insurance?

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old lady new shooter

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I've noticed there are a few different insurance plans offered that cover various liability aspects of using a gun in self-defense. Do people here mostly have this? If not, why not? If so, which plan(s) do you like best and why?
 
I have no such insurance. In nearly 40 years of carrying, I've never once had to draw my weapon or even felt like I might need to. Nor has my home ever been broken into. Whatever that insurance costs, it's not worth it to me.
 
I don't have a policy for that either. If you're an NRA member (please think about joining if not) there is some coverage which comes with membership but not sure of the specifics. Homeowners and/or umbrella may also provide some but I haven't looked nor shopped for it.

In the end, I don't see a need for liability coverage. I would expect that if the court finds you guilty of a bad shoot then it won't pay anyway. I really think the $$ would be better spent on more training (so you are less likely to have a bad shoot), better gear if needed, and better home security (to keep them out) than to pay for such insurance.

I'm well insured but don't see a need for this myself.
 
Nothing here, the odds of needing it are pretty high, pulse I live in a pretty gun/self defense friendly area and justified shootings generally aren't put to the test like many other places.

That said, I generally don't do any insurance unless I have to, and then it's the minimum. I don't buy extended warranty's either.
 
There has been mention that the antigunners want to force this insurance on gun owners to prevent innocent people and their families from being financially harmed when a CCW or other armed person goes berserk and shoots them.

You can well imagine how politicized it would become when rates are jacked up and some can't afford it. It would disenfranchise those who need protection because they can't afford to move out of the 'hood.

Insurance companies already exclude a lot of coverage when we do adventurous things in our lives - skydiving, racing, etc are all now not covered unless you get special riders and they aren't cheap. Vehicle insurance on kit cars is a good example - they usually get low mileage but pay up to 4X the annual fees.

I believe the point of the firearm itself is that IT is the insurance you take out to continue to live a peaceful and prosperous life. Finding out you didn't practice the required ethics to say stop three times according to the policy and are therefore not covered would be distressing, more so that the injured perp sues to get a windfall bonus from your insurer.

I can't see anything good come from it. In that it's not happening yet, it might be worth it for someone - but on a mass basis it would become another boondoggle for politicians to fuss over, and for us to wake up to discover new requirements and higher premiums. We get all too much of that from our auto insurers.
 
Check out ascca.com. They have insurance plans that pay bail bond and criminal and civil suit defense.
 
I don't have a concealed carry permit yet. Wife is scared to death that I might get into a situation where I would have to use it and do everything by the book and still lose everything we have in a lawsuit. My answer was that if it comes to me ever shooting someone in self defense, losing everything we have will be the least of my worries. The ONLY way I would ever shoot someone is if I was totally certain that me or someone dear to me would end up dead if I did not shoot the fool that was threatening me or my loved one. Still may get insurance when I get a permit.
 
No I do not, and I never will, the likely hood of ever needing such a product is pretty astronomical its a waste of money.
 
Iff'n I was you, I would use Marty Hayes' Armed Citizens' Legal Defense Network as a baseline if you're considering such insurance.

I've listened to the sales pitches on way too many of these things - one that's pushed by a major organization (not the NRA) only pays if you're found innocent, which means "your" insurance has a vested interest in you being found guilty - I don't think I like the sound of that!

Mr. Hayes' outfit sounds like they front you money and lawyers in order to try to head off the problem, instead of leaving you to your own devices, possibly hoping you're found guilty so they don't have to pay out.

There are a couple of others that seem to follow his model, but I can't tell you off the top of my head who they are - I've listened to a number of representatives from various outfits on gun podcasts.

I think another I might investigate is Texas Law Shield - they are in the process of going national, so you'd have to check to see if they are in your state. Their national outfit is U.S. Law Shield.

Just cruising by their site I see one of their bullet points is Not A Useless Reimbursement Scheme.

Shop wisely...
 
basicblur offered,

I've listened to the sales pitches on way too many of these things - one that's pushed by a major organization (not the NRA) only pays if you're found innocent, which means "your" insurance has a vested interest in you being found guilty - I don't think I like the sound of that!
Click to expand...

Wow. I never thunka that. Thank you!

Terry, 230RN
 
Wow. I never thunka that. Thank you!
Click to expand...
Hey...I am nothing if not helpful! :D

The folks at Texas Law Shield / U.S. Law Shield have been on Bill Frady's Lock N Load podcast (formerly GOA podcast) a LOT of times, and have spent quite a bit of time each time they're on. Just about every time they have lawyers Edwin and Michelle and everything I've heard so far sounds good enough for someone interested in insurance to investigate them further. They often discuss cases, and how they managed to head some of them off before their client gets dragged into court and put thru the ringer.

For any of those interested, you can follow the link to his podcast and browse thru the show synopsis to find insurance related guests episodes, or maybe Google "Bill Frady self defense insurance" etc.?

I listen to way too many gun related podcasts while doing my daily chores.

There is one other insurance outfit that sounded like they were modeling theirs after Marty Hayes and U.S. Law Shield, but the name escapes me. I'm pretty sure it was Second Call Defense - they were also on Frady's podcast.

Unless they've changed, you may not realize with Marty Hayes' outfit that only the first year is $120 or so, then drops to $85 or so after that. The first year is higher because they send you a lot of educational info (DVD's, etc.) to get you started / edumucated.

Our former / disgraced VA governor started one of these outfits, but I didn't get far into this one before dismissing it.
 
My dads car got broken into in 1969. Repo man was repo-ing the wrong car. My mom came out at 2AM and jumped on the guy like a screaming banshee. As my dad walked out all he saw was a guy wrestling with my mom. At some point she cut her arm and was bleeding. My dad shot the guy in the knee with a 44 mag. I know. Nowadays we'd be talking about him getting sued etc. and that he should have aimed center mass and kept firing until his revolver was empty blah,balh blah. Back in the day though maiming someone for life was perfectly acceptable. In any case the now one legged repo man had to find a new career path after that.

