Black Powder update

I'm gonna gear up to make mine as per your vid. I've got some 16 mesh screen spotted, in the door of my travel trailer. ROFL! Well, I'll buy some, ain't gonna molest the door of the trailer. I don't have facilities to do it, yet, though. I'm going to make my own charcoal, eventually, but for now, I'll order it.

You SURE that 16 mesh is making 3F? Sure getting good results. Weight seems a might light. But, hell, if it works, it works! Don't fix what ain't broke. Soon as I get my shop set up and new chronograph (time to retire the old one, needs screens, is a bit dated) I'll be testing myself. But, sounds like some GOOD stuff. I'll have to back off the charge in my brasser, but I reckon the ROA and the Remmy are good for it.

You SURE that 16 mesh is making 3F? Sure getting good results. Weight seems a might light. But, hell, if it works, it works! Don't fix what ain't broke. Soon as I get my shop set up and new chronograph (time to retire the old one, needs screens, is a bit dated) I'll be testing myself. But, sounds like some GOOD stuff. I'll have to back off the charge in my brasser, but I reckon the ROA and the Remmy are good for it.
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MCgunner, back in the 1800s, manufacturers started compressing the moist powder to squeeze the air out and increase the density. According to my books, the modern process entails 1200 psi from a hydraulic press to squeeze a moist wheel-cake from 1-1/4" thickness down to 3/4" thickness. Most of us homebrewers don't have this type of equipment, so our powder is less dense/heavy, more like the powder manufactured prior to the 1800s.

Still works good, though! The only possible drawback might be that our powder granules still have the internal pockets of air, so they will burn up faster than similar-sized factory granules.
The Lyman Blackpowder Handbook lists some "ultra-magnum" loads for .58 rifles, using FFg..... I'd be scared to duplicate these loads with homebrew powder which might burn like 4Fg.

Which could then, because it's 'fluffy', burn faster and therefore "spike" its pressure peak that much sooner; and therefore cause those "unbelievable" speeds you're chrono is reporting.

Or maybe not...... I'm commenting on a subject of which I have no knowledge/experience base. But it's another variable which COULD and SHOULD be explored, from both an educational and safety standpoint.

(Yeah, the "Old Fart" in me is poking its head out of the hole in the ground.)
But, I'm following your YouTube vids; and waiting for Harbor Freight to advertise another sale on their Rock Tumbler/Polishers. I've got a box of Hornaday .451" roundballs that aren't being used since I've moved on to .454's; so the "media" is already waiting for a home.

MCgunner, back in the 1800s, manufacturers started compressing the moist powder to squeeze the air out and increase the density. According to my books, the modern process entails 1200 psi from a hydraulic press to squeeze a moist wheel-cake from 1-1/4" thickness down to 3/4" thickness. Most of us homebrewers don't have this type of equipment, so our powder is less dense/heavy, more like the powder manufactured prior to the 1800s.

Still works good, though! The only possible drawback might be that our powder granules still have the internal pockets of air, so they will burn up faster than similar-sized factory granules.
The Lyman Blackpowder Handbook lists some "ultra-magnum" loads for .58 rifles, using FFg..... I'd be scared to duplicate these loads with homebrew powder which might burn like 4Fg.

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Thanks for that info. That makes it more understandable. I do have a press, but I'd have to make some dies or somethin' I guess. I'll just run with what you guys are doing. The thought of compressing black powder kinda gives me the chills, anyway. I do have a chronograph so I'll work with it on my loads. Should keep me out of pressure trouble. Don't have an Ohler with a strain gauge, but I can see if I can duplicate my normal loads with it using less powder. Be more economical if nothing else!

I'm kinda interested in what it will do in the ROA. I stuff that thing full of 777 compressed with a 220 conical and get around 1300 fps. I ain't skirt of the home brew in that gun. I shoot my revolvers more'n my rifles, probably just use the stuff in the revolvers if I duplicate these results. Sounds a might fast for a rifle at this point. Better to be safe.

Great thread, regardless of all the bickering! THANKS! Gears in my head are turning, I'm learning here.

One time I took some of my wet BP, spooned it into a piece of PVC that was capped on one end, then took a dowel and used it as a press. I could get probably 25% compression. But I worried about the water being squeezed out, because the KNO3 is dissoved in the water. Would I be losing too much of KNO3. I also worried about regranulating it, as after dry it was very hard.

BTW, that would be a great way to make your own pellets. Compress it a bit, remove the cap, push it on out and cut to length. 'Course you'd have to have PVC that had an inner diameter a bit smaller than the chamber of your guns.

Maybe I need to try that again.

I've got both these vids bookmarked for reference. Thanks again!

Ah, well, pellets, I never messed with the pellets, just load loose powder. for my rifles, I have these plastic "speed loaders" to take afield when hunting. Works for me.

I'm more for loose powder myself, but i can see the allure were you able to make high powered BP in pellet form to whatever volume/weight your rifle liked most.

Just saw some posts on the Castboolits forum which reminded me of this old THR thread.

