No Way Out: Feds Stop Processing NICS Denial Appeals

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This applies to people that have failed a background check and the sale was denied. They are barred from legally purchasing a gun from a FFL.

Spoken like a registered Democrat.

As others have mentioned, there are many reasons people get delayed and even denied. I don't have hard numbers (nor will I ever bother to investigate) but it is far more common than you probably assume.

It is easy to dismiss these people because you probably view them as common criminals. NICS will deny anyone they can and sometimes that applies to people that do in fact have a legal right to purchase a firearm from an FFL.
 
She called me back and told me that her counterparts department had been told, "If it looks like you can not clear it in 3 days, then just mark DENIED"

This, if true, is at best a complete dereliction of duty by individuals within the department and at worst a conspiracy to deny American citizens their 2A rights. Denying a firearm purchase based on the Fed's inability to access information is not an option within the current law. This type of incompetence is precisely why the law is written as it is.

I see a lawsuit if this isn't remedied VERY soon.
 
This whole thing really sucks. I ordered a Glock 23 online on the 15th of last month, had it shipped to the dealer, then made my appointment for the 20th to come in for the background check. I got a delay on it, and the dealer emailed me the following day, telling me I was denied. It had to be shipped back, with me paying a 15% restocking fee. I filled out the form on the NICS site the same day, requesting an explanation of why I was denied. I have yet to receive that by the way. I already have my appeal ready, showing that I have no convictions and a false arrest that was disposed. I also have an application for a UPIN ready. However, hearing this discourages me a bit.

I was hoping to have a fast turnaround like this guy:

http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/index.php/t-773442.html

I previously owned a firearm, but had to sell it about 6 years ago due to financial reasons, so I currently do not own any at all. I am ready to own one again, but this doesn't sound good at all. I would like to try what Theohazard mentioned, but that wouldn't do any good since the firearm had to be shipped back. I have an application ready for my concealed gun license, purchased a IWB holster, and bought 2 boxes of ammo, yet I do not own what my rights guarantee. Looks like I am stuck in a hard place, which is very frustrating. Are there any better options for me?
Yes it sucks but, here's one more piece of free advice: unless you've already requested and received a copy of your FBI record, or received correspondence from the FBI that you have no record, don't assume you know the reason(s) for the deny. You are entitled to a copy of the record upon which they made their decision. Get it. It will cost you a stamp and a fingerprint fee. Then, and only then, will you know with certainty what the problem is, and how to solve it. And, this has nothing to do with a denied NICS check, you are entitled to it, period.

As I said, it's free advice, and maybe it's worth it. It's been my observation that criminal records systems are a bit like Hotel California; information checks in but never checks out.
 
Spoken like a registered Democrat.

As others have mentioned, there are many reasons people get delayed and even denied. I don't have hard numbers (nor will I ever bother to investigate) but it is far more common than you probably assume.

It is easy to dismiss these people because you probably view them as common criminals. NICS will deny anyone they can and sometimes that applies to people that do in fact have a legal right to purchase a firearm from an FFL.
That statement was in response to people that were confused and thought after 3 days these people would be able to complete the sale.

There are many ways someone could be denied due to an error. These people should get the chance to clear up that error. However, if there aren't enough people to do background checks and process appeals I would rather the people be focused on background checks. The solution is to add staff so that we can to both.
 
As soon as any politician says these words "we can work together to enact commonsense improvements" run, because it's their code word for confiscation.
 
That statement was in response to people that were confused and thought after 3 days these people would be able to complete the sale.

There are many ways someone could be denied due to an error. These people should get the chance to clear up that error. However, if there aren't enough people to do background checks and process appeals I would rather the people be focused on background checks. The solution is to add staff so that we can to both.
No.

The solution is to have the states run their own BC's. Some do already.

The way the system is setup now the FBI runs the NICS checks. They are obviously overwhelmed and can no longer comply with the law. As all NCIC records originate from state and local LE agencies that would be the logical place to do a BC. If you need to have a record expunged you will have contact the agency that put the record into NCIC anyway.

Any LEO can run an NCIC background check. They do it when they pull you over for a traffic violation or issue a CC permit. The ATF is just another useless federal agency that needs to be absorbed into the FBI and reorganized out of existence.
 
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No.

The solution is to have the states run their own BC's. Some do already.

The way the system is setup now the FBI runs the NICS checks. They are obviously overwhelmed and can no longer comply with the law. As all NCIC records originate from state and local LE agencies that would be the logical place to do a BC. If you need to have a record expunged you will have contact the agency that put the record into NCIC anyway.

Any LEO can run an NCIC background check. They do it when they pull you over for a traffic violation or issue a CC permit. The ATF is just another useless federal agency that needs to be absorbed into the FBI and reorganized out of existence.
Basic business fundamentals say it is more efficient to have 1 large department vs 50 small ones.
 
That may be true with respect to business, government is not business.

That makes no sense. If you believe that government is alway inefficient than it would be even for important to have 1 department instead of 50.
 
That makes no sense. If you believe that government is alway inefficient than it would be even for important to have 1 department instead of 50.
I didn't state any beliefs concerning efficiency. Business is motivated by profit, I'll leave it up to you to decide what you think motivates government.
 
