globe for army stuff. I finally got around to sending it back to him on the east coast, UPS, next-day, it was like $110.

FFL.

For future reference, even though mere mortals find themselves with no good options on how to ship a handgun to a receiving FFL in this situation, you can likely find a local FFL willing to charge a small (relative to the cost of overnight air shipping) fee to utilize cheaper (they can ship USPS, aren't restricted to overnight air, etc) methods of shipment to the receiving FFL for subsequent transfer to the recipient.
 
My cousin left his pistol in my safe when he left the country. He is now back. He wants me to fed-ex his pistol to him.

When I look, it looks like I can not, it needs to go to an FFL. He is convinced that, because it is his, I can send it straight to him.

Legally, it was gifted to you when he left the country. As you maintained a more permanent possession of it than he did. Use the FFL and get it back to him the legal way.
 
....When I look, it looks like I can not, it needs to go to an FFL. He is convinced that, because it is his, I can send it straight to him...
It seems that there's an underlying assumption that you and your cousin are residents of different States. Let's proceed on that assumption (and if that's not the case, let us know so that we can re-examine the question).

So based on that assumption, you're correct. So let me lay it all out for you and your cousin.

Giving guns to someone in another State to store for you is highly problematic under federal law.

The federal laws relating to the transfer of a gun from a resident of one State to a resident of another (i. e., the Gun Control Act of 1968 or GCA68) are about physical possession, not ownership. GCA68 was Congress' responding to enormous public pressure after the assassinations by gunfire of three wildly popular public figures -- JFK, RFK and MLK. The law was intended to regulate and control the interstate transfer of firearms. It was structured so that to the extent reasonably possible any transfer of possession of a gun from a resident of one State to a resident of another would have to go through an FFL.

And in the context of the concerns intended to be addressed by Congress through GCA68, it's possession and not ownership that matters. Someone who has a gun in his possession can use it, whether or not he has legal title to it.

Giving someone your gun to store for you will be considered a transfer. It certainly is under federal law, and would also most likely be also considered a transfer under state laws. That's just what "transfer" means.

  1. In general, any transfer of a firearm from a resident of one State to a resident of another must go through an FFL who will follow all usual formalities (e. g., completion of the 4473). There are a few limited, narrow, specific exceptions: if you have an appropriate federal firearms license; inheritance by will or intestate succession; or a loan (subject to a number of limitations which will be discussed in more detail below).

  2. The applicable federal statutes are: 18 USC 922(a)(3); 18 USC 922(a)(5); and 18 USC 922 (b)(3). The full texts of those statutes may be found here.

  3. The federal laws I've cited are about possession, not necessarily ownership.

    • Possession means:
      1 a : the act of having or taking into control...

    • Transfer is about possession, not ownership. Some definitions of "transfer" (emphasis added):


    • Let's look at the statutes:

      • 18 USC 922(a)(3), which provides in pertinent part (emphasis added) as follows:
        (a) It shall be unlawful—
        ...

        (3) for any person, ... to transport into or receive in the State where he resides ...any firearm purchased or otherwise obtained by such person outside that State,...

      • And 18 USC 922(a)(5), which provides in pertinent part (emphasis added) as follows:
        (a) It shall be unlawful—
        ...

        (5) for any person ... to transfer, sell, trade, give, transport, or deliver any firearm to any person ...who the transferor knows or has reasonable cause to believe does not reside in ... the State in which the transferor resides..;

    • Note carefully the words of those statutes. Words, like "transport", "receive", "obtained", "transfer", "give", "transport", and "deliver" do not necessarily imply ownership and include possession. They will be read and applied by a court according to their ordinary meanings. See Perrin v. United States, 444 U.S. 37 (United States Supreme Court, 1979), at 42:
      ...A fundamental canon of statutory construction is that, unless otherwise defined, words will be interpreted as taking their ordinary, contemporary, common meaning...

  4. With regard to loans under GCA68, let's look at the applicable statutes again:

    • 18 USC 922(a)(3), which provides in pertinent part (emphasis added) as follows:
      (a) It shall be unlawful—
      ...

      (3) for any person, ... to transport into or receive in the State where he resides ...any firearm purchased or otherwise obtained by such person outside that State,...