Woe be it unto the man who breaks into my home should I be there.
 
I went with the best available, although imperfect policy available in our area for 2 reasons. First, I live in Illinois which is openly hostile towards gun owners. In the unlikely event I need to use my gun, I expect to be charged with something. Second, when I compared the cost, a little over $20 per month to the fact that these incidents can bankrupt you, It was a small investment. While I'm far from wealthy, I don't miss $20 a month and spend much more that that eating out, on coffee, etc.

I've had more than my share of dealings with insurance companies in regards to homeowners and auto claims, and understand that too many of them will write one sided policies, so if you're considering one of these policies make sure to read and understand the details of the coverage and exclusions so you know what you're agreeing to.
 
Our Homeowner's and Umbrella policies both have coverage exclusions for intentional injury or property damage caused by the insured, no matter what the circumstances.

Except:

This exclusion does not apply to bodily injury resulting from the use of reasonable force by any insured to protect persons or property.
Click to expand...

I'm not in the insurance business other than as a consumer. I strongly recommend Umbrella coverage when obtainable; it'll put an extra $1M (or more) over your head when the lawyers get busy. And it's pretty cheap, we pay around $200 per year for the policy.
 
Check with your homeowner policy agent for an opinion on the liability coverage on your policy. Then explore an Umbrella which is an additional coverage you can buy that kicks in after you use up your HO coverage, or may expand coverage or give new protections for various occurrences. Get the definitions from you agent in writing or have him show you where in the policy it covers you and for what. You can generally increase your HO policy liability to a million dollars for a very small sum. I advise that anyway, plus if you get an Umbrella you would more than likely be required to increase the HO liability to a million.
 
basicblur said:
Iff'n I was you, I would use Marty Hayes' Armed Citizens' Legal Defense Network as a baseline if you're considering such insurance.

I've listened to the sales pitches on way too many of these things - one that's pushed by a major organization (not the NRA) only pays if you're found innocent, which means "your" insurance has a vested interest in you being found guilty - I don't think I like the sound of that!

Mr. Hayes' outfit sounds like they front you money and lawyers in order to try to head off the problem, instead of leaving you to your own devices, possibly hoping you're found guilty so they don't have to pay out.

There are a couple of others that seem to follow his model, but I can't tell you off the top of my head who they are - I've listened to a number of representatives from various outfits on gun podcasts.

I think another I might investigate is Texas Law Shield - they are in the process of going national, so you'd have to check to see if they are in your state. Their national outfit is U.S. Law Shield.

Just cruising by their site I see one of their bullet points is Not A Useless Reimbursement Scheme.

Shop wisely...
Click to expand...
VERY helpful, thank you very much. I haven't actually started researching any of this but had some questions in mind... but it did not occur to me that such a plan would only pay if you're found innocent!
 
TomJ said:
I went with the best available, although imperfect policy available in our area for 2 reasons. First, I live in Illinois which is openly hostile towards gun owners. In the unlikely event I need to use my gun, I expect to be charged with something. Second, when I compared the cost, a little over $20 per month to the fact that these incidents can bankrupt you, It was a small investment. While I'm far from wealthy, I don't miss $20 a month and spend much more that that eating out, on coffee, etc.

I've had more than my share of dealings with insurance companies in regards to homeowners and auto claims, and understand that too many of them will write one sided policies, so if you're considering one of these policies make sure to read and understand the details of the coverage and exclusions so you know what you're agreeing to.
Click to expand...
Thanks very much. :)

I'm in California, i.e. Illinois on steroids.
 
bikemutt said:
Our Homeowner's and Umbrella policies both have coverage exclusions for intentional injury or property damage caused by the insured, no matter what the circumstances.

Except:



I'm not in the insurance business other than as a consumer. I strongly recommend Umbrella coverage when obtainable; it'll put an extra $1M (or more) over your head when the lawyers get busy. And it's pretty cheap, we pay around $200 per year for the policy.
Click to expand...
My homeowner's probably has the same exclusion, I'd be surprised if it didn't.
 
bikemutt said:
Our Homeowner's and Umbrella policies both have coverage exclusions for intentional injury or property damage caused by the insured, no matter what the circumstances.

Except:



I'm not in the insurance business other than as a consumer. I strongly recommend Umbrella coverage when obtainable; it'll put an extra $1M (or more) over your head when the lawyers get busy. And it's pretty cheap, we pay around $200 per year for the policy.
Click to expand...
Actually unless that is a typo your quote says the exclusion does not apply to a self-defense scenario... ?
 
To anyone interested, I was catching up on some of my saved podcasts the other day, and on the episode below, Brill Frady talks with Sean Maloney of Second Call Defense.

You can download as MP3 and listen at your leisure - you'll have to FF to find the section of the show with Second Call Defense.

If this is the show I'm thinking about, he covers what they've had to do in order to recover folks' firearms, often when the "case" never goes anywhere, and the police just decide to steal your property (because it's a gun).

Wed, 2 September 2015
Lock N Load with Bill Frady Ep 757
Train for close combat when training to gunfight,In the war of words the anti-gunners are getting uncharacteristically candid,Would the Roanoke shooter have been able to buy a gun in NYC,Gun control groups turn back to "Swatting",I get to cover the very rarely asked questions with Sean Maloney of Second Call Defense.

http://gunownersofamericaradio.libsyn.com/

EDIT: Skip ahead to the 57:45 second mark for the start of the Second Call Defense portion of the show.
 
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