Swager- need to adjust every time

Google LEE APP - your life just got simpler AND faster.

Sort brass by headstamp, as the crimp height is different for each brand of brass.

Buy the four tube conversion.

gifbohane said:

I posted this question on another thread and did not get an answer since it was not real relevant to the thread topic.

I currently trim the military pocket crimps on 223 with the cutaway method. I have a Wilson "lathe" and a carbide cutter that removes the military crimp one by one. Put it on, trim it, and take it off. It is very time consuming.

I toyed with buying s Dillon table swager but could not bring myself to drop the $ 124 to $ 150.

I see the RCBS on sale for $ 25 and am tempted to take a shot.

BUT I cannot understand how you can set it up for say 223 and have it work for 2 or 3 hundred cases when, even with the same headstamp, each case will vary in length. It seems that you have to reset the die for each case due to different case lengths.

What am I missing?

Click to expand...

I've been through all the major swaging dealios. Now I do all my swaging on a Mark 7, so it's a lot easier, but the next best thing (other than the new fangled auto reamer that mounts on some presses), and the best table top is the Dillon. Just spend the money on the dillon and be done with it. Lots of hacks to make it faster too. As far as setting it up, the cut away brass pieces are your best friend. Couple places sell the cutaway swage guages, they are cheap. Or you can make one. Basically they are reference guages where you can see where your swage hits. Use that to set it up. Yes, your mixed brass will have a tiny % that over or under swage...but the guage sets it as the standard...and you will get a much better overall product through multiple headstamps. https://www.ammobrass.com/product-page/ammobrass-swage-setter

You title it "Swager"...are you trying to remove mil crimp on primer pocket?
You seem to also reference case length which has nothing to do with pocket depth.

What are you trying to do? A clearer statement of your problem would help yourself.

A "little" info here:

Lee "APP" press | The High Road

I'm not familiar with the "semi-automated" hi tech methods. Old days we cut the crimp out with a pocket knife, then a Lyman primer pocket uniformer came along, and I've never needed anything else.

Anyway, it will always be a 1:1 slow process. Get a cup of coffee and enjoy the hobby.

PWC said:

Anyway, it will always be a 1:1 slow process. Get a cup of coffee and enjoy the hobby.

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Yep !!! I've been using a plain olf countersink (60 degree X 1/2" with 1/4" hex shaft) for roughly 30 years. Yes One case at a time and If that's too slow for me (not), I will stay away from military brass...

I use the swagger for the LNL-AP. I sort LC by year all others by mfg. Different lots do require some fine adjustments from time to time.

gifbohane said:

The RCBS swager places a die into the press which must be adjusted up of down to accommodate the case length of each case.

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No. The die bears against the case head, inside the case, and needs adjusted to the case head thickness of each headstamp batch. Within any batch of near-year LC brass, there isn't much variation.

You can't mix headstamps without a reset though.

The RCBS swager is slow and a bit awkward. If you don't sort your brass, it won't remove the swage completely from brass with a thicker head. When I use mine, I just go to town, and afterward hit it with a chamfer bit in my prep station. It works for me, but does add an extra step. Sometimes I skip the swage and just use the chamfer bit.

You could swage your brass and then when seating primers, if one doesn't want to start, just set that piece aside and keep going. Once you finish priming, take all the brass you set aside and chamfer the pocket or adjust the swager.

Or you could just buy new brass and not have to deal with it.

chris

I have tried the ones that look like dies, they don't work very well. I bought the rcbs that is a copy of the Dillon it works grate did an entire 5 gal bucket of 223 brass in one day.

I have the RCBS. It's just about setting for X amount of cam-over.
if your brass is sorted, it goes a helluva lot faster.
I keep the stem on mine loose, so it can readily be adjusted up or down, if I feel a case didn't get enough.
It goes pretty quick

gifbohane said:

It seems that you have to reset the die for each case due to different case lengths.

Click to expand...

You would destroy the case mouth and even shoulder if you tried to use them for support while swaging. Even the methods that use the rim tweek it and they don’t even swage very well.

All of the decent swage methods use an internal support that runs through the case mouth, down to the head, on the other side of the pocket.

That’s the support sticking out the center of the die. The concave end is to keep from smashing a flash hole burr back down.



Case length has zero effect.

gifbohane said:

I posted this question on another thread and did not get an answer since it was not real relevant to the thread topic.

I currently trim the military pocket crimps on 223 with the cutaway method. I have a Wilson "lathe" and a carbide cutter that removes the military crimp one by one. Put it on, trim it, and take it off. It is very time consuming.