    • And 18 USC 922(a)(5), which provides in pertinent part (emphasis added) as follows:
      (a) It shall be unlawful—
      ...

      (5) for any person ... to transfer, sell, trade, give, transport, or deliver any firearm to any person ...who the transferor knows or has reasonable cause to believe does not reside in ... the State in which the transferor resides; except that this paragraph shall not apply to

      (A) the transfer, transportation, or delivery of a firearm made to carry out a bequest ..., and

      (B) the loan or rental of a firearm to any person for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes;​
      ..

    • So under federal law a resident of one State may loan a gun to a resident of another State, but only temporarily and only for a lawful sporting purpose.


    • So a court is likely to look at the "temporary loan for a lawful sporting purpose" exception to the prohibition on interstate transfers to apply when a gun is loaned so that the person it's been loaned to can engage in a specific sporting activity (i. e., a hunt, a competition, etc.) of limited duration. "Temporary" would refer to the duration of that activity. Such an interpretation would be consistent with the common meanings of the words used in the statutes and the underlying purpose (controlling interstate transfers of firearms) of GCA68.

    • So you may go to another State where (under 18 USC 922(a)(5)), a friend may loan you a gun to, for example, go target shooting together, or an outfitter may rent you a gun for a guided hunt. But since there is no applicable "loan" exception in 18 USC 922(a)(3), a loan of a firearm may not cross state lines to the borrower's State of residence.

  5. Is there no way to store your gun in another State?

    • Leaving a gun with someone in another State clearly raises interstate transfer problems when that person has access to the gun.

    • One possible way to avoid the problem would be to secure the gun or guns in a locked case or similar container to which only you have the key or combination.

    • That might avoid the transfer problem inherent in having someone store your guns, ATF has advised here that one may ship a firearm to himself in care of another person in another State.

      Specifically ATF has said (emphasis added):
      6. May I lawfully ship a firearm to myself in a different State?

      Any person may ship a firearm to himself or herself in the care of another person in the State where he or she intends to hunt or engage in any other lawful activity. The package should be addressed to the owner “in the care of” the out-of-State resident. Upon reaching its destination, persons other than the owner must not open the package or take possession of the firearm.​

  6. Note that violations of federal law regarding interstate transfers are punishable by up to five years in federal prison and/or a fine; and since the crime is a felony one will lose his gun rights for the rest of his life.
 
Legally, it was gifted to you when he left the country. As you maintained a more permanent possession of it than he did.
No. To have a completed gift, there must be intent by the donor. Instead of a gift, what we have here is a "gratuitous bailment."

But that doesn't matter. What matters is possession, not title.

If the cousin had stored the gun in a locked box in the OP's home and taken the key with him, so that the OP didn't have access, then maybe they could have skipped involvement by an FFL in the original bailment. (On the ground that this wasn't a "transfer of possession.")

Sending the gun back to him still contained in the original locked box would be an interesting permutation of this problem. The OP would never have had access, or "possession," at any time.
 
AlexanderA writes:

The OP would never have had access, or "possession," at any time.

While I might not have "access" to its contents, am I not in "possession" of the contents of any container of which I am in possession? For example, could I not be charged with possession of, say, illicit drugs, if I had such a secured container holding them and was caught with it?
 
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[QUOTE="MedWheeler, post: 11182196, member: 70976"
While I might not have "access" to its contents, am I not in "possession" of the contents of any container of which I am in possession? For example, could I be charged with possession of, say, illicit drugs, if I had such a secured container holding them and was caught with it?[/QUOTE]

you sure could. "It's not mine" is the oldest cliche alibi in the book
 
I don't know about drugs, but a locked safe is a recognized way of showing that a given person doesn't have access. For example, someone with NFA items can keep his spouse out of trouble for having unauthorized access, by making sure she doesn't have the combination to his safe. (Assuming the items are held as an individual, and not in a trust.)
 
I think the situation is rather simple. If you live in a state where private sales are allowed with no ffl and your cousin lives in the same state you guys can meet in the middle somewhere for lunch and you hand the gun back to him. If this is not the law in your state then the path is defined by law for you. The other path for you across states lines it also laid out by law as Frank Ettin wrote.
 
