seeking 10mm 200 gr 1300 fps

tominboise said:

I use the same bullet and after testing a variety of powders, found that Blue Dot was the most accurate in my G20. I did not do any chrono testing of this load. I'd look at AA#9 as a likely candidate.

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AA#9 can't do it from my trials. I was surprised how slow AA#9 pushed compared to Blue Dot or Longshot. I was barely able to get 1,325 fps with a 180gr bullet with AA#9. AA#9 I believe to be a touch too slow burning for 10mm.

Longshot and Blue DOT are the only powders that did it for me. 6" bbl. Glock 40 MOS- Alpha Wolf barrel.
Bluedot was a touch faster, and bulged the cases and flattened the primers more..... so Longshot was the winner for me. IMO Longshot gets high performance with lesser pressures. I've heard this from multiple sources, and my personal experiences corroborate what I've heard.
Work up safely, as all guns respond to this touchy top-end performance bell curve differently!!!!!
Don't go over published maximums!!

All my 10mm experience dates back to 1991-92. I was using a S&W 1006, Hornady 180 and 200gr XTP.
With Acc#7 I could get 1,300+, and 200gr 1,200fps. Case capacity and OAL length along with a 5”bbl were the limiting factors.
Ironically, it was the Gen2 Glock G20’s that almost killed the 10mm. I had one for a short while. With my load of 200gr XTP and THEN, book max of Acc #7 (later revised down 1.5gr) I had two blown case heads and a badly buldged third... fortunately no frame damage was incurred. I replaced the mag release and slide stop. The G20 found a new home...
Most factory 10mm is still toned down. I was issued a G22 by my agency. I kept it when I retired. With a BCA .40s&w barrel and LongShot powder, it meets/exceeds my .40/10mm needs. 1,300+ with a 155gr XTP.

I don’t think 1,300fps with a 200gr is doable with a 5” bbl.
Maybe a 7.5” Ruger Black Hawk...

I've been up to my neck in the 10mm for the last few months and haven't seen anything which leads me to believe you can get 1300/200 within SAAMI limits.

If SAAMI limits are being taken as mere suggestions, of course, the sky is the limit - and that may be where significant parts of the gun end up.

If I was going to try it I would look at AA #9 and Longshot. I'm not going to try it, though. I think it is a foolish task. If I wanted that kind of horsepower I'd buy a gun that was made for it.

sparkyv said:

I just remembered that I recently acquired some Alliant BE-86, but not yet tried it. I've read that it can push 10mm loads pretty fast...perhaps something the OP may consider.

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I have used BE-86 in two 10mm loads. Both 180gr. Hornady XTP, and RMR FMJ-FN. I loaded to Alliant's max with both. The FMJ is running about 1216fps (as I recall) from the stock 4.6" Glock barrel. The XTP is at around 1240fps from a KKM 5" barrel. I didn't test both loads from the same barrel because that would make far too much sense. But they're not exactly top end of the velocity range for the cartridge.

Comparing max loads (as per Alliant) in .357 Sig, I've found Power Pistol has a slight velocity edge over BE-86. I think the same would be true in 10mm, perhaps even more so. Very similar powders, but BE-86 seems to give me slightly tighter ES and SD, and slightly lower average velocity.

I have pushed some fast rounds in 10mm. The highest I ever got was 180gr at 1,419 FPS using AA#9 (and a lot of it at that). The catch there is that I used a 7 inch barrel to get that number. I would be surprised if you can get a 200gr bullet to 1,300 FPS from a 5 inch barrel, but never say never I suppose.

Double post

Why are we chasing this velocity number in a game again. Revise your intention to a realistic 1200 and don't hurt yourself or blow up a gun. Saftey first accuracy always.

I have a friend that has pushed some frightening stuff out of his 10. He likes Herco, aa9 and… it seems to me(though I may be very mistaken) win 231. He’s casting a custom diameter 215 gr bullet for it… But, last time we were shooting, he knocked the entire steel target, stand and backstop thingy over. The gaggle of 9s, the odd 357 mag, and the 45s sure hadn’t done that. I was seated back behind the line and to his right on a four wheeler approximately 15 yards away(conservative estimate); I moved because I was getting hit with hot brass…

sparkyv said:

I just remembered that I recently acquired some Alliant BE-86, but not yet tried it. I've read that it can push 10mm loads pretty fast...perhaps something the OP may consider.

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BE-86 is next for me. Underwood claims 1250 with BE-86 and a 200 gr XTP. Here’s the pull down I go from the 10MM forum.

If memory serves, I don’t think I could get enough 800X in a case with a 200 gr bullet….

AJC1 said:

Why are we chasing this velocity number in a game again. Revise your intention to a realistic 1200 and don't hurt yourself or blow up a gun. Saftey first accuracy always.

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For me, I want to be able to build a load close to what I could buy from Underwood, but at a lower price. Also, trying different powder bullet combination to achieve better accuracy. Low 1200’s with a 200 gr bullet shouldn’t be out of reach if done safely.

