Bolt your safe down! Here is why...

and with this being MA, im sure it wont take long for the AG to drum up some charges to slap the homeowner with as punishment for allowing his firearms to be stolen.

500lbs fully loaded, so probably 300-350lbs empty which would indicate a light-duty container....probably something like a Stack-On 14 gun container filled with guns and a few accessories or ammo. It's doubtful that a couple of bolts would really stop a pair of determined burglars like this from wrenching on the safe enough that the bolts tear through the thin sheet metal floor of the container. These things simply aren't built that tough.

300-350lbs dry for the volume of a gun safe is peanuts. I'm currently looking for a 1-1.6 cubic foot safe that's no larger than 20-22" a side. The products I'm looking at are in the 500-800lb range.

I concur with #4. The bolts were probably a minor inconvenience.

I agree and I do normally, but right now I'm renting, I can't damage the wall where my lock-box is.

If a pro wants what you have, you won't stop them. The best thing you can do is make them have to work so hard that they'll look for easier targets.

A stack-on 8 gun is very light, I can't imagine a 14 gun to be much more than 100 pounds.

As for renting, what will cost the most? A. Some drywall mud and paint. B. Security deposit. C. Replacing all your firearms

Seems obvious to me.

Stack-On cabinet weight.

The 14 gun cabinet only weighs 85 pounds.

Aarond

Most gun thefts are committed by friends, friends of friends of the gun owner. And a safe that isn't somehow secured to the structure of the house merely becomes a really big gun case.

My safe is bolted to the house and built into floor to ceiling, wall to wall shelves. Still, anybody with a circular saw, masonry blades and time could make off with every gun I own.

I even read about some guys who wrapped a chain around somebody's safe and pulled it out of the house with their truck. Completely ripped out the door frame and everything.

My 24-gun TS Winchester weighed a tad over 500 lbs unloaded. Loaded I expect it is closer to 600 lbs now. My brother and 6'+ adult sized nephew and I moved it with a rented Uhaul appliance handtruck and it was back-breaking work for 3 adults with a proper handtruck and only 1 set of semi-significant steps. Also took maybe 30 minutes taking it around to the back of the house.

I've not yet bolted it down. But really, it would take 2 STRONG guys a lot of time to haul it away and as I've noted elsewhere--I have a loud dog and retired neighbors. I might get around to bolting it down someday, but I just can't seem to find the time.

Lead

Start storing your ammo stockpiles in there

My 24-gun TS Winchester weighed a tad over 500 lbs unloaded. Loaded I expect it is closer to 600 lbs now. My brother and 6'+ adult sized nephew and I moved it with a rented Uhaul appliance handtruck and it was back-breaking work for 3 adults with a proper handtruck and only 1 set of semi-significant steps. Also took maybe 30 minutes taking it around to the back of the house.

I've not yet bolted it down. But really, it would take 2 STRONG guys a lot of time to haul it away and as I've noted elsewhere--I have a loud dog and retired neighbors. I might get around to bolting it down someday, but I just can't seem to find the time.

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Theives don't care about scratches, dings, battered walls, etc. That safe can go OUT a whole lot quicker than it went IN.

As someone that lives in MA and owns guns this article made me nauseated. My biggest fear is not that I ever have to use my guns in self defense it is that I haven't secured our weapons into our house well enough. We have safes, the guns aren't all in one place. We have good locks, we use them. We have dogs that like to bite. I sincerely hope that this man doesn't get charged.

My gun safe is there to prevent quick-access from an intruder, not to prevent theft. I am under no illusions that my weapons are ever safe from theft; I can only do a decent job.

A knowledgeable and sufficiently equipped team of BGs with lots of time can get into any safe, car, house, bank, etc.

And on a side note, if someone breaks into my house and steals my guns, I bear no responsibility for what he does with them. Zero, nada, zip.

I'm with Skribs on this. For me, a gun safe is to prevent me from walking in on someone pointing my own gun at me or my family. Secondary is to prevent theft. But that's just another layer in the blanket.

And on a side note, if someone breaks into my house and steals my guns, I bear no responsibility for what he does with them. Zero, nada, zip.

