.22 Short for self defense?
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DT Guy
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Statistical non-zero probabilities notwithstanding, will you admit you would not (were you, in fact, a criminal)?
There are folks who would charge a BAR-and have done so-but that doesn't make a BAR an ineffective weapon.
Larry
If I were desperate criminal bent on mayhem, I have no idea what I might do.
Such characters do put people in harms way and often harm them seriously. Sometimes the display of a gun dissuades them timely, but often it does not.
I would never count on it. Ever.
DT Guy
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Howland937
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That's something to consider. The mental state of people commiting crimes isn't always easy to decipher after the fact, much less in the moment. Can't really count on them to behave rationally. It's not always as simple as risk vs. reward.
Skylerbone
Member
I recall as a youngster a man attacking my father at the mall. I later learned that this man was mentally unstable and a convicted pedophile who happened to recall with great clarity the officer who arrested him.
Despite knowing he was picking a fight with a police officer who was trained for the situation, he went for it. And lost. Crazy is crazy with the only pattern being unpredictability.
Despite knowing he was picking a fight with a police officer who was trained for the situation, he went for it. And lost. Crazy is crazy with the only pattern being unpredictability.
OP
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TTv2
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You wouldn't even count on a .32, so I don't expect your opinion would change regardless of what the gun was that was shooting the .22 Short.
OP
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TTv2
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This thread needs more pics of your wife you lucky man, you.
How are we talking about elderly small framed women?
I thought a gun guy from this forum, who owns more than one already, asked about carrying a .22long pistol?
To which “no” is a reasonable and good answer.
It’s hard to give an accurate answer if we don’t stay in one spot.
It was an example of wouldn't a 22 be "better than nothing".
The example of a small middle age woman, my wife is over age 50 and as seen in the pic not large.
I'm 6'1 about 205# and have significantly more upper body strength than my wife.
Arguably, she needs a pistol capable of stopping a large / violent attacker ASAP even more than me; her minimum carry is a Kahr P9 with HST 124+P
The less physical strength one has, the more they need the gun they are carrying to stop the threat(s) before threats make contact.
I could post examples of attackers not being quickly incapacitated by 5 or more hits, but it usually doesn't matter.
Those advocating for "better than nothing" invariably dismiss examples as invalid / inapplicable for ... reasons.
.22 short / .22 mag / 32 the question should be: Where would you rather defend yourself with that rather than marginal "better than nothing" 380?
Of course the answer for most people would be nowhere.
It's fantasy. People are caught up in this phony romanticism of these tiny guns. I'd rather have half a used canister of pepper spray than a tiny mouse gun. This is like the 9mm for grizzly crowd nonsense that comes around like clockwork. All hail the moron trail guide in Alaska that made the conscious decision to bring a 9mm and was lucky enough to get the job done cause he had the right ammo. Oh... but it was not luck right... says the mesmerized. The fact is, the experienced guide for over 30 years was an imbecile that day for choosing a 9mm. He got lazy. He got complacent. And then he got lucky. But he gives the willfully complacent hope that some tiny gun is all you need.
Even on your best day with real power, you might lose. Why enhance the chances of losing? It's like people are doing all they can to give the bad guys the upper hand by arming themselves with the least powerful options. I suggest these mouse gun warriors actually talk to people who have been attacked and had the crap beat out of them or had to watch as their family members were beaten down in front of them. Then lay out some pistols and ask which one's they wished they had that day... I'd be surprised if they picked a 22 short. But people don't factor in reality with these choices as long as they don't have a horrific experience in their lives to set them straight. Some people should try learning from the mistakes of others.
I hear people mention Jim Tarr on this forum. Anyone know why he won't carry anything less then a full size pistol?
That has nothing to do with what I as a criminal might do.
.32 S&W? No. Long, or ACP? maybe. H&R Magnum? Better.
Double Naught Spy
Sus Venator
Well, if you want a tiny deep concealment piece and the .22 short is too big for your wishes, this is what you need. Look at the devastating damage to the pop can. After all, sometimes just the mere presence of a gun will diffuse a situation and if push comes to shove, you can just put this in your attacker's face and pull the trigger. This will definitely make their reconsider what they are going to do to you. If going small is such a good idea, then going smaller has got to be freaking outstanding.
