Help on Gun Safe Decisions?

Cokeman, I hope my post isn't the reason you came to the conclusion. First of all, I'm not a "safe guy" like some of the guys here (i.e. CB900F), just giving a perspective on some of the information that I read in this thread.

A lot of good info and I wanted to "clean it up" a bit, so others who aren't as well informed would know. I found this forum by doing google searches and reading various archived threads (a lot of fun ones ).

I don't believe everyone need spend thousands of dollars, but people should be realistic about what they buy and what they pay for. A lot of gimmicks in the gun safe industry, I'm finding.

If my post is not the reason for yours, then ignore what I've said...

So, is there a safe for $1000 or less that is worth buying? I'm worried about thieves, not my kids.

Cokeman said:

So, is there a safe for $1000 or less that is worth buying? I'm worried about thieves, not my kids.

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What size are you looking for?

In your price range, you might look at the Ft Knox Maverick and the entry level safes from Champion and Superior. I have seen some fairly positive reviews on the Model T. Champion's Encore series and Superior's Medalist series should be close to your budget depending on size. You might also want to check with Sturdy and get a price on a safe without fire lining if you are mainly concerned with theft. You will likely save $400 or so if you can order a Sturdy without the insulation.

Otherwise keep an eye on Craig's List for your area. You might be able to find a used safe that someone's selling as part of an estate sale or because of a move to a new town, etc.

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So, is there a safe for $1000 or less that is worth buying? I'm worried about thieves, not my kids.

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If I were worried about thieves and not my kids or fire I would hire a carpenter and look at making me a false wall. Me I wanted fire protection and some security then I put that behind a false wall.

As you can see in my sig line, I don't have many guns. I would be fine getting one of the smaller safes from a company. I wouldn't need anything huge. I wouldn't mind a Fort Knox. They're local. I've been to their factory a few times for work. It's been many years though.

Apparently Superior is a local company too.

Cokeman said:

As you can see in my sig line, I don't have many guns. I would be fine getting one of the smaller safes from a company. I wouldn't need anything huge. I wouldn't mind a Fort Knox. They're local. I've been to their factory a few times for work. It's been many years though.

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I visited the plant back in July and came away impressed. We stopped in completely out of the blue and wound up going on a factory tour. The company marketing rep dropped whatever he was doing and was happy to show us around. Our little daughter wasn't too excited about wandering around in a noisy metal plant so the receptionist volunteered to watch her and let her color at her desk while we walked around. A very friendly environment. Just a class act all the way.

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As you can see in my sig line, I don't have many guns. I would be fine getting one of the smaller safes from a company. I wouldn't need anything huge. I wouldn't mind a Fort Knox. They're local. I've been to their factory a few times for work. It's been many years though.

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Get the best you can swing and feel safe with. I have a woodworking shop so I can custom trim the house and hide the safe and let me tell you they don't even know it's there. I'm only worried about fire.

I'm happy with my Sturdy Safe and feel it was a good value.

How much was it?

Sturdy includes the cost of shipping in the prices listed on their website. With that said, I have found it possible to get a cheaper price over the phone based on proximity to CA . If you're in UT it's probably worth your time to call for a price quote.

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Late to the thread but I will add that I am still impressed with the Sturdy I bought in 2008. At the time Sturdy had a limited run of the safe I bought. They are a small, all American company that is about customer service and quality. They have the ability to adjust to your needs.

I'm only worried about fire.

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Then I would stay away from the Sturdy.

I do not know about that. My safe has the Sturdy (Terry) selected fire lining based on a dry product that Terry decided was the best. My safe has yet to be tested THANK GOD! I live in the woods and wild fire worries me.
My safe is located in a place in the house to give us the best chance. A fire is serious business.

That said the fire lining in our Sturdy does not wick moisture. It appears to help maintain a reasonable level humidity while still offering the same protection found in industrial ovens. My guns do not rust. I live in Washington state. I don't pay to much attention other than to oil them twice a year regardless of use.

I would probably put a fire sprinkler over my safe if I had the Crown Jewels. Otherwise, I write a list of everything I need to grab if given 15 minutes to evacuate. We are prepared to go!

