Discharge in Auto Accident

Electricmo said:

My guess would be seatbelt somehow helped to get trigger pulled. This might make a case for a safety.

Click to expand...

Safety or double action revolver ! Thanks to everyone for posting good points to ponder .
Does make you wonder what could happen with your own gear in a case like this .
I think a combo of the seat belt and holster could have been the cause .

Good thing I don't believe on being forced to wear a seat belt.

I'm no safety expert on the smith and Wesson... but ive totaled enough vehicles to probably be an expert on that part. Ive never had any gun go off from impact. I put a motorcycle in a ditch after hitting a Boulder in the road going..... well...way over 45. Had a Beretta 96 in a shoulder holster. The gun broke my ribs but didn't go off.

I jumped a subaru off a cliff once. Fell 40-50 feet and landed on its wheels. Busted the wheel bearings and struts, Smashed my butt (and by extension the rest of me) and all vertebrae down into the seat. Even took my breathe and did a little nerve damage. Then bounced and flipped off into the new river. But the Glock in my crossbreed didn't go off. If any gun had the opportunity to fire that was it. The impact and energy was in the direction to make the firing pin strike the primer. And I assure you it was a sudden stop. Paralyzed me for a second or two. Figured sure I was going to drown paralyzed if I made it to the water. I made it to the water but it was too cold to drown in. Lol. 1 small piece of glass is left in that car and not 1 good body panel. Not even the fuel door was reusable..... yet not one air bag deployed.

Rolled a fox body a few times off a mountain once with the same glock 27. No discharge, also no airbag

Also crashed a newer Mustang, deploying the air bags even though the car was still drivable. No discharge. Same Glock. Of all my wrecks and there were more, that's the only air bag I ever had deployed. Air bags destroyed the dash, wheel, and windshield

Those last two would have put most force perpendicular to the firing pin though.

What kind of vehicle were you driving? Some seat belts have a device the tightens them during an impact.

Just curious, how did the rest of the rounds in the magazine look? Did it chamber the next round?

This incident highlights exactly why striker guns without manual safeties are more susceptible to unforeseen events than guns carried either with a positive manual safety or full-stroke, full-weight DA trigger. Not every contingency is effectively mitigated by trigger control, training, or even the "best" holster.

Glad y’all are ok. Thank you for posting this. I think we all want to know what happened if you can find out. I would agree to not carry that gun for the time being.

I would like to know if and what you told the police officer.

swoter said:

I would like to know if and what you told the police officer.

Click to expand...

I don’t think that would need to be mentioned. I was wondering what type of vehicle the op had. If totaled or not and any need for repairs to the “drain” hole added.

Where did the brass end up? When you realized the gun had fired and checked it was the slide out of battery with the next round partially chambered? I wouldn't think it would completely cycle correctly unless something was holding the gun fairly firmly

We'll probably never know how it happened but usually something like a shirt tail is in the holster and pressure from that sudden movement or stop pressures the trigger to fire the gun.

With all the talk about maybe laws may be passed banning high capacity mags, I've been thinking about single stacks and maybe a striker fired one. I've so far only owned revolvers or hammer pistols. I think I'll probably stick with them. crestoncowboy listed almost every possible sort of accident known to man without a discharge but strange things do happen when all that force and energy goes haywire. I almost lost an eye when someone put tire skid marks down the hood of my MGB years ago from what I can only surmise was a piece of flying chrome from somewhere. Something like that could find its way into a holster - with enough force to probably move any trigger.

Did that round hit anything under the car like fuel or brake lines, wiring or the transmission? That's something I'd not want to mention if no one else reported hearing a gunshot.

Hazwaste said:

Yet, that's exactly what happened. What is your suspicion?

Click to expand...

Ok, strange then. If the trigger wasn't pulled, I would have to guess that pistol is faulty.

Just an FYI some of those seat belt tighteners use an explosive charge to tighten on the buckle end which could account for the smell and sound. Glad that everyone is ok.

Hazwaste said:

Maybe. I'm at a loss. If that is the cause then that's going to put an end to me wearing one while driving.

Click to expand...

Send to S&W...obviously something is wrong..either the gun or holster or both. I would certainly get a new holster as well..kinda like falling off yer bike or motorcycle and hitting your helmet..you get a new one regardless of 'obvious' damage.

