.243 Against 1/4 Steel Plate

High velocity KILLS steel...there's a reason tactical matches often have a restriction of <3000fps.

I had a family "friend" blast one of my AR500 3/8" steel at <50yd with an M4gery and XM193. It left very small, shallow craters in the steel but otherwise didn't phase it.

That plate now only gets shot at 300yd or further distance, just to be safe.

allaroundhunter said:

....look one post above yours...

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55 grain .243 has a very low sectional density. What kills steel plates is sectional density and velocity.

Good try, though.

.55 grain .243 has a very low sectional density. What kills steel plates is sectional density and velocity.

Good try, though.

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You said:

.243 and .270 will go through 3/8" ar 500.

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When the post above you clearly showed that a .243 was stopped by the same AR500 grade steel that you claimed would not stop it.

How is that a "good try"? You were proven wrong, and there is photographic evidence directly above your post to show that.

Will other .243 and .270 rounds go through AR500? Maybe, at some distances.....but making a blanket statement like you did will leave you proven wrong 99% of the time.... This not being part of that other 1%.

There's a difference between what i said, which is ".243 and .270 will go through 3/8" ar 500"

and what you want me to have said, which is: "there is no circumstance where a .243 diameter projectile will fail to penetrate 3/8" ar-500 plate."

I use cinder block molds available (usually free) at the local brickyard when they get out of spec. I have only rarely seen that stuff break upon impact with anything 30 cal. and smaller

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I'm unfamiliar with this type mold, do you know what they're made of?
How thick are they?

Andrew Wyatt said:

There's a difference between what i said, which is ".243 and .270 will go through 3/8" ar 500"

and what you want me to have said, which is: "there is no circumstance where a .243 diameter projectile will fail to penetrate 3/8" ar-500 plate."

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Would you mind sharing what the circumstances were when you shot through 3/8" AR-500 plate?

steel

There always seems to be differing schools of thought about shooting steel whether it's mild or varying degrees of hardness up to armor plate.

I look at it as personal risk assessment and it is up to each individual to determine how much risk they are willing to take.

I agree that steel that doesn't crater or dimple is the safest way to go. Is it the ONLY way to do it? My opinion is no but an opinion is like an anal aperture, everyone has one. I shoot handguns at mild steel as close as 7 yds.


Factors in shooting steel safely are hardness of steel, velocity and makeup of bullet, distance to target. I have made steel targets of mild steel and have had numerous thousands of rounds fired at them with no adverse effects (injury wise).

Here are a few. The 3 rectangular plates were suspended from a swing. The spring plates were shot at with a 9mm pistol cal carbine. When we realized the 2" pipe was getting dinged pretty much, we stopped the use of these carbines and magnum caliber handguns. The supports were replaced and the target faces were angled downward. I later got some 8" round 3/8" AR500 replacement plates as well. The 2 colt speed plates were purchased from MGM targets. the material is 3/8" AR500 and they reset automatically.



On another forum, the question of steel core Chinese ammo came up so I tested some of what I had ( the question was steel core ammo being AP). Left to right (bottom first) is Chinese steel core as is the one above it. Top left is German plastic core. Then Golden Tiger, another German plastic core, a Wolf. The top right made the nicest petal design. It was Egyptian lead core. This angle iron was also 1/2" thick.



Here is a club target I had the opportunity to shoot with a 8 3/8" bbl S&W500 and a Corbon round (?gr). The bullet actually stuck in the 3/8" thick plate.



This was a piece of 3/8" stainless steel with a .44 mag (same load as above) and I think a 180 gr .40

Bronze pointy projos at Mach 3 and above are murder on T-1 . I don't have any of that 500 or newer stuff. The sectional density lengthens the range they still penetrate. The Barnes 75 grain Banded spitzer at 3300 fps muzzle velocity goes thru 3/4" T-1 at 200 yards as does old type .50 BMG armor piercing. The 30-06 AP out of an M-1 puts a good crater in it but no hole, that is all I have tried. I bought the .243 Banded solids for a specific purpose, like the UN small arms treaty enforced in the US.

T1 steel

Gordon, T1 steel is only in the mid 300's of Brinnel hardness.

I tried copying steel info from the Action Target website.

http://www.actiontarget.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/pt_Steel_Target_Resource_Guide.pdf

56hawk said:

Would you mind sharing what the circumstances were when you shot through 3/8" AR-500 plate?

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the 75 and 90 grain .243 and the 130 and 150 grain in the .270 are the ones that are most likely to go through, provided its not a reduced loading.

if ur shooting a 243 and 270 through a ar500 plate, then you need to smack your dealer passing off steel as ar500 that clearly isnt

Ar500

Andrew, I have to agree with the posters about the penetration of those bullets through 3/8" AR500.

I think that plate was not AR500. I don't doubt the penetration. I doubt it was actually AR500.

But then again , I live to be wrong on the internet. It's like a job.

I don't have a .243 or 270 or I would try it.

I bought these 8" rounds from a guy on this board ( Mcosman ). They are 3/8" AR500 & were $25 ea. but I never tried shooting rifles at them.

We have 10 "real" 3/8" AR 500 plates so we decided to use one for testing to see just what kind of abuse they would actually take, shot everything from 300 winmag, .243, .260, .223 green tips and several other calibers ... even racked off a couple 12 ga slugs just for the hell of it. All from 30 yds away... Nothing penetrated, but the .223 did leave slight indentations but no major damage.

Sorry on the cinder block mold ? Just got back here. Don't know what kinda' steel it is--just know it's usually free when they trash it at brickyards that use it--

6.5 WSM/140 A-Max at 300 yds.--

A lot of your cheaper steel targets made for RF are made out of A36 structural steel.Ok for RF use over .125"(.125 gets beaten up pretty good at close range).People are amazed that 5.56 M193 will burn a hole right thru 1/4" A36 out to 100 yards(farthest Ive shot it).makes that nice hole with a copper grommet around it.

High velocity isn't the only reason that bullets penetrate steel. The major factor is that lead-core jacketed bullets function much like a bazooka or RPG with their "shaped charges".

They are really "burning" their way through. The lead is contained by the jacket and gets heated instantaneously, by compression, into a liquid "torch" that melts the steel. That's why such bullet holes have crowns at both entrance and exit.

I've hit the same 3/8" steel targets at over 200 yards with Barnes TSX and Hornady GMX .243 Win and .270 Win bullets and neither would go through, but some stay trapped in the cratered steel. Conversely, lead-core bullets driven at the same velocity bore through easily.

Hey Steve that is the coolest looking XP I've ever seen and it sounds like a great cartridge!!!!!!

I found out that steel core light ball 7.62x54R won't penetrate a square tube metal fence post at 300 yards. It burns a hole in the front and dents the heck out of the back. And it makes the coolest ringing sound I've ever heard. lol. Same results all 3 times I hit that post.

Landis45 said:

All from 30 yds away... Nothing penetrated, but the .223 did leave slight indentations but no major damage.

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You need to get a bigger gun. Below are pictures of AR500 plates I shot with a 458 Lott 400 grain lead flat point at 2499 fps. Top picture is a 3/8" plate and the bottom is a 1/2" plate.

Good Gawwwwd Son!!

AR

56,

Cool pics.

It was pointed out to me on another board that AR500 penetrations do not have the expanded "petals" on either side of the plate as mild steel does.

I'm not sure at what point of steel hardness this occurs. AR400 or harder? Not sure.