Deanimator
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+1.
As they said during WWII, "Was this trip necessary?"
32acp or 25acp?
- Thread starter justin22885
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As they said during WWII, "Was this trip necessary?"
justin22885
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well, it gets out of hand when i say 25 or a 32 and have people suggesting 327 federal, and 38 special.. if you want to whine and complain about some "trip around the barn" you can blame the people who suggested that crap.. or heck, the FN five seven suggestion.. because thats sooooooooooo along the lines of a 25acp or a 32.. or all the revolver suggestions after explicitly saying i wanted an auto, and one that could be suppressed
im not the one that took it from a 25 or 32 and made it into 327 federal revolvers and 5.7x28mm five-seven pistols
im not the one that took it from a 25 or 32 and made it into 327 federal revolvers and 5.7x28mm five-seven pistols
Deanimator
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Basically what you wanted was nonexistent at a price worth doing, which you were told early on.
Your justifications for what you wanted to do were dubious at best.
A .22lr or .22WMR was what you needed to begin with, and despite a lot of Heath Robinson talk, that's basically where you ended up.
springer99
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..........But it was a fun read!!...
Don't try to pass the blame off on others when you yourself were suggesting various wild cat cartridges from cut down 9mm or 5.7 brass
Why does it even matter how long the "trip around the barn" was anyway?
justin22885
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hmm, wait a moment, just did a bit of a cost-analysis on .25acp.. buying 100 rounds of loaded 25acp and then the costs for powder, primers, and bullets to load them another 400 times vs the cost of a 500 round brick of .22lr
if i cast the lead bullets the total for 500 rounds comes out to .078 cents a round.. and $0.174/rd if i include jacketed bullets in the cost.. the performance of which surpasses the hottest hyperperformance .22lr ammunition at only 2/3 the cost with jacketed bullets, and about 1/4 the price if i cast my own
so even when buying .25acp as a source of brass, the cartridge itself is so cheap to load taking up about $2 worth of gunpowder to reload 400 times that it does become significantly cheaper than .22lr with better performance (2 grains of powder charge, this means i can load 3,500 rounds of .25acp on a single pound of powder)
for 32acp, the cost of already loaded ammo as a source of brass, the price of primers and the price of jacketed bullets are all the same, the difference is over the 400 reloads the 32acp would cost me $1 more in powder.. so these rounds are still a heck of a lot cheaper than the higher performing 22s
if i cast the lead bullets the total for 500 rounds comes out to .078 cents a round.. and $0.174/rd if i include jacketed bullets in the cost.. the performance of which surpasses the hottest hyperperformance .22lr ammunition at only 2/3 the cost with jacketed bullets, and about 1/4 the price if i cast my own
so even when buying .25acp as a source of brass, the cartridge itself is so cheap to load taking up about $2 worth of gunpowder to reload 400 times that it does become significantly cheaper than .22lr with better performance (2 grains of powder charge, this means i can load 3,500 rounds of .25acp on a single pound of powder)
for 32acp, the cost of already loaded ammo as a source of brass, the price of primers and the price of jacketed bullets are all the same, the difference is over the 400 reloads the 32acp would cost me $1 more in powder.. so these rounds are still a heck of a lot cheaper than the higher performing 22s
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I am glad you can find 25 acp in aluminum cases these days. Paying for reloadable 25 acp brass is kind of a point of diminishing returns. I have never met anyone that actually reloads it, though you can certainly buy dies and brass and bullets.
There are also some exotic 32 cal Olympic type pistols out there. Walther's GSP comes to mind for use as a soft lead shooting auto loader.
There are also some exotic 32 cal Olympic type pistols out there. Walther's GSP comes to mind for use as a soft lead shooting auto loader.
Your cost analysis is flawed in that you have not accounted for case loss with 25 ACP or 32 ACP.
I don't shop hard for 22 LR but I am seeing it for 10 cents a round here and there. I'm sure it will continue to fall in the coming months.
Vern Humphrey
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That's about what I pay for my cast bullet loads with my .22 Hornet. I use a Pat Marlins Checkmaker to make gas checks out of coke cans and get my lead free in the form of wheelweights from my tire dealer, which holds costs way down. I get a cartridge that costs less them bulk pack .22 LR, but with 50% more velocity and better accuracy and reliability.
On the other hand, it's a lot of work. I'd like to get LEE to make one of their buckshot moulds, but this time for a .22 cast bullet -- wide flat nose, about 45 grains -- and cast two bullets, nose to nose, from each sprue in a 6-sprue mould.
justin22885
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hmm, could you actually load a .25acp with lead shot?.. like what if you got a couple sizes larger than necessary and sized it down so you have some surface area on the sides for the lips to grab onto it? that may be a lot cheaper than buying bullets while also offering a less labor intensive solution than casting
i notice some people use #4 shot loaded as a ball with the middle just a tad under the case mouth so it can be crimped over.. wonder if its possible to size a heavier ball down to size and create more of a bullet
i notice some people use #4 shot loaded as a ball with the middle just a tad under the case mouth so it can be crimped over.. wonder if its possible to size a heavier ball down to size and create more of a bullet
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chicharrones
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I'll read the whole thread later, but I choose .32 ACP over .25 ACP any day. I have two pocket .32 ACPs and wish I had some larger guns in the caliber. Maybe someday.
