Stupid range rules...

jcwit said:

Yes, but when one brings up freedom there are no restrictions, at least none that were brought up.

You seem to be thinking "common sense" would prevail, I've yet to see that happen often in my 69 years.

Furthermore the griping/complaining here about the range rules does nothing to correct the OP's problem, as I've already stated.

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Virtually nothing posted on an internet message forum does anything to correct any problems.

I don't see how a zombie target or 9 rounds in a magazine makes people safer, or prevents people from putting their kids downrange to signal to the shooters.

An LEO acquaintance said he was called on the carpet by his Lt. Commander about doing the mouth/eyes thing on a silhouette.

Lucy! You have some 'splainin' to do!

He carries Springfield Armory 9mm, .40, and .45.

I have a new XDs he would like to get his hands on.

The retirement village I live in has private pistol, rifle, and skeet ranges. You have to pay dues, then pick-up keys at the local golf club house, and 1.5 hr. max. checkout time, with a charge of 4 bucks for key rental.

Virtually nothing posted on an internet message forum does anything to correct any problems.

I don't see how a zombie target or 9 rounds in a magazine makes people safer, or prevents people from putting their kids downrange to signal to the shooters.
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Sorry you can't see it, but its called "rules" whether they make sense to everyone or not. You may have your opinion as to what's right and wrong, and the others may have there's. Don't like it? Work at getting it changed, or move on to the freedom range and their lack of rules or may hap their stricter rules.

jcwit said:

Sorry you can't see it, but its called "rules" whether they make sense to everyone or not. You may have your opinion as to what's right and wrong, and the others may have there's. Don't like it? Work at getting it changed, or move on to the freedom range and their lack of rules or may hap their stricter rules.

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I completely understand that. You seem to have a different opinion. You seemed to have the opinion that perhaps 8 rounds per mag and no zombie targets were "right", or made sense.

I was hoping you could shed some light onto the opposing viewpoint/opinion so that I could better understand it.

It appears I was mistaken.

I could care less what type of target is shot at other than glass, because few people seem to like to clean it up, or in the case of the range where I shoot steel targets because of ricochets. Paper targets with whatever they have printed on them are OK with me, but other ranges may/and do obviously feel differently.

As far as an 8 round mag, have at it, again I could care less, but then I have never been to the range where they are banned and know not their reasons, whatever they may be. They may have good reasons, then again they may not, I have no idea. I can see none but I have not been there and know not their problems or circumstances.

It appears I was mistaken.

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Sorta hard to make an intelligent judgment without knowing what the ranges problems/circumstances are

I completely understand that. You seem to have a different opinion. You seemed to have the opinion that perhaps 8 rounds per mag and no zombie targets were "right", or made sense.

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Very possible they are "right", or make sense at their range, I've never been there, have you?

jcwit said:

Very possible they are "right", or make sense at their range, I've never been there, have you?

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Can you think of something that would make them "right" or make it make sense?

I'm trying to, and I can't. Can you?

OP, can you find out/tell us what their reasoning is?

Can you think of something that would make them "right" or make it make sense?

I'm trying to, and I can't. Can you?

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From my post #55

Sorta hard to make an intelligent judgment without knowing what the ranges problems/circumstances are
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Hollowpoints only on the rifle range.....................

Similar rules at our range:

Instead of eight round magazine limit: SIX. (Supposedly due to rare-but-it's-happened semi autos going full auto and the resulting muzzle climb)

Rifles may only be shot from a seated position. (Due to clowns with AR's/AK's/SKS's playing Call of Duty and dumping their magazines down range and having little or no control or care over where they actually go.)

No human targets.

Paper targets only.

The first two rules above are actually (somewhat) understandable because our 80 year old range has had houses grow up all around it. If a round leaves the range the club will be instantly shut down and never open again.

Paper targets only because the RO's don't want to clean up the mess left by a**hats who want to shoot all kinds of garbage and then leave their mess behind.

The no human targets rule is just PC bull crap.

One good rule should be mentioned: There is no rapid fire rule per se. The rule is that each shooter MUST keep their rounds on target. If a shooter must rest a minute between shots to accomplish that, fine, but if he can put 6 rounds into the target in a second or less - that's fine, too.

alienbogey said:

Rifles may only be shot from a seated position. (Due to clowns with AR's/AK's/SKS's playing Call of Duty and dumping their magazines down range and having little or no control or care over where they actually go.)

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...but prone is even more accurate/has even more control than seated

Our's isn't too bad, being owned by LDWF. The only one that really p-ed me off was no FMJ when the range first reopened. Once word go out and with a little griping (a call or two may have been placed to our local state Reps) the rule was removed.

Printed "no" rules are:
1) no .50 BMG -waste anyway at 100yds
2) no tracer - fire hazard, lots of woods and now dry grass
3) no full auto - I don't like it but I understand why: wanting to keep rounds off the traget frames and into the berm and not worrying about if the NFA weapon is legit
4) no rapid fire - I don't agree with but again I understand why. Honestly they have been very good about it and not griping about double taps, etc as long as they are on paper, don't hit the frame and are into the berm. If you bump off a dozen or so they will ask you to stop though.
5) no frames under 25yds on the 100yds range, even if shooting pistols - this is from them getting burned by bullets skipping over the berm and causing them to have to rebuild. Good thing is they added a 50yd pistol range and added extra benchs, racks, etc.

