Been considering getting into a progressive press

Targa said:

Well this thread just cost me money! I just ordered the six pack 9mm kit.

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Is this where I should show you the awesome caliber quickchange TylerR created for the Lee APP, that just happens to also work on the 6000? You do have a 3d printer, right? Ooh that's evil..... Walkalong erase this one.

I ordered it from Grafs. https://www.grafs.com/catalog/product/productId/96021

Stefan I'm in the same boat, and for the same reason, although you're ahead of the game with your turret-I'm doing one at a time on Lee's challenger single stage. I too have been eyeballing the 6000 largely thanks to THR members posting their experiences so this has been a very interesting thread for me.
In my case, I'm willing to pay more if the end result is a "better" completed round. People have touted the benefits of one press over another but until someone can prove Brand A's finished product is better than Brand B the deciding factor for me boils down to price.

speedingpickle said:

People have touted the benefits of one press over another but until someone can prove Brand A's finished product is better than Brand B the deciding factor for me boils down to price.

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I think the finished product lies upon the user....Any press is capable of producing a fine finished product, it's the ease of getting there that makes the difference.....IMO....
So, yes, price is a factor...How much do you wanna fumble around to get the end result, or just basically plug-n-play.............
Once again, because this is such a personal preference, the thing that is right for me- may suck for you................

Stefan A said:

I was thinking the exact same thing. Of course, what Sooner says is true too. The thing is, I am learning that none of these machines are problem free. I believe that whichever one I get, there will be issues to deal with. I’ve seen the word finicky applied to Dillons as well as Lees. So, I’m just not convinced that spending 4x more is worth it.

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I had a long talk with a software engineer at VMWare Explore last year. She worked for one of the biggest-of-the-big backup and recovery companies. In her own words, “...If I was really worried about a ransomware cyberattack, I wouldn’t trust anybody’s software - including my own - to prevent or recover my data. It’s all tooo user-driven.” Nothing is fool-proof. The key is not to be the first fool to discover a flaw.

Stefan A said:

I was thinking the exact same thing. Of course, what Sooner says is true too. The thing is, I am learning that none of these machines are problem free. I believe that whichever one I get, there will be issues to deal with. I’ve seen the word finicky applied to Dillons as well as Lees. So, I’m just not convinced that spending 4x more is worth it.

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There are degrees of "finicky" as well as build quality and CS. I posted another thread with two videos so you can actually see the press there are many familar parts on it as used on other presses,
I want to clarify that I am not pro or con on this press, just realistic, as I mentioned other than a Hornady LnL I have all LEE stuff, presses, dies powders measures etc etc. I also had a RCBS progressive years ago, So I am familiar with them and not just some poster that doesn't even have a progressive press

I also did not intend to be disparaging to LL, He did an outstanding job on reviewing the press (said so in another post but it may have come out wrong) by "vested" referred to him agreeing to take all the time and effort to write all the review for LEE.

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/lee-six-pack-press-thread-with-videos.915027/

I considered em all, but my brother who had been loading a lot longer than me, had the Hornady, LNL, AND LOVED IT. He used it for a couple years, and kinda talked me into it, My big concern after using a couple of Lee
Pro 1000s was I wanted one that could do both rifle and pistol cartridges. My brother assured me it would do both really well. After looking at the Lee which uses the bushings for each die, LNL like, and the different shell plates, 7 in all, price would have been slightly less for the Lee. And they now have an auto drop powder thingee that looks a lot like the hornady, I really like that option.
Price wise I think the Lee is least expensive, and Dillon the most expensive. They all work, just what you want , and the company you like the best.

9mmepiphany said:

All reputable progressive presses are capable of producing the same quality finished rounds depending of the skill/quality of the operator.

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I think UR’s press comparisons show measurable differences in ammo produced on different presses due to press variances and brand / market segment placement is a factor there.

https://ultimatereloader.com/2022/05/27/the-progressive-press-shootout-12-presses-compared/

Certainly he did more so in the single stage comps

https://ultimatereloader.com/2019/04/08/fourteen-reloading-presses-compared-single-stage-shootout/

Just because something hasn’t been done doesn’t mean it can’t be done. Proving these differences costs time and money that can’t be returned.

It’s why people simply follow the Pro shooter’s or BR shooter’s brand preferences. They substitute outcomes for proof.

9mmepiphany said:

Perhaps "same" was a lazy way of saying "acceptable."

Perhaps the measurable differences were the result of the variances effecting operator efficiency.

Loading using the same technique with each machine, might not be optimizing that machine's efficiency

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Agreed.

