Any info on this cap/ball "navy" would be helpful.

I can't help you much, but the ELG in the Oval with the crown on the cylinder in picture nine, is a Belgian
Proof mark.

The capital letter 'A' with a star above it is a Belgian Inspectors mark and the ELG inside the crown is a Belgium Liege Proof House mark beginning in 1893 that on barrels of muzzleloading guns that has passed a re-enforced black powder proof.

The Belgium inspector's mark of a star over the capital letter 'A' began with Woit Nicolas Cominoto in 1911, but 2 more inspectors have used that mark also dating through 1974. So not much help there on dates.

There isn't a mark or stamp on there that I can find that can narrow down the date this revolver was manufactured. As for the inspector's mark we have that the earliest date as 1911.

That crown over the 'R' is another Belgium proof mark for rifled barrels 1884 through Feb. 26, 1968 (sideways). Pistols made after February 1968 to 1973 do not have these marks.

Another Belgium proof mark however.

I don't know but that's a possibility. But I can't find any Turkish marks, proof or other stamps, on this revolver other than the name "Constantinople." But it is possible that another country can send their firearms to another country to have them proofed. Because there is a specific stamp that designates guns that is not made in Belgium by countries that use proofs that is not recognized by the Belgian Proof House. The mark is applied after the gun has passed the Belgian proof. But I can't find that mark. But sometimes marks are not visible because they were struck so lightly you cannot pick them up.

If it was made in Belgium there should be a 'date stamp' on there somewhere. Possibly on top of the barrel?

Could the proof markings be bogus? Kind of like the markings you find on Khyber Pass guns where they reproduced what markings were on the pattern gun they copied...but sometimes don't get them quite right which leads to hilarity with backwards letters, misspellings and such.

I don't know anything about it, but thank you for sharing it with us.

I think it looks neat as all get out.

-kBob

Could this be the oldest "repro" cap and ball revolver ever??

I'm sorry I can't help with the gun either but thanks for posting.
Is it the camera lens or some effect of perspective; the cylinder on that looks either unusually skinny, or somewhat longer than the standard cylinder on the 1851? ?
I also notice that the area around the forcing cone does not match the standard "Colt" model as found on Uberti, and somewhat less accuratly on Pietta revolvers.
However, it is truly an interesting specimen.

Tommygunn said:

I'm sorry I can't help with the gun either but thanks for posting.
Is it the camera lens or some effect of perspective; the cylinder on that looks either unusually skinny, or somewhat longer than the standard cylinder on the 1851? ?
I also notice that the area around the forcing cone does not match the standard "Colt" model as found on Uberti, and somewhat less accuratly on Pietta revolvers.
However, it is truly an interesting specimen.

Click to expand...

I can see a ton of non-Colt's design cues.

If that cylinder is that long in respect to the rest of the revolver, think how much powder you could pack behind a .36 cal. ball!

Here is a link to the Topkapi Palace Museum Arms and Weapons department. Their firearms exhibit was really cool. Maybe a curator there could help.

http://topkapisarayi.gov.tr/en/content/arms-and-weapons

This is a rather poor Belgian copy of a Colt. "M.N. Aramian & Co." was the importing agent. This would have been imported into Turkey prior to WW1, when commerce between Belgium and Turkey was cut off. The use of "Constantinople" certainly dates it before 1922, when the nomenclature was officially changed to "Istanbul." After 1915, an Armenian company -- especially an Armenian company dealing in arms -- would have been in a precarious position in Turkey.

The .35 caliber Navy revolver with the bone grips and crossed key marks appears to be the same type described in an article in The Gun Report from May 1986. Also on p.140 of The Book of Colt Firearms by R.L. Wilson and R.Q. Sutherland, described as a "Brooklyn Bridge" revolver because of the cylinder scene.
Made by gunmaker Antoine Masereel of Liege, Belgium - thus the Belgian proofs. LINK - scroll down to "Masereel Revolvers Colts de Marine a Pistons" catalog page & following photos.
Apparently yours was marked for the Turkish market. Called a "piston revolver", presumably referring to the action of the loading lever.
Also sold by Adolf Frank Export Company (ALFA) of Germany. ALFA was the European equivalent of Francis Bannerman & Sons in the US. Shown below is part of the 1911 Adolf Frank catalog describing these pistols.



It was the first 20th century copy of a Colt cap and ball revolver.

I wish there were some way we could see the cylinder engraving as a flat banner like some of the Colt cylinder art is displayed.

Anyone know what bridge and harbor that is and is that a steam locomotive on the bridge.

I think a sticky of cylinder art might be a neat thing. Imagine not only banners of the colt cylinders but also Bacon and Manhatten and stuff like this.

Imagine making acid etching stencils to use on your plain cylindered Italian replicas just for giggles. Fifty years from now collectors would be all up in arms about the ASM copy of a rare Turkish copy of a Belgian Colt with brass frame and .44 cal.

There are some that insist that the 1851 Navy was a result of the Austrians modifying a dragoon they were authorized to manufacture to make a belt gun. I understand it had a long cylinder. It was issued to navy officers in a neat boxed kit. Perhaps this is modeled after that as the Turks would certainly have had contact with the Austro-Hungarian Empire's navy.

-kBob

berkley said:

the .35 caliber navy revolver with the bone grips and crossed key marks appears to be the same type described in an article in the gun report from may 1986. Also on p.140 of the book of colt firearms by r.l. Wilson and r.q. Sutherland, described as a "brooklyn bridge" revolver because of the cylinder scene.
Made by gunmaker antoine masereel of liege, belgium - thus the belgian proofs. link - scroll down to "masereel revolvers colts de marine a pistons" catalog page & following photos.
Apparently yours was marked for the turkish market. Called a "piston revolver", presumably referring to the action of the loading lever.
Also sold by adolf frank export company (alfa) of germany. Alfa was the european equivalent of francis bannerman & sons in the us. Shown below is part of the 1911 adolf frank catalog describing these pistols.



it was the first 20th century copy of a colt cap and ball revolver.

Click to expand...

I knew it!!! I am the winner!!!!!

Not quite. Lol!!
That's not a copy of a '51 Navy. The OPs is a 5 shot, the Navy is a 6 shot (that's why the cylinder looks out of proportion).
It appears to be a copy of a '62 police type or such. I don't know much about the little revolvers but it's definitely not a Navy.


Mike
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