Basic business fundamentals say it is more efficient to have 1 large department vs 50 small ones.

OK, let's hire hundreds more to staff the agency.

I honestly don't think congress is going to do that, do you?
 
OK, let's hire hundreds more to staff the agency.

I honestly don't think congress is going to do that, do you?
Why would either side be against staffing for background checks?

The reality is that new money may not be needed. Departments are allowed to move money around to fund the current priority.
 
"It's been my observation that criminal records systems are a bit like Hotel California; information checks in but never checks out."
Except for the NICS checks, of course ;). Yup, we covertly wire-tapped the whole freaking internet for months (if not still) along with everyone's phones, but those database pings get discarded immediately.

"Why would either side be against staffing for background checks?"
Because the ATF won't use the staff as we want them to. Think about it; they just reassigned personnel supposedly tasked with rehabilitating the rights of NICS denied folks to answering phone calls from gun stores or combing through NFA paperwork. Both of which are piling up in the first place since the ATF has been diverting its budget dollars to enforcement operations *cough* Fast and Furious which still isn't divulging information in violation of court order *cough* since at least the Reno administration. They only very recently took on new hands for the NFA applications group, and I don't think the Tech Branch side of things (the guys who approve/analyze design applications & answer stupid questions about arm braces) has changed in decades. The ATF had some brand new drones I read about recently, though.

A law to dump all collected NFA tax-dollars directly into ATF coffers while at the same time depriving them entirely of the spoils of raids, would do an enormous service towards redirecting their priorities from wannabe-Untouchables nonsense of dubious legality, to their stated purpose of tax collection.

TCB
 
Isn't it sad--this thread? If Americans had become and remained in charge of this country instead of being inattentive and lazy, which allowed infringers to infringe, we'd we talking about something good.
 
Why would either side be against staffing for background checks?

The reality is that new money may not be needed. Departments are allowed to move money around to fund the current priority.

Sequestration (budget cuts).

According to several reports last year they aren't going to be funded at previous levels. They can move all the money around they want and somewhere a job that was previously staffed will no longer be staffed. Let's forget about counter terrorism so we can run background checks on people they just cleared two weeks ago. Makes perfect sense to me. :( Typical federal gov't waste. In some states a CWP is all you need to buy a firearm. Gawd, what a novel idea.

http://www.ibtimes.com/fbi-said-fed...tration-were-equivalent-shutting-down-1967312
 
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I think there's some other threads on this topic floating around. Definitely scary stuff. Thousands of people being denied their Constitutional Rights..
So, in January I went to purchase a handgun at a gun show. I have a DWI from 21 years ago, the crime was never was punishable by more then 3 months. I have a valid permit to purchase from the State of Minnesota, where I received the DWI.(nothing else on my record) The FFL at the show is from a city that is 100+ miles from me, so I do not know them and thus omitted my SS# from the form, I will never give my SS# to a stranger. The check comes back delayed. WTH I think, they told me could take three days, as I pointed out, they are three hours away from me, so the option for the three days wait will not happen. Knowing that, I contacted my local store, where I have purchased before and that same day, I went to purchase the same gun, although 50 bucks more expensive, but the cost to drive 6 hours easily offset this cost. Delayed once again, two days later denied!! I started the appeal process by filing out the form online with my NTN#, the form has a box that you check that requests the reason for the denial. 7 days later I get a letter from the Appeal. They listed every reason that I could have been denied, but no specific reason why. NOTHING.....they cannot give me a reason. Ok, so I have started the process, I fingerprinted and sent the letter to the Appeal Board. I am so pissed right now, I am denied but you cannot give me a reason? Now I have to sit in LALA Land waiting for them to run all of this, while my Right to Own a gun is being denied? I have guns, no one has shown up to collect them, I am not a criminal. This is nonsense. I think the Government is delaying anyone they can. Anyone else run the appeal process and get the generic letter stating every reason you could have been denied without giving you the reason you were denied?
 
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7 days later I get a letter from the Appeal. They listed every reason that I could have been denied, but no specific reason why. NOTHING.....they cannot give me a reason. Ok, so I have started the process, I fingerprinted and sent the letter to the Appeal Board. I am so pissed right now, I am denied but you cannot give me a reason?

While I'm sure this will not make you un-pissed, their is a reason for them giving you the boiler plate list of reasons why you might have been denied instead of specific reasons. They denied a person who happened to very closely match you. The only information they have to base their decision on is what you furnished them with on form 4473. They cannot give you information as to why you are prohibited when they don't know yet if the person they denied is actually you. Once they receive your fingerprints they will then know for certain if their denial was correct (according to their records) and provide you with a more specific reason why you were denied, or they'll send you a letter saying you are good to go.
 
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I believe that the 5 day rule is only for people that receive a "pending" reply from the check system, and this is pertaining to people that get a "denied" reply.
People that receive a "Delay", it is up to the FFL if they wish to transfer the firearm IF they have not heard back from NICS in THREE business days. Stores like Walmart, Rural King, Dick's, will not transfer the firearm unless they get a "Proceed". If someone receives a "Deny", the FFL cannot release the firearm at all to the purchaser unless NICS calls back and gives them a "Proceed".
 
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