Sent my Stag Arms 9mm in for jamming problems...here's what they did ti fix it.

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AbitNutz

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I sent to my Stag Arms Model 9L 9mm AR in for a jamming problem. In fact, all it did was jam. I couldn't get more than a couple of rounds through it before it crushed the case against the breach face...

Tried 3 different Stag magazines and one Pro Mag...all jammed and the Pro Mag wouldn't even strip a round and chamber it.

I tired 6 different brands of ammo, both 115gr and 124gr. All of them behaved the same....just a nice case crusher.

Just got notice of them shipping it back. Here's the notes from the gunsmith.

Testing information: test fired 32 rds
Notes: New feed ramps, BCG, Upper receiver, and charging handle. Once these items were replaced
gunsmith test fired and rifle ran perfectly for all 32 rds.


They seem to have replaced a lot of stuff...no?
 
Ain't that somethin"? On one hand I'm happy they did more than say "user error" or polish the feed ramp and send it back. On the other hand...how in Gods name did something that needed this kind of work get past QC?

And I was thinking about replacing the barrel with a higher quality stainless...huh, go figure.
 
May be like most electronics these days. Starting over can cost less than trouble shooting. Hard to know unless you know the staff they have.

Acing a customer on happy once is bad enough, having them have problems a second time on a repair is in another ball park.

Sounds like they went further than most to make you happy, I would be glad. Better than them telling you to try different mags...
 
Manufactured goods are cheap, skilled labor isn't.

Very true. I used to work for a company that made transmissions. It was cheaper for us to just replace the faulty transmission than to tear it down and find the problem.
 
I wonder if they replaced one piece at a time or just replaced all of it at once...I mean, they replaced the freakin' charging handle...what on earth could that have to do with it jamming?
 
As I posted yesterday the "shotgun" approach tells me that they didn't waist time "troubleshooting", rather just sent you something they knew would work.
 
Considering that the entire upper assembly likely costs them about $150 to produce, I wouldnt doubt that it'd be cheaper to simply replace it.
 
As I posted yesterday the "shotgun" approach tells me that they didn't waist time "troubleshooting", rather just sent you something they knew would work.
Or this has come across their desk before and the first time they nickel dimmed it and this time took the quicker route and just replaced everything.
 
Or this has come across their desk before and the first time they nickel dimmed it and this time took the quicker route and just replaced everything.

Pretty much the same thing.

If there was a known single part that slipped through QC you would know that is the problem. If you have no QC, you wipe the slate clean.

What do people cost that know what is going on vs people making and selling stuff?
 
Old saying..."truth is in the pudding"...as in "rifle pudin' rounds down range from your hands"

I hope the gun runs like a sewing machine!

Mark
 
This sort of sounds like I'm complaining about the method they used to fix it...

I'm not really. The fact that this company has sooo much going on now just trying to survive and keep the doors open for its customers and over a 100 employees and is still able to handle repairs is pretty amazing to me.

I would have been really unhappy if the gunsmith notes had read...
1) Tuned ejector
2) Polished feed ramp
3) Changed magazine.


That would have made me crazy because there is no way that would fix what was happening.

The other extreme would have been:
1) Replaced rifle

I'm sure they couldn't do that due to the ATF standing there.

Somewhere in the middle would have made sense to me. This kinda sorta would have told me a trained gunsmith was making sure it ran well.
1) Replaced and fit extractor
2) Fit new ejector to BCG (Bolt Carrier Group)
3) Replaced, fit and polished feed ramp.

But I got:
1) Replaced entire BCG (that includes extractor, firing pin, etc...I looked it up)
2) Replaced feed ramp
3) Replaced charging handle. (This is a total mystery to me. I bet some folks here could get it to work without a charging handle at all.)
4) Upper receiver (Really? Entire upper receiver? What the heck could be wrong with that? All the slippery parts fit and slid back and forth. The barrel was threaded in it...???

Ok, so it does sound like I'm complaining. If it does run like a sewing machine I will be thrilled. Especially my sainted mothers 1930's Singer. She turned out store loads of clothes on that puppy for her children, grandchildren and great grandchildren....I should have kept it and had it bronzed as a testimony to American craftsmanship...Mom needed no such testimony...saints rarely do.

