School me on 'Anciens Etablissements'

Anciens Etablissements who? "Anciens Etablissements" just means Company. The best known in the gun community may be Pieper, but many French and especially Belgian companies use that term.

Jim

http://littlegun.be/ is a great source for Belgium made revolvers.

Are you asking about the old Belgium firm of Pieper?

Anciens Etablissements Pieper is a Belgian arms manufacturer established under the name Henri Pieper in Herstal, Belgium in 1884 (some sources use 1866), by Henri Pieper. In 1898, it was renamed to Nicolas Pieper, and it became the Anciens Etablissements Pieper in 1905. It stayed in business until approximately 1950. The company used the Bayard trade name and manufactured Bergmann-Bayard pistol and Bayard 1908 pistol.

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This outfit?

tipoc

Radagast said:

http://littlegun.be/ is a great source for Belgium made revolvers.

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+1 on this site! I did some research on a friends Webley bulldog knock off. Very informative. I loved the little trip in time checking proofs and makers marks. I wasn't initially aware that Belgium had SO MANY firearms manufacturers at one point.

First let me make clear that I am not an expert on French/Belgian legal terms. The term "ancien etablissement" literally means "old establishment" or "old company". I understand it is equivalent to the British "successors" and is used when the founder of a company (e.g., Pieper) dies with no direct heirs but a new company purchases the old one and also the rights to the name.

If I am wrong, I would appreciate someone with certain knowledge correcting me.

Jim

Well, Jim K, methinks you got it right.

Pieper, of "Bayard" fame, is what came to my mind as well.

Semantically, the French "ancien établissement" and/or "anciens établissements" could be translated as "erstwhile company" or "company formerly known as"

And yes, if you go end of the 19th century up to & including interbellum years (1918-1940), there are hundreds of Belgian gun manufacturers, from excellent (Pieper, Nagant, Francotte, etc..) down to disreputable...

This, just like most things about my country, can get confusing sometimes.