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I agree with this. If the BGs could ONLY get guns by stealing them I might feel a bit worried about putting them in the hands of BGs, but with how easy it is to buy one (black market, FTF transfer, or simply buy in stores if you have no criminal history) I'm not too worried about my personal stake in their crime.

My guns are insured.

Skribs is right. You can make things more secure than they otherwise would be, but you can't make them perfectly secure. The purpose of safes, locks, and alarm systems aren't to prevent a robbery but to make it more difficult. Hopefully the robber moves on to an easier target.

My gun "safe" is a Remington branded safe made by Liberty. Not a true safe according to the pros here. It is bolted to a cement slab. The poured foundation runs along the back and one side and the basement storage shelves are built around the other side and top. It's by no means a perfect set up, but it would take long enough to get into that a burglar would hopefully give up and move on.

You lucky people with your cement slabs. I'm on a third-floor condo, and part of my safe selection criteria was something me and my friend (who are not that strong) could take up the stairs.

This makes me sick to my stomach. Like a lot of people here, I take pride in my collection. I'd rather someone steal my car. (But then, I'm not a "car" guy)

Any idea of how common this is? Are there stats for this particular kind of crime, or do they chock it up to burglary?

My safe has an empty weight of 608 pounds and probably 1000-1100 pounds loaded. That is enough to deter most criminals. I still plan on bolting it to the floor regardless of the weight.

I know someone who had the flimsy sheet metal gun safe to keep his little kids out.

The whole safe was stolen. Later that week the 44 mag revolver showed up at the nearest pawn shop dropped off by his next door neighbor's teen ager.

All the guns but one were recovered.

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I know a guy who sold a house to another guy I know. The first guy's heavy safe was taken out of the basement when I arrived to help put the second guy's one in.

We could barely pry one end of the safe up off the ground. How were we going to get it down the stairs?

Then I had an idea, "We could put the 4WD truck and camper in the front yard, tie a rope to it, and slowly drive forward, lowering the safe down the stairs."

My next big idea will be that we should leave big safes in basements and have locksmiths change the combinations.

there are a number of professional locksmiths that specialize in vaults and safes on this board

they move
REAL SAFES (as in 4-6 inches of SOLID [or composite] steel)
with a small crew, and one has stated that any safe not bolted down can be removed in a few minutes by those who know what they are doing.

On the other hand, he also posted pictures where a person was ripped off by the buglers using a chainsaw to cut holes, run chain, connect it to a tractor and pull the safe out of the house, through the wall.....

Skribs said:

You lucky people with your cement slabs. I'm on a third-floor condo, and part of my safe selection criteria was something me and my friend (who are not that strong) could take up the stairs.

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You can conceal it a bit in a closet. and use hollow-wall anchors to secure it to the floor. Also lag bolt it to the wall studs. Then put several hundred pounds of lead in the bottom of it.

I have a total of five RSCs at home. The two most obvious ones are bolted to the slab, the wall, and each other. One is tax records and heirlooms, the other is ammo. My biggest one is concealed, and I recently added a Barska Biometric Rifle "safe" in the master bedroom closet, well hidden. The fifth one is in my workshop, mostly for my metal-cutting tools.

My backyard is equipped with loud dogs, the house and detached workshop have alarms with radio backups, and the Sheriff's response time is under seven minutes. All I have to do is slow the burglars down enough - but I also carry insurance.

Shadow 7D said:

there are a number of professional locksmiths that specialize in vaults and safes on this board

they move
REAL SAFES (as in 4-6 inches of SOLID [or composite] steel)
with a small crew, and one has stated that any safe not bolted down can be removed in a few minutes by those who know what they are doing.

On the other hand, he also posted pictures where a person was ripped off by the buglers using a chainsaw to cut holes, run chain, connect it to a tractor and pull the safe out of the house, through the wall.....

Click to expand...

I used to move and remodel jewelry stores (but not the safes!) when I was around twenty.. a long time ago. At one store, the owner said we could have the safe.. about a cubic yard in size. It wasn't bolted down. It stayed there because my friend and I, the owners of the remodeling company, hadn't a real clue how to move it though we tried a bit. We were too rushed to even sell it as it sat.