AJC1 said:

Why are we chasing this velocity number in a game again. Revise your intention to a realistic 1200 and don't hurt yourself or blow up a gun. Saftey first accuracy always.

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Personally, I always wanted the original Normal loads, but not more than that.

Lennyjoe said:

For me, I want to be able to build a load close to what I could buy from Underwood, but at a lower price. Also, trying different powder bullet combination to achieve better accuracy. Low 1200’s with a 200 gr bullet shouldn’t be out of reach if done safely.

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Absolutely agree that's why I said reset expectations from 1300 to 1200.

The Glockodile said:

Go full Norma or go home!!!

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On the plus side, it seems that AA#9 is probably the best and safest 10mm powders for beginners as an overcharge is not possible.

Palladan44 said:

AA#9 can't do it from my trials. I was surprised how slow AA#9 pushed compared to Blue Dot or Longshot. I was barely able to get 1,325 fps with a 180gr bullet with AA#9. AA#9 I believe to be a touch too slow burning for 10mm.

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The Glockodile said:

View attachment 1097005

Go full Norma or go home!!!

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The 165gr bullet is a screamer!

thomis said:

I’m very intrigued on the H110 and 2400 conversations because I have been loading those for 44 magnum for over 20 years. But I find no published data using these powder and 10mm caliber combinations.

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Speer 13th edition has data for 2400 in 10 mm with 180 grain and 200 grain bullets (but not 155 gr). It's near the top of both tables, but lags Blue Dot by 80 FPS with the 180 and AA#9 by 60 FPS with the 200.

I don't think I've ever seen H110 data for 10 mm, but I don't claim to be an encyclopedia of knowledge. I can say that in my memory, people pushing the bleeding edge always seem to be using 800X, Blue Dot or Longshot in 10 mm.

CAUTION: The following post includes loading data beyond currently published maximums for this cartridge. USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. Neither the writer, The High Road, nor the staff of THR assume any liability for any damage or injury resulting from use of this information.

I’ve safely exceed 800X and 180 gr XTP’s well over published data using a KKM barrel in my G20 but as memory serves, couldn’t get enough under a 200 gr bullet to see flattened primers or pressure signs (to maintain forum rules, I won’t publish my final powder charge).

I still use the 180 gr 800X load in my G20, Springfield Elite 3.8”, S&W 2.0 with the 4.6” barrel and a Hi Point 10MM carbine. A bit snappy in the smaller 3.8” Elite but groups great in all guns with slightly flattened primers in the Hi-Point only.

Yes it is, and it can verifiably be achieved with Longshot.

The Glockodile said:

The 165gr bullet is a screamer!

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Lennyjoe said:

CAUTION: The following post includes loading data beyond currently published maximums for this cartridge. USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. Neither the writer, The High Road, nor the staff of THR assume any liability for any damage or injury resulting from use of this information.

I’ve safely exceed 800X and 180 gr XTP’s well over published data using a KKM barrel in my G20 but as memory serves, couldn’t get enough under a 200 gr bullet to see flattened primers or pressure signs (to maintain forum rules, I won’t publish my final powder charge).

I still use the 180 gr 800X load in my G20, Springfield Elite 3.8”, S&W 2.0 with the 4.6” barrel and a Hi Point 10MM carbine. A bit snappy in the smaller 3.8” Elite but groups great in all guns with slightly flattened primers in the Hi-Point only.

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With 800x and 10mm your limit it case capacity not pressure. Look at all the data Hodgdon published for 800X and 10mm and the resulting pressures for their max loads are between 30-32.5 ksi and SAAMI MAP for 10mm is 37.5 ksi. To maximize velocity with 800x you are almost certainly going to a slightly compressed load and the risks inherited with it.

When I was a kid, I loaded 357 magnum near 41 mag power levels, now that I have made it this far, I would down load a 44 mag, if I wanted the same power.

If I were looking for 1300fps with 200 grain bullets out of a 10mm, it would be a carbine.

• Your chances to reach 1300fps improve greatly if you'll switch over to lighter bullets in the 165gr range. Accurate No.9 is a powder that can get you there safely.

• Chasing a self-imposed high velocity goal for the sole sake of having 'high velocity' is one of the quickest paths to a reloading accident that I can think of. This because the danger, as always, is chamber pressure, but velocity does not seem to track chamber pressure above Max Load.
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rfwobbly said:

• Your chances to reach 1300fps improve greatly if you'll switch over to lighter bullets in the 165gr range. Accurate No.9 is a powder that can get you there safely.

• Chasing a self-imposed high velocity goal for the sole sake of having 'high velocity' is one of the quickest paths to a reloading accident that I can think of. This because the danger, as always, is chamber pressure, but velocity does not seem to track chamber pressure above Max Load.
.

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Yes sometimes the max load is because going over max load the peak pressure vs charge weight is no longer roughly linear and well behaved, but becomes extremely non-linear were small changes in charge weigh results in very larger changes in peak pressure compared to similar changes within the recommended charge weights.