308 vs 6.5

.308 has more recoil but I certainly wouldn't call it "violent". For shooting steel 6.5 Creedmoor will shoot flatter but you'll have cheaper and more plentiful ammo with the .308.

Oh boy here we go...

IMHO either will work out to 800 yards fairly well in a good gun with good ammo. Always assuming the shooter is capable.

In general 308 does have more recoil than 6.5 CM but having shot both in identical guns the differences though noticeable but not large. I don't consider either abusive if the gun fits the shooter and we are not talking about feather weight rifles.

6.5 CM is the new hotness and getting a lot of attention and thus there is a lot of good selections in the market. That said the 308 is still very popular and has lots of options too.

308 is going to have the option to shoot heavier bullet with slightly more energy at close ranges. 6.5 Creedmoor is going to shoot flatter and carry energy down range better but again these differences are relatively small.

Have fun deciding.

To me recoil is accumulative. Shooting a couple rounds of .308 - no problem. Shooting 20 - 30, rounds of .308, me and my shoulder are both starting to tire and my groups definitely show it. If it were me I would go with the 6.5.

P.S. I own a heavy barrel Rem 700 in .308 that I use for target shooting. I don't own a 6.5 Creedmore. 6.5x55 is my favorite rifle cartridge though. I reload my own ammo which will also likely have a bearing on someones choice.

Out to about 700-800 yards the 2 are fairly comparable in performance with the best loads. The 308 is running out of gas at about 800 though, the 6.5 is good for double that range.

Actual recoil varies depending on the exact load, and the weight of the rifle. With my rifles, (if both weigh the same) the 308 has about 18 ft lbs recoil. The 6.5 about 14 ft lbs. A typical 243 or 30-30 is around 12 ft lbs and a 30-06 is around 20 ft lbs just for comparison. While neither is considered brutal a 308 is closer to 30-06 recoil, 6.5 is closer to 243 or 30-30.

I've owned and shot a lot of 308's over the years and like the round a lot. I have four 308 rifles. But I've also had a chance to shoot 4-5 rifles in 6.5 CM. The least accurate 6.5 I've shot is more accurate than any 308 I've ever fired.

For shooting steel 6.5 Creedmoor will shoot flatter but you'll have cheaper and more plentiful ammo with the .308.

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The 6.5 doesn't necessarily shoot flatter, but the much better aerodynamics of the bullets retain speed better. The trajectories are pretty close, at least to 800 yards. But once a bullet drops below the speed of sound it becomes unstable and accuracy falls off. Typical 308 loads are reaching that point at around 800 yards, the 6.5 doesn't reach that point until about 1 mile. Of course there are variables. Both can be stretched a bit farther with hot handloads and really long barrels.

In 2020 ammo isn't an issue. I can buy 6.5 ammo anywhere and it is cheaper than 308 anymore. Especially if buying quality ammo suitable for long range shooting.

I don't believe it is really a matter of being able to "take it" or being able to handle the recoil of shooting a .308. IHMO .308 recoil isn't that bad. After some number of rounds you are going to start to tire and your groups are going to start opening up.

I have an almost identical heavy barrel Rem 700 in .223. After 40 or 50 rounds I am starting to noticeably tire and my groups start to open up... with the Rem 700 in .308 that point just comes sooner, after 20 or 30 or so rounds.

I can place the first 300 WM shot as accurately as I can place the first shot of .223. The second shot will show a difference... the 3rd through 6th shot will show ever increasing differences.

mcb said:

Oh boy here we go...

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Again....

I typed a whole thing...but..

6.5 easier to hit with.

.308 cheaper to hit with.

Axis II said:

I can take it but don’t want my 5ft 4 girlfriend getting pounded by 308 if it’s that bad.

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A funny thing about people and guns... let's say you and her try a particular .308 rifle... depending on how the stock fits each of you, she could perceive a lot less of a pounding than you do. I've seen stock fit have a huge impact, for better or worse, on who likes what rifle and cartridge. Also, ammo selection.

Axis II said:

I can take it but don’t want my 5ft 4 girlfriend getting pounded by 308 if it’s that bad.

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mustanger98 said:

... depending on how the stock fits each of you, she could perceive a lot less of a pounding than you do.

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I've shot my .308 Savage 24" bolt gun side-by-side with a friend's RPR in 6.5CM... there is a noticeable difference in the recoil, and I would say my Savage was the heavier of the 2. If you are shooting for fun, and don't mind either a) the cost of good factory ammos, or b) handloading for your rifle... I would say get the 6.5. A well laid out 6.5 is an easy rifle to shoot, and shoot well, without fighting the recoil of the .308. If you are sensitive to cost... get the .308. As Mustanger mentions... the rifle really has to fit the shooter as well, particularly a person of small build or stature. Trying to hang on to a rifle that is too big, no matter the chambering, isn't going to turn out well either way.

