Facepalm....shakes head...

Slight glitch in the link. Here ya go:

http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/30/us/unarmed-aviation-officers/

presence of officers with no means of stopping a threat......its called "security theatre"

make it look like were doing something without actually doing anything.

hso said:

You're not proving the essential information - Unarmed

What good are unarmed guards against a BG with a gun?

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Very true. The vast majority of what a police officer does whether on the street or in an airport does not require a gun.

CLP said:

Q: What should the police do in case of an "active shooter" (term du jour) situation?

A: Run and Hide

http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/30/us/unarmed-aviation-officers/a.html

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Unbelievable. But then, it is Chicago...

It is rediculous. A force multiplier x 0.

The union should shame the the governing body into acting. Since they can't get a deal with Smith and Wesson or Glock for weapons, they should turn to Nike to supply good running shoes.

Good advice and exactly what I'd do if unarmed. And it isn't as bad as it 1st appears. Prison guards and other LE officers don't carry guns when in detention facilities. There is too much risk of being overpowered and having the gun taken. Armed guards are present, just not in direct contact with prisoners.

Without knowing all of the facts it is hard to be too critical. Officers in a crowded airport interacting with hundreds of passengers could be overpowered if enough bad guys were able to get close. Not hard to do at some places in airports. The cops with guns don't interact with or work closely with passengers and are nearby.

I respectfully disagree.

The weapon is your mind, and your willingness to act, not the firearm.

What good are unarmed guards against a BG with a gun? They can slow him down, they can allow more people to escape, if they are good or lucky (or both) they can stop him. How many things are handy to beat the BG to death with?

I am constantly told by LEO's and their bumper stickers that they are the "Thin Blue Line" standing between us and the bad guys. It sucks that these sworn law enforcement officers are unarmed due to political reasons. As a Soldier that has had some truly messed up ROE's in my day I sympathize. But that does not relieve these officers of their duty, nor release them from their oath.

It's a crappy situation all around, and given a choice I'd much rather have a weapon, hell a rifle and a fire team, to face an active shooter. But some times that doesn't happen.

Sometimes in life you pull the short straw. If that happens, you do your best to kill the other guy, and failing that die like a viking.

If they are unwilling to do that perhaps they should seek a profession that doesn't involve being one of the men on the wall.....

Unarmed people have been proven to be ineffective against shooters. (I won't use the term active shooter as it is just DUMB). When these terrorists, or mentally insane shooters are confronted with armed resistance they usually kill themselves or get killed in a hail of bullets. Opposing firearms END the incident.

Good advice and exactly what I'd do if unarmed. And it isn't as bad as it 1st appears. Prison guards and other LE officers don't carry guns when in detention facilities. There is too much risk of being overpowered and having the gun taken. Armed guards are present, just not in direct contact with prisoners.

Without knowing all of the facts it is hard to be too critical. Officers in a crowded airport interacting with hundreds of passengers could be overpowered if enough bad guys were able to get close. Not hard to do at some places in airports. The cops with guns don't interact with or work closely with passengers and are nearby.

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did you watch the video where they clearly state that they have armed officers in the airport already?

its just this one group of officers they dont give guns to.


and a prison environment is a touch different that a crowded public place.

using the excuse that you could "Be surrounded by enough badguys" is a lame duck excuse........by that logic, no cop should every carry in a concert venue or a crowded mall

The emasculation of our police (and military) continues.

God forbid that anyone should "harm" a dangerous savage.

They are unarmed. What the **** you expect them to do?

Dogmush, the point isn't necessarily that they are unarmed. It's that they, like the citizenry, are being trained to run and hide in the event of an active-shooter incident.

True, large numbers of unarmed people can slow, or even thwart, such an attack if they make it their mission to do so. But these officers are being trained not to. That is their orders.

On top of that, such training is counter-intuitive to the natural response of most police officers. With some likely to RAH, and others likely to resist those orders and try to defend, the results could be a very uncoordinated response.

cheygriz said:

The emasculation of our police (and military) continues.

God forbid that anyone should "harm" a dangerous savage.

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I don't know, I see an awful lot of police gearing up like they were military deployed overseas, completely with rather large armoured vehicles, machine guns, suppressors, hard body armour...the so called militarization of police. Doesn't really seem emasculating to me.

dogmush said:

I respectfully disagree.

The weapon is your mind, and your willingness to act, not the firearm.