I would probably put a fire sprinkler over my safe if I had the Crown Jewels. Otherwise, I write a list of everything I need to grab in 15 minutes and prepare to go!

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The cost of a DIY sprinkler system really isn't that much. A few sprinkler heads from McMaster Carr supply are less than $30 EA. A 10' section of 3/4' copper pipe is about $20 from Lowes Home Improvement. You need a plain jane check valve for under $15 (also from Lowes). Additional hardware, more pipe or whatever including a ball valve at the end of the line to bleed things you are looking at under $200 as a DIY project. Not bad considering the peace of mind.

Just My Take
Ron

I do not know about that. My safe has the Sturdy (Terry) selected fire lining based on a dry product that Terry decided was the best.

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And in short, this is the problem I have with a number of gun safe manufacturers. What they decide is best, has little to do with reality, since many of them have zero background in the safe business.

For years, I have said that concrete fills are clearly superior, because that's what the vast majority of safes with real fire ratings use. On another forum, an engineer who has designed safes for many years backed up this claim with science (all above my pay grade). Come to find out, there really is a reason that real safe manufacturers with real fire ratings use those materials. He added that gypusm board was second best, and that passive insulations like fiberglass simply are not as effective.

The truth of the matter is that if fire protection is the most important requirement, then a gun safe shouldn't even be an option. A UL rated fire safe (using cast filled insulation) is going to be your best bet.

a1abdj said:

The truth of the matter is that if fire protection is the most important requirement, then a gun safe shouldn't even be an option. A UL rated fire safe (using cast filled insulation) is going to be your best bet.

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The problem here is that a true fire safe that's big enough to hold anything but the smallest collection of long guns is going to be weighed in tons rather than pounds. Same is true for sq ft of storage. A very large fire safe is going to have a fairly small amount of interior storage space. Most home owners neither can afford nor have use for these monsters.



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Fella's;

Which is where Graffunder comes in. Plate steel, proprietary concrete insulation, and what I feel is a reasonable cost given the protection you get. No, they are not for everyone, they're expensive. But, if you've got $10,000.00 worth of guns & stuff, it's a false economy to buy an RSC in my opinion.

900F

But, if you've got $10,000.00 worth of guns & stuff, it's a false economy to buy an RSC in my opinion.

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I also strongly agree with that! For many that is a low ball figure too.

Ron

The problem here is that a true fire safe that's big enough to hold anything but the smallest collection of long guns is going to be weighed in tons rather than pounds. Same is true for sq ft of storage. A very large fire safe is going to have a fairly small amount of interior storage space. Most home owners neither can afford nor have use for these monsters.

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There's not much of a difference in weight between a gun safe and a properly UL rated fire safe when comparing external dimensions.

The internal volume will depend, as some cast insulations allow thinner walls, and some gun safes have several layers of gypsum board.

A 2 hour fire safe for example:

Internal Dimensions:
50" Height
18.5" Width
21" Depth
External Dimensions:
60.5" Height
25.5" Width
28.875" Depth
Weight 875 lbs
Capacity 11.2 cubic feet

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a1abdj said:

There's not much of a difference in weight between a gun safe and a properly UL rated fire safe when comparing external dimensions.

The internal volume will depend, as some cast insulations allow thinner walls, and some gun safes have several layers of gypsum board.

A 2 hour fire safe for example:

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Forgive me. You are correct. I'm thinking TL rated stuff not UL fire.

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The main things that must be done when you are going to save your gun is that you have a proper gun save and a proper place for that gun safe.Because when you have a quick access to that place and other person don't know that place you can easily secure them and access them when you need.
Queensland Security

http://www.policeone.com/police-products/firearm-accessories/firearms-storage/articles/6336776-2-key-considerations-for-buying-a-gun-safe/

Here's a brief article with some common sense things to look for.

Fella's;

I read the linked article listed above. It's good information, as far as it goes, but the author apparantly only visited the plants of a few RSC manufacturers. She does not make the differentiation between true safes & RSC's.

As the author is a working LEO, and her article is aimed at that market, price is a definate consideration. The sad fact is, most LEO's are not able to afford, and may not need, a U.L. rated safe. But, the option was not presented, which tells me that she needed to do a little more research on the subject.

The data in the article has been posted on THR many, many, times.

900F