Recoil spring weight for 1911s

more weight for +P, less weight for 185gr. The 20lb are usually for 10mm or 45 super. For standard ball, 16lb. I sometimes shoot 200gr at 700, and thats largely where the 7# are used. I use a worn out 16, and it works fine.

One reason there are 7 lb recoil springs is because the same gun shoots 9mm. A Glock G21 and G17 are completely different guns, with different size frames and slides to shoot different calibers. A 1911 (other than Springfield's EMP) uses the same frame and slide to shoot 9mm, .38 Super, .40 S&W, 10mm, 45 Auto, .45 Super, and a bunch of other calibers. You need to tweak the performance with different recoil springs and mainsprings.

Many competitive shooter tune their recoil spring to help them with faster follow up shots. You only need enough recoil spring to reliable strip a round from the magazine and chamber it so once that threshold is met you can increase or decrease spring stiffness to get your sights to return to the same place as they were before the shot. If your sights return too high you need to increase spring stiffness to close the slide fast driving the muzzle of the gun down more. If your sights are lower after the shot you decrease spring stiffness so the slide closes slower so it does not drive the muzzle of the gun as far down. This tuning is very shooter specific since your body plays a huge role in the recoil motion of the handgun.

You can then use main spring (hammer spring) and the geometry of the firing pin stop to help control the rearward speed of the slide to compensate for a lower or higher than normal recoil spring. Obviously there is also the tuning for different cartridges and different slides that also necessitate the need for different recoil springs. A traditional 45 ACP gun is going to be different than a 40S&W with lots of slide lightening cuts or a 9mm Major Open gun with a compensatory and short slide etc.

Get all my springs from here, and they do describe the uses for the various weights to some degree.

https://www.gunsprings.com/

I used to have a 45 Springfield with a carry comp. It used 13lb springs from the factory (because of the comp).

All sorts of reasons. Many listed above

The 16 pound recoil spring is a creature of Wolff advertising.
The USGI recoil spring is specified by wire diameter, number of coils, and free length, not force. Somebody did the engineering mechanics on it and found it to be about 13 3/4 lbs.
Somebody put fresh Colt factory springs on a tester and found them 15 lbs or a bit less.

On the other hand, several "semi custom" manufacturers use 18 lb springs to ram their tight fitting slides home and cram cartridges into their undersize chambers.

One reason there are 7 lb recoil springs is because the same gun shoots 9mm

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Normal for 9mm in a full size 1911 is 14#.
Must be a rush on springs went to order a couple more spares the other day and no 14#s around (at least at the couple places I looked at the time)

American_Fusilier said:

what is the reason to use different weight recoil springs? What benefits would that bring? Would different weighted springs solve, or help feeding issues?

I'm talking just about 45acp here.

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People use heavier spring rate recoil springs to better manage felt recoil/muzzle climb and lighter spring rate, like bullseye match shooters shooting below published start charge loads, to reliably cycle the slide when using lighter powder charge loads.

When people complained about feeding/cycling/recoil issues, one of the things I checked was recoil spring rate. One test I used was pointing a cleared pistol at the ceiling and pulling the slide back and returning slowly to about 1/2" before full return to battery. Then I would release the slide to see if the slide would return to full battery quickly/positively or hesitated. If the slide would hesitate, I would suspect the recoil spring to be worn/test the recoil spring further.

Pushing the muzzle of cleared pistol inside a plastic medicine bottle on top of a bathroom scale allows you to measure the spring rate (At least to the accuracy of the scale resolution).

Recoil springs are consumable item that need regular replacement after several thousand rounds. I was surprised to find people complaining about recoil snap/muzzle climb only to learn that they never replaced the recoil spring after buying the pistol. I carry spare Glock recoil spring assembly and 1911 recoil springs in my range bag and when new recoil spring is inserted, magically recoil snap and muzzle climb are reduced.