A fellow called "Cal50" has developed a first-class system for compressing his moist BP. If I'm doing ther math correctly, his hydraulic press applies roughly 1500 psi to the puck, slightly more than the pressure used by the big manufacturers -

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/sho...d-to-corn-my-black-poder-for-use-in-cartrides

brushhippie said:

After making this powder for a year now I finally got to test my powder. I first wanted to find out what a full cylinder of powder weighs, (in my 58 NMN)it is actually....14 grains.... and what kinda of speed am I getting...right at 1000 fps! HOLY CRAP! We also weighed out and shot (from a .50 cal caplock rifle) up to 75 grains by weight and achieved 1450 with it, where it took 120 gains of swiss to get these speeds, Im really surprised with these results but extremely pleased! If your not making your own, you really should give it a try!
http://youtu.be/AUVo_hOadyc

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Hi... is wettable 90/10 sulfur going to work in this process you think?

Aloha...

Aloha, Rattus58. I tried it once, just to see what would happen. I used "dusting sulfur" from Do-it-Best Hardware (stock # 722367).

It seemed to work just fine. The chrono results were not significantly different, as far as I could tell.

ofitg said:

Aloha, Rattus58. I tried it once, just to see what would happen. I used "dusting sulfur" from Do-it-Best Hardware (stock # 722367).

It seemed to work just fine. The chrono results were not significantly different, as far as I could tell.

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Thank you! I can't find any pure sulfer here in Hawaii but have found some 90/10 stuff at a fertilizer wholesale place.

Thank you again.

Much Aloha... Tom

That was an awesome video, Brushhippie, and unlike many YouTube videos, I actually learned something. As a result, I plan to make my own black powder in the future. I really appreciate your posting it. Excellent and highly instructive presentation!

(BTW, your voice reminds me of Jeff Bridges in True Grit. That ain't a Brooklyn accent you've got there, is it? )

brushhippie said:

Hey Rattus, I have heard several people talking about making it sulfurless (I havent tried it myself) but I dont see why it wouldnt work. The way I understand it the Sulfur aids in ignition, so it might be harder to ignite ...but in a revolver I doubt if you would be able to tell, it might slow your speed a little. Good Luck and have fun!

One foot, awesome link thanks! This is exactly what I had in mind as far as compressing powder into pucks. Im about to try this myself.

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Thank you... I was thinking along that line but you know when you are stuck on a lily pad..

Much Aloha...

One foot, awesome link thanks! This is exactly what I had in mind as far as compressing powder into pucks. Im about to try this myself.

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BH, keep us posted! Getting rid of the dextrin and setting up a hydraulic press may be the next big step for us home-brewers.... we can finally move forward into the 19th century

I had an idea for compressing the powder. My truck weighs 5000 pounds, that aught to be more than enough pressure to make it do what we want it to do. I could probably cut some kind of ramp and use a 9X9 baking pan, and then cut a piece of 1/2" mild steel that fits inside the pan nicely.

As for how to press that sucker, I'm thinking cut a 2X10" piece of lumber that will be wider than my truck. Then put the pan of wet BP in the gutter, stick two bricks laying flat on the mild steel, put the board on there, drive that sucker right onto the board so only the two front tires are on there.

Let's hope it isn't a "hold my beer and watch this" type scenario.

1000fps+...

Here's a link to an old thread I was reading...the interesting part is on pg 3, post #56 by mec...
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=229197&page=3

Results with two revolvers. Measure calibrated for Goex fffg. The swisss powder is denser and actually weighs more than indicated. 40 grains of goex/ball is a full chamber. Swiss is heavily compressed to make it fit and puts a strain on the loading lever.

velocity extreme spread
Remington
35 Grain Swiss FFFg 1089 33
40 Grains Swiss FFFg 1104 37
40 Grains Pyrodex P 1125 35
*35 Gr/Vol. H777 1061 28

Colt 60 Army
35 Grains Swiss Uberti 1031 48
Same Load Different Day 1020 34

40 Grains Goex FFFg 992 34
40 grains Goex FFFg with Wonder Wad 942 30
40 Grains Swiss FFFg 1042 49
40 Grains Swiss FFFg with Wonder Wad 1055 80

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I would be very pleased getting 1000 fps with a 35-40 gr charge of Pyrodex If you do the math on a '58 Remmie that .44 caliber ball moving at 1K is a heck of a powerfull load! I always shoot my '58 with 35 gr and can attest to it's awsome discharge and poser!
Most internet claims are overinflated and normally bragging. I have never clocked any BP load just cause I didn't want to dirty the other guy's
ZVP equipment up.

BH, those numbers are great. Where can I find your recipe for Holy Black?

When grinding powder, what size and how many balls do you use for say a 200 gram batch?

I'm using all 44 balls, but it seems to take a lot longer to grind the powder. my 1st and 2nd batch would leave like little balls of KN03 behind when doing the burn test. Should I be using smaller balls to grind with? I'm using the HF tumbler as well. Thanks for any help.