10/22 Accuracy Question...I'm confused.

If you're getting 5/8" groups at 50 yards with a standard 10/22 you're doing better than average. Typically 10/22's will be in the 1"-1 1/4" range at 50 yards even with good ammo. Ruger's are hard to predict, I've seen some from the factory that will shoot 1/2" or near 1/2" 50 yard groups and others closer to 2".

If you're getting 5/8" groups I could live with that. Before buying another barrel I'd try different ammo.

I have 3 of the 10/22's, and 2 of them have aftermarket barrels. One I put together years ago with an aftermarket heavy bull barrel just because I could. The other was one of these.

Ruger® 10/22® Carbine Autoloading Rifle Model 31145


I picked it up cheap to use as a knock around truck/ATV rifle, but it wouldn't shoot well at all, 2" @ 50 yards with good ammo. I ended up replacing the trigger with a Ruger BX trigger and a lightweight target barrel. The finished gun is still lightweight, but will group inside 1" at 50 yards. But it isn't a cheap rifle anymore. I paid more for the trigger and barrel than the rifle. With a more powerful scope it may well be close to a 1/2" gun, but I for what I want to do I keep a 1-4X scope on it.

This barrel I bought.

E. R. Shaw Barrel Ruger 10/22 22 Long Rifle Sporter Contour 1 16 Twist (midwayusa.com)

I built my target 10-22 using a Shaw match barrel with Bentz chamber. 3/8" is common with good ammo. The Kids trigger group doesn't hurt either.

A question will answer your question

did you shoot a 5/8 3 shot group once? Or is your average for a few 5 shot groups 5/8?

a Kidd barrel will get you the consistency to do the latter. The internet will let you claim the former

10/22 match SK ammo box stock as you can see the consistency isn’t there even though one good group was lucked into.

jmr40 said:

If you're getting 5/8" groups I could live with that. Before buying another barrel I'd try different ammo.

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What he said.

Phydeaux642 said:

spending $200+ just to gain 1/8" seems like a lot of money for that gain

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Indeed it is, and the guys that say you suck will say that no matter what size group you shoot.

Phydeaux642 said:

I have just started getting into shooting rifles, mostly because I started going to a range that has room out to 100 yards. I have shot my AR with a red dot at defensive distances and a CZ Carbine with open sights but wanted to shoot something that was scoped so I could see what I was doing. The CZ didn't let me do that too well since my eyes aren't what they used to be.
I started with a 10/22 because 1) that's what I had and 2) because of ammo costs. It's a standard Ruger carbine that I put into a Magpul stock and installed a Volquartsen target hammer kit and a 2-7 rimfire scope. The first time with this setup I was able to get my five shot groups down to 5/8" @ 50 yards. Some folks have told me that that is okay accuracy and others all but came out and said "You stink".
My question is this: while looking at Kidd barrels online and reading about them, they all said that there is a 1/2" group guarantee at 50 yards which isn't much smaller than 5/8". So, are they saying that any slob should be able to pull 1/2" groups with their barrels and that a real shooter should be getting one-hole groups at 50 yards? Because spending $200+ just to gain 1/8" seems like a lot of money for that gain.

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A 5/8th group at 50 yards is very good. Unless you are going for real "competition" type shooting. Are you just trying to have some fun? Maybe take small game and or pests? You are gold for all here.
ALL .22's will seem to have different taste in ammo. Buy a couple boxes of a few kinds and see what they do. With many guns some ammo will group much better.
Trigger? A drop in trigger can make a HUGE difference without spending a lot. They also make some barrels for the rifle that will turn it into a VERY serious shooter. Its all in what you want.
As for the critics? Take some of them with you and see if they can shoot as well as they talk a shot. I have found VERY few can shoot anything like they say they can shoot. In my life I have known a handful of VERY good shots. The kind that make it look easy because they were just that good. The norm is you get the person to the range and at 50 yards they can hardly keep it on paper.

Phydeaux642 said:

. . . I was able to get my five shot groups down to 5/8" @ 50 yards. Some folks. . . said "You stink".

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Now you know who not to listen to. That's pretty respectable for a stock 10/22, and not shameful for a 10/22T.

jmr40 said:

If you're getting 5/8" groups at 50 yards with a standard 10/22 you're doing better than average.