9mmepiphany said:

That can't be proven because it isn't true. All reputable progressive presses are capable of producing the same quality finished rounds depending of the skill/quality of the operator.

If one wanted to produce the highest quality ammo with the least operator induced variables in quality, one could easily go with the new Mark 7 Genesys...it is a further evolution of the consumer grade Alpha and is easily superior to the Commercial grade Revolution (which is being replaced by the Titan). It replaces the Alpha's 10 station shell plate with a 12 station one and doesn't use a central ram to limit plate tilt. It even addresses the most common cause of operator error...short stroking

It is very aggressively priced, when you consider that it comes with a motor drive, case feeder, bullet feeder, and primer collator

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Sounds like a great way to suck all the fun out of a hobby.

Stefan A said:

What is this mod?

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It's found on the gigantic thread on CastBoolits.com on 3D bullet collators. TylerR was the creator of most of the goodies found therein. He as provided all the print files, a great manual, and a little software diddy, provided by another member, to help select the right parts for a particular project. You can download all that free by clicking "downloads" at the bottom of any of his posts. You can download a file at a time or the whole system at once using the green button. The quickchange mods are under the heading APP.

My love affair with his quick caliber change system began with the following post on CastBoolits.com. https://castboolits.gunloads.com/sh...let-Collator&p=5272214&viewfull=1#post5272214



The following picture shows the parts he created: In front is the main insert holder....drop tube holder imo is a better description. You drop the bolt that comes with the APP through it and bolt it to the APP's shuttle. Then inserts made for individual cases and bullets by caliber is all the other parts shown.

You just drop them into the insert holder......You can feed the inserts with either Lee's tubes or a bullet or case electric collator.....also part of TylerR's huge 3d printing project. I'm a believer and so I've helped him where I can.

Soonerpesek said:

I think the finished product lies upon the user....Any press is capable of producing a fine finished product, it's the ease of getting there that makes the difference.....IMO....
So, yes, price is a factor...How much do you wanna fumble around to get the end result, or just basically plug-n-play..

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9mmepiphany said:

That can't be proven because it isn't true. All reputable progressive presses are capable of producing the same quality finished rounds depending of the skill/quality of the operator.

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To me these comments make sense-the user determines the final outcome. So, for the careful, committed to process economically-minded loader there is no reason to pay hundreds (or in some cases thousands) more for one press over another. The caveat being, as Soonerpesek mentioned, how much fiddling one may be willing to do.

I'm a tinkerer by nature so any tweeking required on initial set up is fine by me, not so much if the press constantly needed attention. To avoid that I'd certainly pay more.

To be honest I'd LOVE one of those automated setups where all I have to do is fill hoppers and feeders then wander off for a couple beers while my machine automagically cranks out thousands of perfect rounds per hour. But with prices for everything being what they are, and with no commensurate increase in pay, that's just not happening.

Stefan A said:

I have die sets for my turret press. If I get the pro6000, can I use those dies WITH the breachlock adapters?

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Your dies will work with the breech lock bushings that come with the Pro 6000 kit.

Actually all domestic brand dies that use standard threads will work with the bushings. (Foreign brand dies that use Metric threads won't work)

Stefan A said:

So then the dies must be in a bushing and cannot be used without on this press?

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Yes.

Picture below shows breech lock bushing (Smart Lock Bushing with O-ring) on top that gets locked into the top press head with supplied die/bushing wrench. And any standard thread die (New inline bullet feed die shown below) will screw inside the bushing



Like this



To lock into the top press head (Stations #3, #4, #5 show Smart Lock Bushings installed with black O-ring on top)

Stefan A said:

Ok. Thanks. So then the dies must be in a bushing and cannot be used without on this press?

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I’ve asked a related question before about the B/L dies and the answer I got was, if I don’t want to buy lots of adapters and don’t mind screwing/unscrewing my dies, just use some Lok-tite to mount the BreechLoks in the press. Basically convert it to standard thread. You lose the advantages of the quick-in/quick-out system but you save the cost of the adapter for each die and it’s easier to make adjustments to the dies if they’re also going to be used in a non- BreechLok press.

Stefan A said:

Ok. Thanks. So then the dies must be in a bushing and cannot be used without on this press?

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Yes. The press comes with 6 bushings for the 6 positions. You can buy dies from Lee with the bushings, or buy the bushings separately to be used with Lee dies or other dies as well.

Edit - I guess I wasn't fast enough in my reply. Two people beat me too it in the time it took me to type ... sheesh....


-Jeff