I toyed with buying s Dillon table swager but could not bring myself to drop the $ 124 to $ 150.

I see the RCBS on sale for $ 25 and am tempted to take a shot.

BUT I cannot understand how you can set it up for say 223 and have it work for 2 or 3 hundred cases when, even with the same headstamp, each case will vary in length. It seems that you have to reset the die for each case due to different case lengths.

What am I missing?

Click to expand...

I have no idea if this meets your requirements but also frankly am not really sure what they are. Anyway, for less than $100 this Frankford works for me and is quite ergonomic.

^ and that one would benefit from a concave end unless one deburrs flash holes too.

jmorris said:

^ and that one would benefit from a concave end unless one deburrs flash holes too.

Click to expand...

Agreed, which I do. Of course you and many others here could easily machine a dimple into it

As @GeoDudeFlorida has said essentially many times, I get up close & personal with each case and know most by their first name.

gifbohane said:

I currently trim the military pocket crimps on 223 with the cutaway method ... I toyed with buying s Dillon table swager but could not bring myself to drop the $ 124 to $ 150.

RCBS ... how you can set it up for say 223 ... case will vary in length.

What am I missing?

Click to expand...

You are missing the $49 C-H primer pocket swage kit - https://www.ch4d.com/products/equipment/priming-tools/psk

I like crimped .223 and .308 LC headstamp brass as crimped primer pockets ensure they are once-fired but this means I also need to remove the crimp. I used to cut the crimp out with countersink but when I bought a large box of crimped .223 brass from member @ljnowell, I decided to get a primer pocket swager - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...ge-brass-lesson-learned.840554/#post-10908721



As a Dillon fan, like you, I was initially thinking about getting the Super Swager and doing the rubber band hack.

But then as a growing C-H fan, I found they have a primer pocket swage and video below convinced me to buy it (Jump to 4:05 minute to see it in action) - https://www.ch4d.com/products/equipment/case-tools/psk

When I ordered on the phone, I asked if there was any consideration for their swage and they said if I used Lee shell holder for .223/5.56 to order C-H shell holder for tighter fit to prevent pulling the rim edge off.

If you do not have a separate press and don't want to tie up a press for swaging, I would consider Frankford Arsenal primer pocket swage ($98) - https://www.amazon.com/Frankford-Arsenal-Adjustable-Positioning-Auto-Eject/dp/B0779B5Q6D

https://www.dillonprecision.com/s000277
This works great

Big Wes said:

https://www.dillonprecision.com/s000277
This works great

Click to expand...

OP already considered the Super Swager but ruled it out due to cost
That's why I suggsted $98 FA standalone swager and $49 C-H press mounted swager.

LiveLife said:

When I ordered on the phone, I asked if there was any consideration for their swage and they said if I used Lee shell holder for .223/5.56 to order C-H shell holder for tighter fit to prevent pulling the rim edge off.

Click to expand...

I guess that's why I had so many problems with my C-H... I was mangling the rims, not only on 5.56mm, but 7.62mm as well.

After looking at several alternatives and obliterated a huge number of case, nothing beats this system for swaging cases. As long as you can run them via the Lee App it is a no brainer. Drawings and part list is also included in the same clip.

The Dillon unit is worth the price.

Not only is it 10X faster, it requires 1/10th the effort of the RCBS press and die type.

gifbohane said:

I posted this question on another thread and did not get an answer since it was not real relevant to the thread topic.

I currently trim the military pocket crimps on 223 with the cutaway method. I have a Wilson "lathe" and a carbide cutter that removes the military crimp one by one. Put it on, trim it, and take it off. It is very time consuming.

I toyed with buying s Dillon table swager but could not bring myself to drop the $ 124 to $ 150.

I see the RCBS on sale for $ 25 and am tempted to take a shot.

BUT I cannot understand how you can set it up for say 223 and have it work for 2 or 3 hundred cases when, even with the same headstamp, each case will vary in length. It seems that you have to reset the die for each case due to different case lengths.

What am I missing?

Click to expand...

I also use my Wilson trimmer with the primer pocket reamer. I like the job that it does but its slow and can be hard on the fingers. Since I've retired my fingers are not as tuff as they once were and I use a thin glove.

I have the RCBS die type tool and it works ok. It takes a lot of up force on the press and will shake your bench unless its very heavy or anchored down.

I also had the Dillon tool and my be the only guy alive that didn't like it.