...but prone is even more accurate/has even more control than seated

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Ours isn't so much the video game clowns but when they tried shooting prone after the range first reopened, it put the rounds at an upward angle and close to the top of the berm. This is despite the shooting platform being 4-5ft higher than the target area.

After having just been rebuilt due to rounds topping the berm, I can see the reason for this unwriten rule at our range. Now standing and sitting are ok. Kneeling depends, its probably ok if there are low enough stands available.

Sounds like you go to TSC on Canyon, Leadcounsel. Yes?

And we wonder why the youngun's go all nintendo/paintball/airsoft. ug

I don't know if I would call it a dumb rule, but the range that I go to has three separate sections. One for pistol only, one for rifle only, and one for 22 only. I can understand the 22 only so that a 22 shooter doesn't have a 44 mag or 300 win blasting away next to him. But the separate rifle and pistol sections are a nuisance since I usually shoot both. And it's not the distance because they are both only 100 yard ranges... Go figure.

Oh, actually, they do have a seemingly dumb rule. Only one paper target on the stand, which is large enough to hold 6 standard 10.5 x 12 pistol targets. But it's really not that dumb by their reasoning; It keeps the hits more centered so the frames don't get shot up as much.

Leadcounsel, come on over to Camp Salerno, Afghanistan. The 3/101 "Rakkasans" need your expert legal advise and I guarantee the target rich environment! Plus the range is unlimited and the targets shoot back!! I been deployed for 7 years now.

Once, a rangekeeper bonked his head while going for my empty beer can before it hit the ground (it was a windy day). true story

dprice3844444 said:

the no human form thing is a politically correct racial issue.my brass is my brass.have them arrested for petty theft.police training mostly uses blue Silhouette targets because somebody complained that it was training them to shoot blacks.so now everything is gender neutral

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Eh I think it also is to prevent people from using a pic of someone they're pissed at, be it political or spousal.

jcwit said:

Their range, their rules, don't like it? Attend the membership meetings, try to get elected into a position, or move on.

What has been done here has done nothing or changed anything.

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This ^^^. You go to someone's house, you follow their rules. Pretty simple. You don't like the rules, you don't go there. Whether they make sense to you or not has nuttin' to do with it. As jcwit said in later posts, without knowing the patrons, the range or previous problems the range has encountered, it's hard to support or criticize their rules. Open your own range and I'm sure someone will whine about your rules too.

What did OP's post accomplish? Well, probably helped blow off some steam. Hey, we all need to rant every now and then, whether it accomplishes anything or not.
Here are some random thoughts:

Explaining rules increases compliance, imho. If a range is going to heavily restrict what people can or can't do, then they should explain why.
Certain things are understandable - "no headshots" rules make a certain amount of sense if the targets are suspended and the hanging system might be harmed by shots that go too high.
Here's an idea about the whole "human face" situation - I took a tactical class in which the instructor had custom made targets with a simple black rectangular black box around what he called the "ICOC" - intra cranial ocular cavity. The premise is that this is the part of the head where quickly stopping the assailant is most likely.
Here are my questions:

Are "bowling pin" shaped targets (vaguely humanoid) prohibited, too, or are they different enough to pass muster?

At ranges that disallow brass pick-up, how do the ROs handle cleanup? Do range staff pick up the shells, or do shooters that are merely being courteous about cleaning up after themselves risk being accused of theft?

Their range, their rules, don't like it? Attend the membership meetings, try to get elected into a position, or move on.

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This about sums it up, IMHO.

You better believe if I started a range, I'd make the rules. You don't have to like them, you don't think they have to make sense, but you do have to obey them. Or you can mosey along. Your choice.

Local club shooting ranges are outdoors.

When training classes for handgun carry permit (certification of eligibility to apply) shoot for qualification at the local range, police style human outline targets are required.

Some standard rules:

No full auto or simulated full auto.

No NFA firearms.

On the lower range, rounds cannot impact the ground before the 25 yard line, paper targets only: no clay pigeon targets on the lower range.

No .50 cal BMG on the lower range (there are buried pneumatic lines to the metallic shillouette targets).

No shotguns on the lower range (except during the club sponsored turkey shoots and then the wad littering the lawn is unsightly for a while; I think they clean it up).

Upper range has fewer rules, but you bring your own target stands and pick up after yourself. Guess where I usually shoot?

Range rules

At the PA Game Commission range where I shoot, there is a six round limit for pistol shooters. There is a five round limit for rifles. No shotshells allowed. Slugs are OK. Paper targets only. Clean up your paper. Clean up your brass.
Personally, I have no problem with the rules. I have no need to load more than five rounds into any rifle that I shoot or six into any pistol or revolver.
Rapid fire - there is no posted restriction about time - for me means five rounds in ten seconds. Other people shoot faster...hit less, at least where I am. You fellas may be better shots.
The problem that I have is not so much with the range rules but with people who don't read them.
Pete

Some rampage shooters have gone to ranges to practice. The club might not want to have to deal with that PR when some nut is found to have been shooting up realistic targets to practice his massacre.

There are realistic training targets. Shooting Osama and Zombies might be an indication of immaturity. But the realistic targets should be allowed. So get on the board and argue for realistic training targets and not the kiddie ones.