So I'm hoping the odds are that it does run really well and some guy who repairs these stands there and starts replacing parts till it does. He moves from basket of parts to basket of parts till he gets a positive result.

I guess I'm good with that...because that's how an AR was designed, no? It was never designed to have individual parts fit to it like an English double. Like has been said, it's modular.
 
QC? At Stag? Really? They assemble guns just like you would from parts they buy except thy do it with the cheapest labor they can get. Either they got a mis timed extension or their minimum wage assembly guy tweaked the upper to barrel pin engagement hole when they torqued the barrel nut down and the feed ramps in the receiver didnt line up with the barrel extension.

They fiexed it by putting a new uper on it. Your'e just lucky you got it before they shut down. Count your lucky stars.
 
What is your complaint? The rifle was not assembled correctly, the factory corrected the defects and you are still complaining. If they had told you to pound sand I could see the post but not after they repaired their screw up. I purchased a dedicated DPMS .22LR and soon after found they may drop the unit, an email to DPMS was returned stating in essence, " you break it we will fix it". I worried no more and many thousands of rounds later the rifle is going strong. By the way my Colt 9mm carbine has never skipped a beat but can sure send one to the poor house buying ammo.
 
Yeah, it does sound like I'm whining...but I'm not. I'm wholeheartedly grateful that this appears to be coming out well considering the disaster the company is enduring with the ATF...

I'm trying to understand the press about the company being "raided" by the ATF and my experience talking to them seems to be "no big deal"...Trying to equate these these two opposites.

As far as the fix goes...it just surprised me that they would throw so many parts at the thing to fix it....and some I don't understand, like replacing the charging handle.

But in truth I'm FREAKIN' ECSTATIC! They get my rifle on the 21st and on the 23rd this "raid" thing hits the air waves. I couldn't get hold of anyone for a few days and it started to look really ugly. It turned out the guy who does this stuff took a couple of days off. Since then, they pick up right away.

Go figure...here's hoping the rifle is well and truly fixed and that it all turns out well for Stag and their employees.

I still don't get the charging handle thing....maybe there was something screwed with it outside the jamming issue that I didn't notice.
 
Honestly, that's what I'd call great customer service. They did everything they had to do to ensure it was fixed. They replaced everything associated with feeding issues, and then some.

Of course, nothing matches Armscor, who gave me an entirely new 1911 in my choice of finish for a problem that wasn't even their own fault (the nickel finish was degrading because my body chemistry was incompatible with its copper base).

I think Stag Arms will survive. They may stop making lowers, or they'll reform under a new business license with new owners, but the name and company will endure.
 
Stag has over a 100 employees so by gun industry standards, they're a pretty big company. They make lowers and various other parts for quite a few other makers who then finish them off, build and brand them.

I think it would be a no brainer that someone would buy them but then there is that 1/2 million dollar fine hanging out there...That's a hard pill to swallow.

My wife is an accountant and when I told her what was going on with the rifle and why...she switched into bean counter mode. She said, "If they have sloppy records involving machine guns...what do their books look like?"
 
Keep the name of that gunsmith at Stag. From now on, whenever you have a problem with a Stag firearm, mail it back for service directly to him. :)

He did it right, IMHO.
 
Stag has over a 100 employees so by gun industry standards, they're a pretty big company. They make lowers and various other parts for quite a few other makers who then finish them off, build and brand them.

I think it would be a no brainer that someone would buy them but then there is that 1/2 million dollar fine hanging out there...That's a hard pill to swallow.

My wife is an accountant and when I told her what was going on with the rifle and why...she switched into bean counter mode. She said, "If they have sloppy records involving machine guns...what do their books look like?"
According to Stag what happened was they had an employee out on vacation who was responsible for engrvaing serial numbers. Then, when the inspector showed up a few weeks later and the serial numbers on the lowers still werent entered or engraved the truth came out. They were replacing lowers as they came in defective and had a stock of unengraved lowers to pull out of stock to re-use the serial numbers on. The inspector is the one who made up the criminal conspiracy thing. There were no machine guns involved. That was an allegation based on the inspectors "feelings" of what Stag was doing. It was sloppy but it wasnt criminal. OK. by the law what they were doing WAS criminal but they werent selling machine guns under the table.
 
Uh,..........mistimed receiver blank in the mill - nothing was bad until you tried to use it, then the worlds collided.
Glad it was repaired.
 
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