What good are unarmed guards against a BG with a gun? They can slow him down, they can allow more people to escape, if they are good or lucky (or both) they can stop him. How many things are handy to beat the BG to death with?

I am constantly told by LEO's and their bumper stickers that they are the "Thin Blue Line" standing between us and the bad guys. It sucks that these sworn law enforcement officers are unarmed due to political reasons. As a Soldier that has had some truly messed up ROE's in my day I sympathize. But that does not relieve these officers of their duty, nor release them from their oath.

It's a crappy situation all around, and given a choice I'd much rather have a weapon, hell a rifle and a fire team, to face an active shooter. But some times that doesn't happen.

Sometimes in life you pull the short straw. If that happens, you do your best to kill the other guy, and failing that die like a viking.

If they are unwilling to do that perhaps they should seek a profession that doesn't involve being one of the men on the wall.....

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Agreed. While it is better to have guards who also have the ability to defend, the lack of ability to defend does not negate their other values like possible deterrence, early warning, etc.

How many here were in the military? How many stood watches of some sort either unarmed or armed with only a night stick, flashlight and maybe a access to a phone or radio? Did you cry and complain that you felt threatened and needed a firearm...or did you suck it up and DO YOUR DUTY?

Medwheeler said:

Dogmush, the point isn't necessarily that they are unarmed. It's that they, like the citizenry, are being trained to run and hide in the event of an active-shooter incident.

True, large numbers of unarmed people can slow, or even thwart, such an attack if they make it their mission to do so. But these officers are being trained not to. That is their orders.

On top of that, such training is counter-intuitive to the natural response of most police officers. With some likely to RAH, and others likely to resist those orders and try to defend, the results could be a very uncoordinated response.

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I was disagreeing with the posters above me that implied (or in one case flat said) unarmed police were no good against shooters. They ain't great, but with the right mindset they are far from no use.

In defense of the airport police (There's a phrase I never thought I'd type....) the ones interviewed for the article were asking for firearms so that they could do their job of protecting people better. It seems it was the admin folks who have the policy of run and hide. The actual folks being told to do so seem to know they shouldn't.

However, bad leadership and asinine policies don't relieve the officers under discussion of their duty. I hope they have success in getting a policy change, I really do. Their current situation sucks.

But. (you knew a but was coming)

Every morning they get up, put on a uniform and a badge, and go to a job where they are sworn to defend the citizens and stop breakers of the law. You don't get to stop doing that duty if the situation goes from bad to lethal, irregardless of any orders. There's a word for someone that hides behind a locked door while people that they are sworn to defend are killed. I sincerly hope that the Airport Police in Midway and O'Hare aren't the cowards their leadership seems to think they are.

I am a competitive 3 gun shooter and high school teacher... I can easily hit my targets in a match but if "active shooter" threatens my classroom... I have 2 staplers and a pencil sharpener to throw at them...

I have spent my life as a career law enforcement officer wearing a badge for different agencies. I still wear a badge as I reach retirement in 5 more years.

None the Departments had dying as a job responsibility. It sounds harsh but tombstone courage has resulted in a lot of dead cops.

It sounds harsh but tombstone courage has resulted in a lot of dead cops.

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Dead cops are acceptable loss if it saved citizens. That's their purpose.

This policy of them being unarmed has been in place since the 90's, right?

Well, as long as they can attract enough warm bodies to fill and serve in those unarmed positions, the appointing authority will probably continue to do things in the current business-as-usual manner. Where's the incentive to change? Whatever political influences may be at work is something only someone more intimately familiar with the whole situation can answer.

I am a competitive 3 gun shooter and high school teacher... I can easily hit my targets in a match but if "active shooter" threatens my classroom... I have 2 staplers and a pencil sharpener to throw at them...

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i feel you.....im a teacher as well......and i shot Varsity rifle for the very college i am teaching at.......they could trust me with a gun when i was a student......but now that i am a professor, i am not allowed to possess the tools necessary to stop an active shooter, i guess ill throw some markers at a dangerous suspect .

M-Cameron said:

i feel you.....im a teacher as well......and i shot Varsity rifle for the very college i am teaching at.......they could trust me with a gun when i was a student......but now that i am a professor, i am not allowed to possess the tools necessary to stop an active shooter, i guess ill throw some markers at a dangerous suspect .

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Got a fire extinguisher in your classroom?