Captcurt
Member
I'm with you. I have more handguns than that.I like to think of myself as a "Super Duper" gun owner.
Article - New Term: 'Super Owner'
- Thread starter Aim1
- Start date
- Status
Deanimator
Member
I'm sure that's what he was hoping for. He seems downright disappointed that's not what he got.RX, are you trying to bait people into advocating for violent action so they can get an account warning/lock?
He seems disappointed that I'm not willing to look at things from Josh Sugarman's point of view too.
But then I was never inclined to see things from Jerry Sandusky's or Osama bin Laden's points of view either.
danez71
Member
You know.....
Once they get the term to stick, they will further the demonizing of it.... then, try to ban it.
Assault weapons....
Ghost guns......
Super Owners.... limit, one per customer.
Once they get the term to stick, they will further the demonizing of it.... then, try to ban it.
Assault weapons....
Ghost guns......
Super Owners.... limit, one per customer.
Deanimator
Member
Put me down for one! It ought to send them into eye bleeding rage.
One thing I've noticed about anti-gun cultists for literally decades is that if you know the right buttons to push, they'll say all KINDS of things, as they say on "Law & Order", "against penal interest". It's hilarious to watch them try to deny, then explain them away.
Carl N. Brown
Member
Post #94
tmoore912
The link got ....ed when you copied it and does not work.
On the original, right select "Copy shortcut", then paste.
tmoore912
The link got ....ed when you copied it and does not work.
On the original, right select "Copy shortcut", then paste.
Carl N. Brown
Member
I followed the link in the The Guardian article on the claim that "super-owners" (17+ guns each) are 3% of American adults, to the The Guardian article on the survey, to the The Trace article on the survey. The Guardian and The Trace tout the results (or their spin on the results) but make it hard to suss out the name of the survey and who did it.
That's the Harvard/Northeastern survey of 2015 "The Stock and Flow of US Firearms: Results from the 2015 National Firearm Survey." David Hemenway (Harvard Injury Control Research Center) and Deb Azrael of Harvard were on board.
2015 National Firearm Survey is billed as the followup to the 1994 National Survey on Private Ownership and use of Firearms (NSPOF). NSPOF is the survey that gave us the famous stat that:
60% of gun acquisitions are from retail sources
_ 43% Gun store
_ 11% Other store (department store, gunshow, flea market, etc)
_ 6% Pawnshop
40% of gun acquisitions are from non-retail sources
_ 19% gift from family or friends
_ 13% private sales
_ 5% inheritances
_ 3% swaps or trades
The 1994 NSPOF "40%" was spun in the media in 2011-2012 as 40% of guns are bought from dealers at gun shows without background checks.
I expect the same from politicians and media using this new survey.
"3% Super-owner" will be the new "40% dealers w/o BC" talking point.
Like 1994 NSPOF which used non-institutionalized adults living in home with telephones, 2015 NFS (whatever their new improved sample method turns out to be) is a survey of ordinary legal gun owners -- who owns guns legally, how they acquire them, what they do with them, etc.
If it were a survey to show what do do about criminal gun violence, they would go with the Bureau of Justice Statistics Firearms Use by Offenders surveys of prison inmates, which asks inmates whose last offense included carrying or using a gun (firearms using offenders), where they got their guns.*
On this new survey Daniel Webster gun violence researcher at Johns Hopkins: "What people do with their guns, who has them, how they obtain them -- these are all behaviors that are very relevant to gun violence."
Again, what is most worrisome to people is criminal gun violence. What does a survey of the general gun-owning public tell you about what criminals do with their guns, which criminals have them, how they obtain them? If that was the goal, one would have used the BJS FUO inmate surveys conducted every six/seven years or so. In my not so humble opinion, based on 50 years bombardment from gun controllers' rhetoric, the goal is not to control firearms using criminals; it is to control gun owning citizens. 2015 NFS will be used like the NSPOF survey before it: policy to control legal ownership by the law abiding with no impact on crime -- see the CDC 2003 and NRC 2004 reviews of research on impact of gun policy on crime. (I do read the newspapers: the local murderers who killed with gun. rock, hammer, knife, baseball bat had more incommon with each other than the local gun murderers had in common with local gun owners. To those obsessed with gun violence, non-gun violence is a non-concern when, violence should be the focus, not guns or lawabiding gun owners.)