I found some 16 lb 1911 recoil springs can quickly become 15 lb springs and use 16 lb springs for lighter target loads. When buying replacement, keep in mind 17 lb spring can become 16 lb spring over time - https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1005767031

I like Wolff variable power recoil springs - https://www.gunsprings.com/index.php?page=FAQ#question1

For shooting full power loads, I like Wilson Combat 18.5 lb springs - https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1005762016

As JTQ mentioned, 1911's in 9mm often share the same slide mass as the .45 cal. I should mention, I have a 9mm 1911, full mass slide (38 super slide), and it runs a 13lb spring. It also requires full power ammo to cycle. Common 9mm will run 115grains at 1150 FPS from a 5" barrel, but my 1911 needs about 1200 to get the slide to lock back. A lower spring, like a 7lb would probably work, and thats one of its markets. .

American_Fusilier said:

Why do many of them have different feed lips and followers?

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Followers -

Initially, it was probably to squeeze an 8th round into a tube designed for 7 rounds. Now, it's probably mostly marketing. " Here is our new and improved follower...", though I suspect some of it may be ease of manufacture for a follower design.

This thread has some follower discussion ( https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/1911-mag-follower.868578/#post-11504836 ), and at post #23 SSN Vet has picture of some common followers. The Metalform follower, second from the bottom on the right is commonly called the "GI" follower. It is the original John Browning design, but you can't use that follower and get 8 in a tube designed for 7.


Feed Lips -

The original Browning design had tapered feed lips, now commonly called GI feed lips. They work great will ball ammo, especially 230 gr ball. Outside of China and third world production, there aren't many companies still making this design. I know CheckMate does, and probably Metalform.

Nearly all current manufacture 1911 mags have wadcutter feed lips. They showed up in probably the 1970's as a way to get short rounds like those with semi-wadcutter bullets to feed better. Since most hollow point ammo is also relatively short, they also work well with self defense ammo. They also work with ball ammo, though not as smoothly as GI feed lips, so they became the manufacturer default design. I suspect their simple shape also makes manufacturing easier.

Hybrid feed lips are a Colt design from probably the 1980's. They are a compromise between GI and wadcutter feed lips. They feed relatively smoothly with ball ammo like GI feed lipped mags, and they also feed short rounds like wadcutter's and hollow points. I believe they are currently only offered by CheckMate, though Metalform did make them in the past.

American_Fusilier said:

Does this mean that caliber conversions are just a matter of a new barrel, right recoil spring, magazine, and maybe extractor and hand hammer spring?

Like if I wanted my 1911 to shoot 10mm, how much would be involved in that?

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Let me clarify my above statement about the same slide - that means it weighs the same (sure there must be a maker that tweaks their slide, but commonly not) whether it is a 9mm slide or .45 Auto slide. Because recoil impulse is different between 9mm, .45 Auto, and all the other rounds used in the 1911, the recoil spring must be adjusted to allow whatever recoil impulse the round is producing to drive the slide and return it to battery.

Generally, within caliber families, you could do that. A 9mm 1911, could share stuff with a .38 Super, 9x23 Win, etc.

On the other hand, you really can't swap between 9mm and .45 Auto, because the frame feed ramp and breach face is different.

The other key 1911 point to learn - There are no drop in parts on a 1911. It is not a Glock and it is not an AR. The gun has been in production for over 100 years, and there are so many different 1911 manufacturers, and parts makers, and while all their specifications are close, almost none of them are exactly the same. You may be able to snap some part right in, but it's not something I'd ever count on happening.

Can a professional gunsmith turn your .45 Auto 1911 into a 10mm 1911. Sure. Can I? No.

American_Fusilier said:

I've been seeing a lot of recoil spring sets on eBay for 1911s. It looks like 16 pounds is the standard weight, but you can get them as low as 7 pounds to as high as 20 pounds.

My question is, what is the reason to use different weight recoil springs? What benefits would that bring? Would different weighted springs solve, or help feeding issues?

I'm talking just about 45acp here.

What are your guys' thoughts?

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OEM on a 1911-A1 is 16#.

As I shoot exclusively 230 gr. ball and HP, with the occasional +P load in the woods... I run an OEM hammer spring and a Conventional Wolff 18.5# recoil spring.

Shoots great and every time.




