Hunting parties

The premise is flawed, it assumes the primary commercial meat source (farm livestock) is gone and the secondary source (wild game) will be the new source of meat. I submit that wild game would get depleted first, it has no one to protect it and it runs wild. Domestic farm livestock would be housed, guarded, fed, and protected by the farmer.

Deer were basically extinct in this area after The Depression up until the 1970’s. I grew up on a dairy farm and saw one all the time I was growing up

And while some of the large processors may have closed for the moment, most small guys like I have in my area are open and doing a LOT of business. One guy sells smoked pork chops, he supplies 3 restaurants year-round; he also supplies a caterer in December with over 10,000 of them for catering............(and he makes some GREAT sausage)

It could happen, but generally speaking, panic/hoarding/sneaking that little extra or accusing someone else of doing so would probably ensure it not lasting long.
Remember, when unstructured, the human animal can be as fragile as any other animal in the ecosystem.
Having said that, my job is to try and help us not get to that point, so hopefully it never will.

troy fairweather said:

The meat shortage thread made me think. What if it got to the point were meat was all gone. All the farm animals were eaten, even dairy cows.

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I would miss the dairy cows even though I don't eat any cow. I would miss chickens and turkeys even though I don't eat them either.

troy fairweather said:

Farms around here have been dumping milk it the fields.

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I drink so little milk and eat so few things made with it I could easily do without it entirely. Some mothers need supplemental milk for their infants if their lactation isn't sufficient. Soy based infant formula would be fine for them. The end result of no cow milk would be a marked decrease in juvenile onset diabetes and a decrease in breast cancer. I would miss the cows though.

troy fairweather said:

Do you think smaller community's would make hunting party's to supply needed meat.

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Meat isn't needed. It's much more efficient to eat plants thus cutting out the middle cow. I've heard it said regarding meat, "you need to eat your protein." Remember that the biggest mass of protein walking the planet (elephants) didn't get that way by eating any meat. Places in the world where meat is in short supply have the lowest rates of things like colon cancer, alzheimers dementia, heart attacks, etc.

The King Ranch still employs fence riders for multiple reasons. I agree that the basic concept put forth is flawed in terms of "tribal" rural hunting parties, much less independent loss of all livestock but game animals still in abundance.

I'm curious about what might currently be going on at Smithfield and meat exports considering the current ownership though.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jennif...wns-troubled-pork-processor-smithfield-foods/

https://www.smithfieldfoods.com/madeinusa

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...nese-firm-sells-us-processed-meat/2987004001/

The shortage is not being created by the shortage of animals, it is the butchering, packaging and the distribution chain that is the issue. That's why farmers are dumping their milk, because no one will haul it and no one will process it. This is a temporary scenario and will be over long before our deer go extinct. Issue is not from lack of fresh meat, but the affordability to those with no jobs/income. Corn and soybean prices are low for similar reasons so farmers will still be able to feed their animals. Local farmers than sell raw milk and fresh beef and hogs are doing a great business along with local butchers.

Plenty of evidence out there (but no scientific proof) that a soy diet increases estrogen levels. (Which is generally not good for men. Obesity, low T, etc.)

I am not going down the road of a soy based diet unless there is no other choice.

Ain't gonna happen, and if it did there aren't enough wild animals to come close to meeting demand anyway. There are 350 million people living here, last estimates I saw were only 33 million deer. That's about 1 deer per 100 people.

At worst we're talking about losing 5%-10% meat production. There may well be price increases, and a run on meat creating some temporary shortages. And there may be a time when we can't find exactly what we want, but I don't see the need to have to resort to wild game for all of our meat.

If we see the average American resorting to the poaching of deer, and the butchering of dogs, cats, horses and rats to feed their families, we will have a lot more to worry about than just our diet. Odds are, none of us will be online talking about it.


Just sayin'.......

I’m not a huge fan of the turkey products out there but I would happily have it before I resorted to plant based.

I do love those smoked turkey legs though.

earlthegoat2 said:

Plenty of evidence out there (but no scientific proof) that a soy diet increases estrogen levels. (Which is generally not good for men. Obesity, low T, etc.)

I am not going down the road of a soy based diet unless there is no other choice.

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I'd go fishing / scoop netting shrimp / crabbing along the coast for the day's fresh catch if the livestock went extinct way before I'd make soy or goo my primary protein source.

Long pig would still be plentiful......

jmr40 said:

Ain't gonna happen, and if it did there aren't enough wild animals to come close to meeting demand anyway. There are 350 million people living here, last estimates I saw were only 33 million deer. That's about 1 deer per 100 people.

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I believe there is several magnitudes more deer and waterfowl than there was when Columbus landed as well...

I’m always interested to know how much pressure our fisheries can take. There are a lot of Asian Carp. Fish farming has its own issues but you could grow a lot of fish in some climates.