"It is undergoing peer review, and a summary will be posted by the Russell Sage Foundation next year." - The Trace. In the meantime it has been released in pre-academic referee draft form to The Guardian, The Trace, et al. and will be spun in the name of gun politics.
Be on the look out for:
2015 National Firearm Survey
Russell Sage Foundation
when it is released after academic peer-review. Comparison of the actual results with media smears and political posturing supposedly based on it may prove to be interesting.
________________________________
* Bureau of Justice Statistics Firearms Use by Offenders
Firearms Using Offenders (inmates who carried or used a firearm in the offense for which they were imprisoned)
2004 Source of firearms
11.3% Retail Purchase or trade
_ 7.3 - Retail store
_ 2.6 - Pawnshop
_ 0.6 - Flea market
_ 0.8 - Gun show
37.4% Family or friend*
_ 12.2 - Purchased or traded
_ 14.1 - Rented or borrowed
_ 11.1 - Other
40.0% Street/illegal source
_ 7.5 - Theft or burglary
_ 25.2 - Drug dealer/off street
_ 7.4 - Fence/black market
11.2% Other sources
Quite not like the NSPOF survey of non-institutionalized adults (firearms-owning law-abiding citizens).
* CNB note: Friend or family of a state prison inmate who is a Firearms Using Offender are often criminals themselves or at least aid, abet or associate with a criminal.
That's the Harvard/Northeastern survey of 2015 "The Stock and Flow of US Firearms: Results from the 2015 National Firearm Survey." David Hemenway (Harvard Injury Control Research Center) and Deb Azrael of Harvard were on board.
2015 National Firearm Survey is billed as the followup to the 1994 National Survey on Private Ownership and use of Firearms (NSPOF). NSPOF is the survey that gave us the famous stat that:
60% of gun acquisitions are from retail sources
_ 43% Gun store
_ 11% Other store (department store, gunshow, flea market, etc)
_ 6% Pawnshop
40% of gun acquisitions are from non-retail sources
_ 19% gift from family or friends
_ 13% private sales
_ 5% inheritances
_ 3% swaps or trades
The 1994 NSPOF "40%" was spun in the media in 2011-2012 as 40% of guns are bought from dealers at gun shows without background checks.
I expect the same from politicians and media using this new survey.
"3% Super-owner" will be the new "40% dealers w/o BC" talking point.
Like 1994 NSPOF which used non-institutionalized adults living in home with telephones, 2015 NFS (whatever their new improved sample method turns out to be) is a survey of ordinary legal gun owners -- who owns guns legally, how they acquire them, what they do with them, etc.
If it were a survey to show what do do about criminal gun violence, they would go with the Bureau of Justice Statistics Firearms Use by Offenders surveys of prison inmates, which asks inmates whose last offense included carrying or using a gun (firearms using offenders), where they got their guns.*
On this new survey Daniel Webster gun violence researcher at Johns Hopkins: "What people do with their guns, who has them, how they obtain them -- these are all behaviors that are very relevant to gun violence."
Again, what is most worrisome to people is criminal gun violence. What does a survey of the general gun-owning public tell you about what criminals do with their guns, which criminals have them, how they obtain them? If that was the goal, one would have used the BJS FUO inmate surveys conducted every six/seven years or so. In my not so humble opinion, based on 50 years bombardment from gun controllers' rhetoric, the goal is not to control firearms using criminals; it is to control gun owning citizens. 2015 NFS will be used like the NSPOF survey before it: policy to control legal ownership by the law abiding with no impact on crime -- see the CDC 2003 and NRC 2004 reviews of research on impact of gun policy on crime. (I do read the newspapers: the local murderers who killed with gun. rock, hammer, knife, baseball bat had more incommon with each other than the local gun murderers had in common with local gun owners. To those obsessed with gun violence, non-gun violence is a non-concern when, violence should be the focus, not guns or lawabiding gun owners.)