GR

Changing recoil springs as stated already are a tuning tool . From the factory most guns are considered “ Oversprung “ but , from the factory most pistols do the best with a wide variety of loads . If you settle on one load you can tailor the pistol to that load and get that perfect ejection about 6 feet away in a nice neat little pile and the pistol will feel smoother and much easier to re-aquire the sight picture. But it’s a balancing act . Too light and not enough force to feed reliably although not usually a problem on non compensated guns . Also the slide may bottom out on the frame causing bad muzzle rise . Too heavy and the slide might not come back far enough to strip a cartridge out of the mag . Springs are relatively cheap , buy a range of them an find what works best for that gun . When you get the right recoil spring for that pistol and load it makes a big difference and you will be spoiled forever .

From Wolff Gun Springs the factory ratings from Colt for a GM 5" barrel.

"COLT 1911 FACTORY RECOIL SPRING NOTES
1. Factory rating for super .38 & 9mm is 14 Lbs.
2. Factory rating in .40 S&W is 19 Lbs.
3. Factory rating for the Colt .38 Spl. Midrange is 14 Lbs.
4. Factory rating for the Colt Ace .22 conversion is 14 Lbs.

When ordering recoil springs for above caliber's, please take these differences into account.


CONVENTIONAL RECOIL SPRINGS - .45 ACP

• Reduced Power...: 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15 Lb.
• Factory Standard.: 16 Lb.
• Extra Power........: 17, 18.5, 20, 22, 23, 24, 26, & 28 Lb"

https://www.gunsprings.com/COLT/1911 GOV'T PISTOL/cID1/mID1/dID1#3


Other manufacturers may recommend different weight springs. Les Baer for example told me 18.5 pds. Their slides are heavier than Colt's.

tipoc said:

Les Baer for example told me 18.5 pds. Their slides are heavier than Colt's.

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Perhaps not heavier, but certainly tighter.

Tighter yeah and just a touch heavier.

Get a couple...

GR

Here’s the Wilson Combat 17 lb. Flat Wire Recoil Spring that is on my DW Valor .45 ACP;
https://shopwilsoncombat.com/Flat-Wire-Recoil-Spring-5-Full-Size-45-ACP-Chrome-Silicon-17-Lb/productinfo/614G17/

I have the 15 lb. WC FWRS on my STI Trojan 9mm

Here is the WC FWRS guide rod & plug that is on both guns;
https://shopwilsoncombat.com/Full-Length-Guide-Rod-Full-Size-Flat-Wire/productinfo/25GRFW/

As Jim Watson said:
On the other hand, several "semi custom" manufacturers use 18 lb springs to ram their tight fitting slides home and cram cartridges into their undersize chambers.

if you have a gun with blueprint tolerances, you should not need a heavy action spring

I worked for Les Baer for 21 years. In that time, I lost count of the number of RMAs returned because some one had put a heavier than standard recoil spring in a gun.....and the result was the barrel had cracked lugs. Putting a heavy spring in a 1911 doesn't do the gun any favors. It slows the rearward motion of the slide but speeds up the forward motion. This can result in the barrel lugs pounding against the slide stop pin with undue force. It isn't the link's job to hold the barrel in battery, its only job it to pull the barrel down out of battery during unlocking. In a properly fitted barrel lock up, the lugs on the barrel bear against the slide stop pin. I'm talking standard barreled guns. A ramped barrel is a different cat entirely.

Light weight springs are used for calibers that have less recoil impulse than the 45. Wadcutter guns are a good example. If I remember correctly, we put 13# springs in those. 11# in 9MMs. Guns with ported barrels or compensated guns had different problems. I remember when I first worked for Les while he was still at Springfield Armory, we had a problem with Rob Leatham's gun. It was a 9X21 P-9 with a three port comp. The cartridge was loaded to obscene pressures in order to make major, probably close to 50,000,PSI. It had a ramped barrel with a supported chamber. The problem was, that comp bled off so much of the recoil impulse that we were down to a 9# spring and were still getting short stroking. We put a different comp on the gun and that solved the problem of short stroking but a new problem arose. That 9# spring didn't have enough oomph to strip rounds out of the magazine if it was loaded with more than ten or eleven rounds. We finally found the right combination of spring weight and energy bleed off from the comp, but it was an exercise in frustration.