Perhaps something with the seat belt also..since the 'buckle' is close to the HG..

AMraider said:

Just an FYI some of those seat belt tighteners use an explosive charge to tighten on the buckle end which could account for the smell and sound. Glad that everyone is ok.

Click to expand...

That said (first Ive heard of it), did you count the number of rounds in the mag?

Hazwaste said:

The Smith chambered the next round.

Didn't look in depth for the shell or hole.

Click to expand...

AMraider said:

Just an FYI some of those seat belt tighteners use an explosive charge to tighten on the buckle end which could account for the smell and sound.

Click to expand...

It would seem even more unlikely than the gun going off, that a holstered gun would chamber another round, and still be holstered.

It's possible AMraider's explanation (which I was also unaware of) is the answer unless you can confirm a bullet hole in your holster, the round count in your magazine, the empty case somewhere in your car, and the bullet hole in the car.

Send it back to SW. Sell it when it comes back. Toss that holster in the garbage.
Somethings seriously wrong. I'd just chop it up in my saw and dispose of it.

Verify round count first though. Lol.

Hazwaste said:

The Smith chambered the next round.

Click to expand...

If it chambered a round then either you have an obscenely loose holster or the gun, for some amount of time, was most of the way out of the holster. Else you likely have had a failure to extract or empty case in the chamber. I'm trying to think of the belt slide I had like yours and I feel like it was tight enough to at least impede proper slide function, especially successfully loading the next round. I guess that wouldn't be hard to check.

AMraider said:

Just an FYI some of those seat belt tighteners use an explosive charge to tighten on the buckle end which could account for the smell and sound. Glad that everyone is ok.

Click to expand...

That sounds interesting and perhaps likely, I wasn't aware of that myself.

I've seen some pics of that holster and noticed that the leather is shaped around the trigger. How bad is that?
It's obvious to me that the pistol went forward and down and the leather of the trigger guard pulled the trigger.
Get a kydex holster.

JR24 said:

If it chambered a round then either you have an obscenely loose holster or the gun, for some amount of time, was most of the way out of the holster. Else you likely have had a failure to extract or empty case in the chamber. I'm trying to think of the belt slide I had like yours and I feel like it was tight enough to at least impede proper slide function, especially successfully loading the next round. I guess that wouldn't be hard to check.



That sounds interesting and perhaps likely, I wasn't aware of that myself.

Click to expand...

Yes, if it cycled fully, the gun wasn't fully in the holster when that discharge occurred; we're all familiar with how little 'drag' it takes on a slide to cause it to malfunction with a semi-auto.
Whatever happened, it seems that it didn't happen 'in the holster' from that data point.

Oh, and for the (usual folks) using this as a data point to not carry striker fired arms; conclusions before fully understanding the data, and using correlation rather than causation as a bar for connecting events and consequences, is what leads you to those faulty conclusions. Not knowing what caused this (or even, really, what happened), blithely stating another type of firearm would have prevented it is illogical.

Larry

On the face of it, I can't believe the acceleration of being rear ended discharged the gun; that much acceleration would have spattered you into a chunky mist.

I have to think the acceleration shifted something (holster, seat belt, etc), and somehow actuated the trigger.

JTQ said:

Just as a data point, here is a post from a guy that hit an F-250 at 45MPH while riding a motorcycle.

He was carrying a SIG P220 (hammer fired DA/SA pistol) in a Mitch Rosen IWB holster. The gun didn't discharge and remained in the holster.

https://forum.m1911.org/showthread.php?72074-carrying-on-your-scoot

Click to expand...

The P220 is a great firearm.

edwardware said:

On the face of it, I can't believe the acceleration of being rear ended discharged the gun; that much acceleration would have spattered you into a chunky mist.

I have to think the acceleration shifted something (holster, seat belt, etc), and somehow actuated the trigger.

Click to expand...

In my opinion the seat belt forced the gun to go forward and rotate counter clockwise and the leather trigger guard of the holster pulled the trigger.

Wow, glad you're both ok, I also carry a S&W Shield but mine is a 45 with a safety and I have a DeSantis holster, I also would like to hear what both manufacturers say about your experience, please keep us informed.