I think the situation is rather simple. If you live in a state where private sales are allowed with no ffl and your cousin lives in the same state you guys can meet in the middle somewhere for lunch and you hand the gun back to him. If this is not the law in your state then the path is defined by law for you. The other path for you across states lines it also laid out by law as Frank Ettin wrote.

I assumed the brother was somewhere out of state... the vast majority of states are not so large that a weekend trip to visit your in-state brother would be inconvenient.

As a side note, if it were a rifle or shotgun instead of a handgun and both parties were residents of the same state, he could mail the rifle/shotgun via the US Postal Service and be perfectly legal (from a federal standpoint).

432.3 Rifles and Shotguns
Except under 431.2, unloaded rifles and shotguns are mailable. Mailers must comply with the rules and regulations under 27 CFR, Part 478, as well as state and local laws. The mailer may be required by the USPS to establish, by opening the parcel or by written certification, that the rifle or shotgun is unloaded and not ineligible for mailing. The following conditions also apply:

a. Subject to state, territory, or district regulations, rifles and shotguns may be mailed without restriction when intended for delivery within the same state of mailing. These items must:
1. Bear a “Return Service Requested” endorsement.
2. Be mailed using a class of mail, product, or Extra Service that provides tracking and signature capture at delivery.

None of the private shippers are willing to conduct non-ffl to non-ffl shipments under any circumstances.
 
Let me tell you this process is anything but simple. After I had moved from Pennsylvania to Colorado, I took my firearms out of storage to a Pennsylvania FFL & had them ship my goods parcel post to a post office nearest to my CO residence. Even though I owned all of the guns being shipped, I had to show my ID and proof of where I had moved to in CO (by that time I had a CO drivers license along with my invalid PA drivers license). The FFL would not touch any of my stuff if I had not produced my CO DL with my new address on it. The FFL had to verify all of the NICS info on each of the guns (all were bought in PA) and then log all of the serial numbers onto his books with all the parcel post waybill numbers. The FFL’s transaction and shipping logs are subject to BATF inspection audit so like I said this process is anything but simple.

Based on what I went through with my own firearms, and this is going to sound mean, but honestly I would tell your cousin that the gun is right where he left it and waiting for him to pick it up next time he’s in town.
 
Based on what I went through with my own firearms, and this is going to sound mean, but honestly I would tell your cousin that the gun is right where he left it and waiting for him to pick it up next time he’s in town.

Recommending the OP tell his cousin to commit a felony because it's easier is a great way to make sure that neither of them can own firearms in the future.
 
Why can't his cousin come visit him, and send it back himself to himself, if this statement is correct?
Federal law allows you to ship the firearm yourself, addressed to yourself.
https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/how-to-ship-firearms.651375/


It seems that there's an underlying assumption that you and your cousin are residents of different States. Let's proceed on that assumption (and if that's not the case, let us know so that we can re-examine the question).

So based on that assumption, you're correct. So let me lay it all out for you and your cousin.

Giving guns to someone in another State to store for you is highly problematic under federal law.

The federal laws relating to the transfer of a gun from a resident of one State to a resident of another (i. e., the Gun Control Act of 1968 or GCA68) are about physical possession, not ownership. GCA68 was Congress' responding to enormous public pressure after the assassinations by gunfire of three wildly popular public figures -- JFK, RFK and MLK. The law was intended to regulate and control the interstate transfer of firearms. It was structured so that to the extent reasonably possible any transfer of possession of a gun from a resident of one State to a resident of another would have to go through an FFL.

And in the context of the concerns intended to be addressed by Congress through GCA68, it's possession and not ownership that matters. Someone who has a gun in his possession can use it, whether or not he has legal title to it.

Giving someone your gun to store for you will be considered a transfer. It certainly is under federal law, and would also most likely be also considered a transfer under state laws. That's just what "transfer" means.

  1. In general, any transfer of a firearm from a resident of one State to a resident of another must go through an FFL who will follow all usual formalities (e. g., completion of the 4473). There are a few limited, narrow, specific exceptions: if you have an appropriate federal firearms license; inheritance by will or intestate succession; or a loan (subject to a number of limitations which will be discussed in more detail below).

  2. The applicable federal statutes are: 18 USC 922(a)(3); 18 USC 922(a)(5); and 18 USC 922 (b)(3). The full texts of those statutes may be found here.