Vern Humphrey
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Yes, that's doable. I have a Hammond Game Getter, a "subcaliber device" which comes in a box about the size of a box of .30 caliber bullets. It includes a sizer, simply a disk with a tapered, highly polished hole, which I use to size 00 buckshot to shoot in my .30-06, using nail-setting blanks as the propellant.
Jim Watson
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Those are .32 S&W Long wadcutter guns, not .32 ACP.
They are popular in European target shooting because it is all done at 25 metres.
How many NRA shooters are using .32s at 50 yards? Not many.
justin22885
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you know, i could rebarrel a 25acp pistol for a longer barrel, better sights, but the grips are just so short and my hands are not, i just dont see how one could ever be used as a small game hunting pistol when theres really nothing to grab onto, and then the increased muzzle energy from a longer barrel tripling the kinetic energy will make it worse
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MICHAEL T
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I think this best idea and a older S&W revolver Better trigger on SA. Just better made all around .
No offense but I don't know why you would d--k with either of those calibers. Ammo is not easy to find, and neither of those calibers has any particular advantage. If you want small go .22 or even .22 Magnum; there are some good rounds for small game.
The only .32 I ever owned -- or would own -- was a Walther PP, and that was because it was a Walther PP. (I ended up selling it.)
The only .32 I ever owned -- or would own -- was a Walther PP, and that was because it was a Walther PP. (I ended up selling it.)
meanmrmustard
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justin22885
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what would even be the point of 9x18 when you can safely load a 380 hot enough to match or surpass it? more pistols in 380 than 9x18, and most those cheap ones in 9x18 are also available in 380, my favorite of which being the CZ82/83
anyway, the goal here is conservation of materials, using the least amount of lead and powder possible to still achieve sufficient ballistics for small game out of a pistol
anyway, the goal here is conservation of materials, using the least amount of lead and powder possible to still achieve sufficient ballistics for small game out of a pistol
meanmrmustard
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Then a 22 LR is probably your best bet.
Why try to justify a varmint /pest/ small game firearm chambered for anemic cartridges? If that is the ends to the means, then why not stick to a tried and true .22?
Why try to justify a varmint /pest/ small game firearm chambered for anemic cartridges? If that is the ends to the means, then why not stick to a tried and true .22?
thecarfarmer
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Primers at $.03 each
Brass at $.075 ($15 for a box of 50 rounds; i'd figure you'll average four reloads, accounting for loss, damage and wear)
Lead... Let's say you popped the wheel weights offa' the Rambler and melted 'em down
Powder at $.005 (3500 rounds out of a pound of Bullseye that you were lucky enough to find on a shelf for $17.50)
Eleven cents a push, and that's not taking into account buying a little Alox, or the odd round that doesn't come out right and wastes components. Or the purchase of loading dies, bullet moulds, etc.
Doesn't make economic sense to me.
Especially when a guy could get a lot of options with a .327 Mag revolver.
According to the ballistics101 site, the standard pressure 185 gr .45ACP Gold Dot has 453 lb/ft of energy; (+P loadings go 570-600) the 327 Fed Mag has 500.
But, I don't see any reason you couldn't load a light projectile in that case over a couple grains or so of Bullseye, and have a plinking/pest load... probably make a boss little round for a lever-action rifle, too. Like a 32-20 on steroids.
FWIW, I loaded up some 25 ACP last night, but I'm not going to try to justify my predilection towards 75-100 year old European mouseguns, or the 6.35mm cartridge as being anything other than a whim.
Bill
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Reloading 32 auto was one of the best reloading decisions I ever made. While I don't have the mold yet, I will definitely be casting 75 gr. bullets in the future. Even if you buy cast bullets the cost is super cheap. Even better - Starline makes 32 brass so you can buy it in bulk. I'd get a Beretta 81 FS Cheetah if I had the money. The Kel-tec is doable but not worth the hassle for your purposes. The Colt 1903 would be perfect if not for the sights but its not a bad choice. You might want to look at a used Bersa Thunder in 32 if you can find one. They don't cost much but give good sights in a medium frame gun with the option for single action work.
justin22885
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i was looking at the beretta bobcat with the tilting barrel, looking at the tilting barrel itself it wouldnt be all that hard to make up an extended length barrel for, say a 5" with a tang on top of the chamber for a more rearward rear sight (like on the browning buckmark).. i think if i go 25acp, making such a barrel with the sights for the bobcat would be the way to go
and of course this exact same thing can be done to a beretta tomcat in .32acp
and of course this exact same thing can be done to a beretta tomcat in .32acp
kBob
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IIRC Beretta used to offer the old 950 single action in .25ACP with a longer barrel and the front sight moved out to the end of the longer barrel.
There are buck shot loads for .32ACP......makes one wonder if #4 buck might work in the .25 ACP. Like the .32 Buck shot loads they would not likely cycle the action, or who knows.
-kBob
There are buck shot loads for .32ACP......makes one wonder if #4 buck might work in the .25 ACP. Like the .32 Buck shot loads they would not likely cycle the action, or who knows.
-kBob
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