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I agree! You may have a 10/22 that shoots right out of the box…

jmr40 said:

Before buying another barrel I'd try different ammo.

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I agree here, too! Get three or four (or 20) different brands of ammo - preferably higher end - Eley, SK, Lapua, etc. 22’s are fickle - they like what they like…See if one or more tightens up your groups (or is more consistent). Assuming you tighten the group, and get more consistency…I would then look at the trigger*…I just happen to like good triggers

After this, I would look at a barrel…

*if the groups do not tighten to your liking, maybe a barrel before a trigger…

Phydeaux642 said:

It was repeatable. The 5/8" wasn't an average, it was my best group and I did repeat it several times. I had groups that were bigger because of a flyer, which I'm sure was me moving around. I really have no idea what I'm doing, but I sure am having fun.

Oh, and I was shooting CCI standard velocity.

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having fun is the important part

unfortunately fliers count and not all are shooter induced. Kidd’s claim will include them. Not the shooter induced ones but the mechanical accuracy of the barrel.

anyone telling you that sucks I promise is cherry picking one group they shot once. And is nowhere near as accurate as you are.

now start averaging 5 shot groups and prepare humbled and challenged

R.W.Dale said:

anyone telling you that sucks I promise is cherry picking one group they shot once. And is nowhere near as accurate as you are.

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I can shoot 100 yard one hole groups all day long. Over my shoulder with a mirror, blindfolded at night during a hurricane. Well, at least on the Internet I can.

Phydeaux642 said:

So, are they saying that any slob should be able to pull 1/2" groups with their barrels and that a real shooter should be getting one-hole groups at 50 yards?

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I’d ask to see them shoot those groups with a stock 10/22. And,I’d have money ready to say they couldn’t

I have owned 10/22. They are reliable but terribly inaccurate.

I know my 10/22 can to 1" 25 yard groups, with the open sights. Add a scope, I'm sure it can really impress. Back when it had a scope it was fairly easy to put 100 rounds into 1 hole, about 1/2".... again 25 yards, but its not like its going to start blowing out at 50.
My 10/22 is a stainless pencil barrel from before the "improved" plastic crap switch.
As far as 5/8" is crap.... so 50% of people I have talked to about shooting legitimately do not understand a yard and a foot are two different measurements, 50% lie or exaggerate, and 1, in 20 years of shooting, meeting dozens of "great shots" has actually gone out and proven his claims.
I long ago stopped listening to anyone criticizing or bragging unless they could show me live.

Phydeaux642 said:

My question is this: while looking at Kidd barrels online and reading about them, they all said that there is a 1/2" group guarantee at 50 yards which isn't much smaller than 5/8". So, are they saying that any slob should be able to pull 1/2" groups with their barrels and that a real shooter should be getting one-hole groups at 50 yards? Because spending $200+ just to gain 1/8" seems like a lot of money for that gain.

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One hole groups with a 22 lr are exceedingly rare, which of course why, if I get one, I claim I do it all the time!

Carl Zoos of Champion Shooter Supply, claimed that all the old factory targets looked like this, because the ammunition was better.



And, more or less, Lones Wigger agreed that the older ammunition was better because X counts were higher, and the high X counts (152X's in a 1600) were more frequent. Only Eley and Laupa know for sure, and they are not telling.

I have had my smallbore prone rifles tested at the Lapua wind tunnel, and by Eley. Ammunition that shoots to 12 or 13mm at 50 yards is basically the best you can get. Sure, everyone has small shot clusters, which they pass off as something great, but, try to shoot 40 shot groups, and see how large the group gets.

Now, is spending $200 to gain an 1/8" worth it? Well what's an 1/8 of an inch worth to you. To a target shooter, oh yes, they will kill for an 1/8 of an inch.





They might kill for a 1/16 of an inch. But, what's your target? My factory Ruger 10/22 grouped 1.25" with its best ammunition at 50 yards and I killed a whole bunch of squirrels with it, mostly less than 25 yards. Dead is dead.

I hate to say accuracy is over rated, but the shooting community does not hunt much anymore, instead they are shooting on 600 lb benches, at paper targets. Because the rifle is rested, they get much smaller groups than if they held the rifle. And of course, bench rifles weigh too much to shoot off the bench, or carry. Function reliability used to be important when shooters were firing rapid fire in NRA high power, but, the F Class guys are shooting single shot rifles with no ejectors, so, they don't care if the round feeds from a magazine.