"It is undergoing peer review, and a summary will be posted by the Russell Sage Foundation next year." - The Trace. In the meantime it has been released in pre-academic referee draft form to The Guardian, The Trace, et al. and will be spun in the name of gun politics.
Be on the look out for:
2015 National Firearm Survey
Russell Sage Foundation
when it is released after academic peer-review. Comparison of the actual results with media smears and political posturing supposedly based on it may prove to be interesting.
________________________________
* Bureau of Justice Statistics Firearms Use by Offenders
Firearms Using Offenders (inmates who carried or used a firearm in the offense for which they were imprisoned)
2004 Source of firearms
11.3% Retail Purchase or trade
_ 7.3 - Retail store
_ 2.6 - Pawnshop
_ 0.6 - Flea market
_ 0.8 - Gun show
37.4% Family or friend*
_ 12.2 - Purchased or traded
_ 14.1 - Rented or borrowed
_ 11.1 - Other
40.0% Street/illegal source
_ 7.5 - Theft or burglary
_ 25.2 - Drug dealer/off street
_ 7.4 - Fence/black market
11.2% Other sources
Quite not like the NSPOF survey of non-institutionalized adults (firearms-owning law-abiding citizens).
* CNB note: Friend or family of a state prison inmate who is a Firearms Using Offender are often criminals themselves or at least aid, abet or associate with a criminal.
Last edited:
ColoradoShooter77
Member
I'm only at 14 guns, so I still have work to do, lol.
splattergun
Member
I'm not quite Super yet, but I have high hopes. After all, what is life without goals?
Carl N. Brown
Member
I am 68 years old. My father took me to the mountains when I was six and taught me the basics of gun safety plinking at the old family home place. Trips to the mountain often including target practice. I was gifted a .22 rifle when I was fifteen. On trips to the mountain I hunted with Uncle Ed and his dog Henry. At eighteen I bought a 7mm Chilean Mauser at Sears from one of my first pay checks. When folks thought of gifts, they knew I didn't like ties; if someone had an old gun they didn't want, they knew who liked guns. My kids still treasure memories of me taking them to target practice on the mountain or at a abandoned rock quarry. I joined the local gun club and participated in matches: .22 silhouette, muzzleloading rifle, black powder cartridge rifle and pistol, modern and vintage military rifle and pistol. I have accumulated forty-two working guns, five wall-hangers, and two Orion flare guns.
theotherwaldo
Member
-They're just trying to create/identify another unprotected minority that they can deplore and attack in the court of public opinion.
Only three percent! Perfect - they can't possibly defend themselves!!
Only three percent! Perfect - they can't possibly defend themselves!!
Deanimator
Member
I passed seventeen handguns alone, YEARS ago!
It makes the anti-gun cultists sad!
theotherwaldo
Member
I passed 17 calibers long ago.
Tony50ae
Member
Guess I am a super owner too! Took me 16 years to get there. Somehow I don't believe only 3 percent though.
tmoore912
Member
Carl N. Brown
Sorry about the Zogby Poll results link. I fixed it.
http://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...tic-and-international-concerns-300041108.html
Sorry about the Zogby Poll results link. I fixed it.
http://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...tic-and-international-concerns-300041108.html
Did you read the Zogby post right after mine? Sound like I was spot on. Why wouldn't you counter a stupid poll with a better one?
Huh? I don't know how you came to that conclusion. Whether it is self defense, an expression of rights as a free people or anything else, you actually have to go out in the world and make that case, not just sit around with people that already agree with you and nod at Fox and Friends. The Declarations! made on this or any other gun forum are hilariously pretentious and completely wasted choir preaching.
You had better hope that you're wrong. Every election and every product add campaign is designed to make the largely undecided people and the dis-enamored. You don't need to sell Twinkies to people eating themselves to death or the Republican candidate to extreme right-wingers. You're selling to those who don't have a strong opinion or those who have waffled. Not everyone has emotions related to guns, but they can develop an opinion when they see a terrorist shoot up a school, or a kid shoot up a school.