I agree that it would go the opposite. Wild game would deplete first.

HB said:

I believe there is several magnitudes more deer and waterfowl than there was when Columbus landed as well...

I’m always interested to know how much pressure our fisheries can take. There are a lot of Asian Carp. Fish farming has its own issues but you could grow a lot of fish in some climates.

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Fish are probably the easiest and best source of food if it's supplemented by raising animals.
There is a reason people used to live near oceans. Cities were also smaller because the food chain didn't involve semis and trains.
Edit
I should have said there is a reason most cities used to be near oceans.

Aquaculture on the Texas Gulf Coast was a disaster. Diseases from the farmed shrimp varieties deeply impacted domestic stocks for quite a while. With cheaply produced imported shrimp processed overseas (watch a video on this some time) as well as other factors the great Gulf shrimp boat fleets of my youth are gone - and I mean gone!

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_spot_syndrome

Crawfish farming however has become quite successful in the rice belt.

I used to joke my retirement plan was to move to Australia and run a lobster farm where I could have first pick. Wild spiny lobster populations have had so much fishing pressure in Caribbean & Central America that farming may become viable there at some point in the near future. In the mean time it just keeps moving to deeper and deeper waters.

The Maryland / Delaware / Chesapeake area imports a lot of blue crab from the Gulf Coast these days.

Mr. Zorg said:

Aquaculture on the Texas Gulf Coast was a disaster. Diseases from the farmed shrimp varieties deeply impacted domestic stocks for quite a while. With cheaply produced imported shrimp processed overseas (watch a video on this some time) as well as other factors the great Gulf shrimp boat fleets of my youth are gone - and I mean gone!

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_spot_syndrome

Crawfish farming however has become quite successful in the rice belt.

I used to joke my retirement plan was to move to Australia and run a lobster farm where I could have first pick. Wild spiny lobster populations have had so much fishing pressure in Caribbean & Central America that farming may become viable there at some point in the near future. In the mean time it just keeps moving to deeper and deeper waters.

The Maryland / Delaware / Chesapeake area imports a lot of blue crab from the Gulf Coast these days.

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All true. Don't forget the Asian farm raised soft shell crabs while we let the season unfold naturally on the east coast.

We get used to get a heck of a lot of oysters from the gulf here in the mid Atlantic as well. The BP oil spill remedied that.

IMO ~90% of the population is incapable of being able to hunt anything other than squirrels in their yards. They are usually ignorant of the habits of wildlife plus many (most) could not hit what they were shooting at if they knew how to operate the weapon in the 1st place.

Mr. Zorg said:

Aquaculture on the Texas Gulf Coast was a disaster. Diseases from the farmed shrimp varieties deeply impacted domestic stocks for quite a while

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Reminds me of CWD and game farms/feeders.

I guess overall my point is our society outpaced hunter/gatherers about 3000 years ago.

And there may be a time when we can't find exactly what we want, but I don't see the need to have to resort to wild game for all of our meat.

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I don't see a shortage of processed red meat to be a huge problem for our household. "Having to resort to" wild game? We haven't "resorted" to domestic beef other than enough hamburger to add fat to deer and exotic venson (and, of course an occasional beef brisket to smoke over mesquite once in a while) for many years. My family prefers lean red meat but wildlife ground meat tends to stick to the pan unless you add a bit of not-so-lean beef.

Patocazador said:

IMO ~90% of the population is incapable of being able to hunt anything other than squirrels in their yards. They are usually ignorant of the habits of wildlife plus many (most) could not hit what they were shooting at if they knew how to operate the weapon in the 1st place.

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And that's not all bad from our standpoint, is it?

Regards,
hps

Rembrandt said:

The premise is flawed, it assumes the primary commercial meat source (farm livestock) is gone and the secondary source (wild game) will be the new source of meat. I submit that wild game would get depleted first, it has no one to protect it and it runs wild. Domestic farm livestock would be housed, guarded, fed, and protected by the farmer.

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NOT just the farmer...
There is a beef farmer right down the street from me. He can't watch his steers/bull/cows 24/7
BUT that farmer could keep a small group of us in meat while We take turns guarding his herd 24/7. In fact it wouldn't take more than two steers a month all ground into burger to keep enough of us happy taking shifts on the property as armed guards and quite capable of fending off any "rustlers". (Probably less animals than that; better to be on a beef ration than no beef at all.) Grind all of the animal into ground beef so nobody get's upset that one or another of the guards got a better cut of the steer.

Keepin' my family in burgers, chili, tacos, meatballs, meatloaf, salisbury steak, sloppy joes, Jamaican meat pasties, etc. Not every day of the week of course.

OH YEAH I'm pretty sure the guy's herd would be fine.

LD