  3. The federal laws I've cited are about possession, not necessarily ownership.
    • Possession means:

    • Transfer is about possession, not ownership. Some definitions of "transfer" (emphasis added):

    • Let's look at the statutes:
      • 18 USC 922(a)(3), which provides in pertinent part (emphasis added) as follows:

      • And 18 USC 922(a)(5), which provides in pertinent part (emphasis added) as follows:

    • Note carefully the words of those statutes. Words, like "transport", "receive", "obtained", "transfer", "give", "transport", and "deliver" do not necessarily imply ownership and include possession. They will be read and applied by a court according to their ordinary meanings. See Perrin v. United States, 444 U.S. 37 (United States Supreme Court, 1979), at 42:

  4. With regard to loans under GCA68, let's look at the applicable statutes again:
    • 18 USC 922(a)(3), which provides in pertinent part (emphasis added) as follows:

    • And 18 USC 922(a)(5), which provides in pertinent part (emphasis added) as follows:

    • So under federal law a resident of one State may loan a gun to a resident of another State, but only temporarily and only for a lawful sporting purpose.

    • So a court is likely to look at the "temporary loan for a lawful sporting purpose" exception to the prohibition on interstate transfers to apply when a gun is loaned so that the person it's been loaned to can engage in a specific sporting activity (i. e., a hunt, a competition, etc.) of limited duration. "Temporary" would refer to the duration of that activity. Such an interpretation would be consistent with the common meanings of the words used in the statutes and the underlying purpose (controlling interstate transfers of firearms) of GCA68.

    • So you may go to another State where (under 18 USC 922(a)(5)), a friend may loan you a gun to, for example, go target shooting together, or an outfitter may rent you a gun for a guided hunt. But since there is no applicable "loan" exception in 18 USC 922(a)(3), a loan of a firearm may not cross state lines to the borrower's State of residence.

  5. Is there no way to store your gun in another State?
    • Leaving a gun with someone in another State clearly raises interstate transfer problems when that person has access to the gun.

    • One possible way to avoid the problem would be to secure the gun or guns in a locked case or similar container to which only you have the key or combination.

    • That might avoid the transfer problem inherent in having someone store your guns, ATF has advised here that one may ship a firearm to himself in care of another person in another State.

      Specifically ATF has said (emphasis added):

  6. Note that violations of federal law regarding interstate transfers are punishable by up to five years in federal prison and/or a fine; and since the crime is a felony one will lose his gun rights for the rest of his life.
 
Why can't his cousin come visit him, and send it back himself to himself, if this statement is correct?
Federal law allows you to ship the firearm yourself, addressed to yourself.
https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/how-to-ship-firearms.651375/

Because Person A is in possession of the firearm in State A. Person B is a resident of State B. Person A can't transfer possession of the firearm to Person B in State A. Person A cannot transfer possession of the firearm to Person B in State B either.

Whether the illegal transfer happens by mail or over the kitchen counter, it's still an illegal transfer.
 
This is yet another post where the OP asks an initial question but leaves out a lot of the pertinent details, and the rest of us are left to try & guess what those details are to try & give the OP a correct and LEGAL response.

The best that I can tell WITHOUT KNOWING WHICH STATE THE FIREARM IS BEING SHIPPED FROM OR TO, is that the firearm can possibly be shipped through an FFL directly to the owners confirmed address, as long as the FFL is provided with the necessary information to allow the firearm to pass through the FFL’s books, which as I said are subject to BATFE audit and inspection. Otherwise a THR moderator should probably just shut this post down.
 
.....the firearm can possibly be shipped through an FFL directly to the owners confirmed address, as long as the FFL is provided with the necessary information to allow the firearm to pass through the FFL’s books,.....

That is ridiculous. Can you cite case law or a statute supporting that contention?

In fact what you suggest would be a violation of federal law, specifically 18 USC 922(a)(2).

Why don’t you do a little research before posting an answer to a legal question?
 
I asked an FFL about this, and the OP’s cousin needs to consult an FFL directly and in person about shipping his own firearm, the OP cannot act on his cousins behalf to ship the firearm. Not quite what I stated above so I stand corrected.
 
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