And it doesn't have to be a horde of people. Elections are decided by 1 or 2%. But it is gun myopia that makes gun people think everyone else thinks about and cares about guns. Quite a few people just don't care at all.
No. Not even a little bit. I keep trying to make a point to people that having the world's strongest opinion doesn't actually translate into change in the world. Even writing in the very important comments section on a news website or youtube video.
Thanks for putting your important thoughts in the comments section. Very impressive work you're doing.
Curator
Member
Do they have a category for an ultra-mega, super-duper, gi-norous, giga-nomic firearms collector/hoarder/accumulator? Not me, just asking.
Twiki357
Member
I guess that I’m pretty super. Not going to say how far I am past 17 guns, but I have more than 17 calibers.
Desolo
Member
I'm not a super owner.
But I'll fix that in a couple weeks.
But I'll fix that in a couple weeks.
Bobson
Member
Idk if I'm crazy for thinking this is nothing more than a way to make gun owners look like weirdo zealots who should (and easily could) be disarmed "for the safety of the rest of Americans," or if the vast majority of the other ~120 respondents are crazy because they seem to think this is a humorous joke worth giggling over.
How they gonna disarm us when they pointed out that we have more than half the nation's guns?
More importantly, they asserted that you're a ridiculously tiny minority of the country. How many guns you gonna be fighting with at any given moment? You can be a super-duper-mega-ultra-owner and the other XX number of your guns are all worthless.
Yeah but they're wrong, gun owners are actually a much larger number than that; likely even a majority population of the country.
If the average American can become convinced that "super owners" shouldn't own guns anymore, and believes that only 3% of the population fits into that group, do you think it matters? You know who else is a comparably tiny minority with enormous numbers of arms and resources? The world's terrorist groups and fanatical organizations. How long before that leap in logic gets made by the media?
This is propaganda in the most classic sense. It's gonna bolster the idea that the enemy (you) has enormous resources but few reinforcements. Thus, if everyone works together, they can quickly eliminate the threat. It'll be easy to keep them motivated by talking about how quickly they're making progress, even if they aren't.
Buckle up. In the meantime, keep lollerskating about the foolishness of the news, and patting yourself on the back for your achievement in amassing material possessions.
How they gonna disarm us when they pointed out that we have more than half the nation's guns?
More importantly, they asserted that you're a ridiculously tiny minority of the country. How many guns you gonna be fighting with at any given moment? You can be a super-duper-mega-ultra-owner and the other XX number of your guns are all worthless.
Yeah but they're wrong, gun owners are actually a much larger number than that; likely even a majority population of the country.
If the average American can become convinced that "super owners" shouldn't own guns anymore, and believes that only 3% of the population fits into that group, do you think it matters? You know who else is a comparably tiny minority with enormous numbers of arms and resources? The world's terrorist groups and fanatical organizations. How long before that leap in logic gets made by the media?
This is propaganda in the most classic sense. It's gonna bolster the idea that the enemy (you) has enormous resources but few reinforcements. Thus, if everyone works together, they can quickly eliminate the threat. It'll be easy to keep them motivated by talking about how quickly they're making progress, even if they aren't.
Buckle up. In the meantime, keep lollerskating about the foolishness of the news, and patting yourself on the back for your achievement in amassing material possessions.
Last edited:
pockets
Member
On the other hand, it probably won't be long now until some company introduces the limited run 'Super Owner Edition' rifle or handgun.
Or perhaps the limited edition 'Super Owner Starter Collection': 17 guns in a display box.
.
Or perhaps the limited edition 'Super Owner Starter Collection': 17 guns in a display box.
.
I've read a few articles based on this "study." I put that word in quotes because every article I've read points out that this is an "unpublished survey by Harvard and Northeastern" which was "obtained exclusively by the Guardian and the Trace." From the Guardian:
)
Anybody else find it odd (or perhaps telling) that an "unpublished survey obtained exclusively by the Guardian and the Trace" (a Michael Bloomberg production) is getting so much press? (Almost makes you wonder if there's a media conspiracy against gun owners . . .The Guardian said:
)- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
- Locked