Targa
Member
^^That is incredible!!
chicharrones
needs more ammo
Monac
Member
In terms of the "main point", I think that if you go back and read the OP's question about 22 Short, you have answered it by conceding the "potential it has for defensive use" is absolutely minimal and should be considered only in extreme cases, such as great physical weakness on the part of the shooter or the complete lack of any alternative at the time. No one was asking about its capacity for killing, or about the capacity of a firearm made for it, or any wound from it, to intimidate an offender.
Rex B
Member
I have a couple of Astra Cubs in .22 Short. They are reliable and surprisingly accurate. I would not carry one for self defense. They are also heavier than my P32, both fully loaded.
I was at the Fort Worth Cabelas a couple weeks ago. Their .22 shelf held probably 50 100-packs of CCI HP Shorts. The only other option was 6 boxes of Hyper-velocity segmented rounds. I need to go back and pick up some of those Shorts
Some wished for a DA from NAA. Put me on that list.
I was at the Fort Worth Cabelas a couple weeks ago. Their .22 shelf held probably 50 100-packs of CCI HP Shorts. The only other option was 6 boxes of Hyper-velocity segmented rounds. I need to go back and pick up some of those Shorts
Some wished for a DA from NAA. Put me on that list.
JCooperfan1911
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Aguila and CCI both make a full power “high velocity” .22 short cartridge.
It would NOT be fun to be on the receiving end, and any gun beats no gun at all.
It would NOT be fun to be on the receiving end, and any gun beats no gun at all.
How is that at all meaningful in a self defense case?
Olon
Member
Well, take all of the shortcomings noted for .22 mag and magnify them several times as you descend through .22 long, .22 lr, and .22 short.
The penetration tests were interesting, but not really reflective of most self defense shooting situations, but more of execution shooting. Even then, shortcomings were apparent.
Well, that was a rifle and really wasn't a defensive shooting. She sniped the grizzly from short range, plain and simple. She got to pick and choose her shot, much like Ethan did with his .22 short testing. The problem is that in self defense situations that are often very fluid, people don't often get much of a chance to 'place' their shots where they want them. While they may be hoping to hit a spot, they are realistically happy to be hitting an area of the body...and a lot of shots just outright miss.
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I had a self defense instructor who loved his NAA Mini revolvers. He believed in carrying one as a back-up to his knife. He referred to it as a "Get off me" gun. In some ways, his logic made decent sense. Basically, the notion was that beyond arm reach distance, it was difficult to cock, aim and fire the little gun effectively (hitting the target) while in motion and dealing with a target that is in motion. For him, it was more of a contact distance weapon more so than a standoff weapon, although he said the gun certainly could be fairly accurate at distance. Later, when I purchased mine, I mounted a red dot sight on it (maybe the first every to do so) and managed to hit 3 or 5 or 4 of 5 rounds at a human silhouette at 50 yards. That, of course, was slow fire, aimed shooting, nothing defensive about it except to note that if you missed your intended target, people as far away as at least 50 yards could be harmed by your shot (no doubt much farther).
Yeah you might be the first
JCooperfan1911
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Could it penetrate to the vitals?
You spoke of a lack of fun.
JCooperfan1911
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Getting shot is not fun. I can tell you that for sure.
Armybrat
Member
I couldn’t fathom trying to shoot the NAA .22 short Mini. My .22lr Mini was to small for me to manipulate the action, so gifted it to one of my sons as a “novelty” accessory.
However, I do like the NAA .22 magnum Minis as a very deep concealment backup. They make a lot of noise.
However, I do like the NAA .22 magnum Minis as a very deep concealment backup. They make a lot of noise.
Targa
Member
As much as I have wanted to pick up a .22 short NAA just as a novelty gun for my collection, I would still like to be able to shoot it. Like you, I would be really concerned that I physically couldn’t shoot a gun that small.
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