It is my opinion that the current trend is ultimate accuracy, with feed and extraction being secondary. So if your hearts desire is to shoot knots, and you don't care if slight variations in ammunition don't chamber, well pay the money. Tight match chambers are un friendly to ammunition variations, and require the chamber be cleaned often. I found that my Volquartsen barreled 10/22 would not eject unfired rounds, because the chamber was so tight. Either shoot the round out, or use a cleaning rod, to knock a loaded round out of the barrel, with the muzzle pointing at your forehead. Can't see a down side to that, can we?

First if you’ve just started shooting those groups will shrink as you get better. Even off a front rest and rear bag I can pull a shot with the best of them.

Second 5/8” groups at 50 yards is quite good for a stock rifle. My old Marlin 60 will usually do that. See above for when it doesn’t. I’ve shot a single one hole group at 100 yards with it, and I’ll probably be gone before I do it again.

Third to put things in perspective a 5/8” group at 50 yards is a 1.25” group at 100. Without hand picked ammo and in a stock rifle of any caliber that’s pretty good. It’s much more difficult to hand load 22 LR than center fire rounds but testing different ammo is almost as good.

I find standard velocity fare to be more accurate in my rifles and even pistol, though I don’t think it pushes many ammo brands above the sound barrier with its 5” barrel.

Remember that exponentially smaller gains in accuracy come with exponentially larger costs. Shaving an 8th of an inch off your group size might just be a couple hundred rounds of practice or switching ammo. Cutting it in half could easily be 4 to 8 times more effort/expense.

Do four things. The first three are here:
1. Cut out a 1/2-3/4" piece of thin* (high-pressure roadbike) bicycle inner tube and place it as a shim under the barrel at the end of the forearm.
2. Make sure the receiver is centered in the stock recess -- not up against either the forward stop or the rearward stop. Centered.
3. Tighten the stock screw to no more than 15-18 inch-lbs. No more as it will otherwise warp the aluminum receiver.

The fourth is to get some CCI Std Velocity

With these minor factors accommodated, the 10/22 can produce truly superb accuracy.

in my experience Ruger 10/22's vary in accuracy alot, I shot against a stock older one that almost beat my CZ. We needed a tie breaker for me to win the match. Others not so much.

Anyone claiming that a 5/8th inch group out of a stock 10/22 sucks, obviously doesn't know what they're talking about.

It's been my experience over the years that 10/22's are one of the best semi auto. 22's on the market. Even with off the shelf .22 ammo, mine will hold around an inch at 50 yards.

With minor mods, they go from ok to amazing, then throw in quality ammo and you have a serious tack driver. A good scope will also take it to another level.

When the ammo scammers stop with their BS and the prices come back from bizzaro world, shooting a .22 all day will be fun again! It's still fun but thinking about my dwindling .22 ammo fort, isn't fun at all.

It’s a mass produced rifle, you’re shooting fine.

I think mine grouped around an inch at 50 when i scoped it. It's gonna cool down in a few days weather wise. I'll take it out. And shoot it. Post up my results. Mines a wood stock one. Only mods are auto bolt release and mag release.

I had a Kidd 10/22 setup, and it didn’t shoot any better then my other 22s. Ammo is so inconsistent, unless you buy the big dollar stuff, you might as well reload center fire ammo if your going to spend that much! 5/8” groups are fantastic, save your money

Just for giggles…sliding off topic, but the video embedded does go into 10/22’s

https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2021/08/06/barrel-harmonics-tuners/

Phydeaux642 said:

and others all but came out and said "You stink"

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Those others will shoot an entire box at a target, then pick the three shots that happen to cloverleaf and claim that as "a group" too.
They often have flashy spotscars or excessively-lifted tucks, too. And start flamewars on arfcom just to see "who wins."

The question really is "Were you happy with the group size you got--for the effort you put into it?

That latter is a key part. I know guys who will jam themselves into wool or canvas jackets in 100ºF weather, bind themselves into a sling until it make their arm go numb before even leaning down to sight up on a target with ammo they've sorted by weight, LOA, make model license & registration, and then gripe that their barrel must be "shot out" (or "too warm") for having a bullet impact a half bullet diameter over. Some of these people describe this as "fun."
To each their own.
Me, I'm happy enough to be able to make a crabapple dance.