308 with right load shoots sweet.

Charlie98 said:

I've shot my .308 Savage 24" bolt gun side-by-side with a friend's RPR in 6.5CM... there is a noticeable difference in the recoil, and I would say my Savage was the heavier of the 2. If you are shooting for fun, and don't mind either a) the cost of good factory ammos, or b) handloading for your rifle... I would say get the 6.5. A well laid out 6.5 is an easy rifle to shoot, and shoot well, without fighting the recoil of the .308. If you are sensitive to cost... get the .308. As Mustanger mentions... the rifle really has to fit the shooter as well, particularly a person of small build or stature. Trying to hang on to a rifle that is too big, no matter the chambering, isn't going to turn out well either way.

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Not only too big a rifle for the individual, but also too small. I've been on the receiving end of a too short LOP and didn't like it either.

On handloading, you can tailor a load to you and your rifle... more accuracy and less recoil in the same cartridge.

Axis II said:

I think I’ll save up for a savage 10 in 6.5.

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That's what I have... a Savage 10 TAC in .308. I like it a lot. If you are going to shoot that kind of distance... save some money for good glass, it will make all the difference at those ranges.

If you gave me a 308win barrel and bullets, meant for 800 yard shooting, I’d sell them and buy a 6 creed barrel and bullets with the proceeds. If you gave me a 6.5 creed barrel and bullets, I’d probably shoot them up, rather than selling. Probably.

There are plenty of situations where I would rather have a 308 than a 6.5 creedmoor, but shooting steel at 800 yards surely isn’t one of them. 308 offers absolutely no advantage of any kind over a 6.5 for that.

As for cheaper, around here at least, the 6.5 CM is just as cheap as .308 at wally world. I would believe that they sold more 6.5 CM based on who I know that shoots them. Lots of 20 and 30-somethings that think the .308 is an outdated cartridge now.

If the consensus is 6.5, then I would pick the .308. If the consensus is .308, I would pick the 6.5. It is the polished rifleman/ woman behind the caliber that makes the real difference - that concept is never grasped very well - even on a shooting forum - maybe someday.

Steve S. said:

If the consensus is 6.5, then I would pick the .308. If the consensus is .308, I would pick the 6.5. It is the polished rifleman/ woman behind the caliber that makes the real difference - that concept is never grasped very well - even on a shooting forum - maybe someday.

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True until you compare two rifleman who’s skills are equal but one has vastly superior equipment for the task. If the goal is to learn then picking worse equipment will only lead to frustration and a longer learning curve.

someguy2800 said:

True until you compare two rifleman who’s skills are equal but one has vastly superior equipment for the task. If the goal is to learn then picking worse equipment will only lead to frustration and a longer learning curve.

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Excerpt in this case there is nothing vastly superior in the 308 vs 6.5 CM argument. Both cartridges have advantages and neither vastly does anything over the other.

mcb said:

Excerpt in this case there is nothing vastly superior in the 308 vs 6.5 CM argument. Both cartridges have advantages and neither vastly does anything over the other.

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In the specific context of shooting steel at 700-800 yards the 6.5 creedmoor holds every advantage, and not by a small amount. Calculate the wind drift of a 147 ELD compared to anything you want from a 308.

edit: I was curious myself so I checked. Hornady’s factory 168 gr ELD loading in 308 predicts 52 inches of wind drift with a 10 mph crosswind at 800. Hornady’s factory 147 ELD loading in 6.5C predicts 37 inches of drift. That’s why nobody is competing with a 308 unless they are made to. Even the 6.5C has already been made obsolete competitively by the 6mm’s.

The Savage Axis is a budget/entry level hunting rifle and, in that role, is a good value for money proposition. As a target rifle, particularly at the ranges you propose, it will never be suitable no matter what caliber it is chambered in. It's light, notoriously poorly bedded, has a relatively flexy stock, and its recoil "lug" is not ideally suited. For 800 yard work, you will need to spend @ 4-5 times the cost of the rifle in glass.

This idea is a waste of your time and money. You can get a used Savage 110 action target rig and decent glass for under a grand with patience. A Savage Axis is an entry level deer rifle.

For example: https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/savage-axis-poor-accuracy.873173/#post-11601791

And if somebody really wanted to take all the recoil out of a long range rifle, they might take a .22-250 or 223/5.56 crankbolt with a 1:9 or faster twist and handload bullets in the 75-100gr range. And last I looked, MidwayUSA lists .224's that heavy.