Very casual pistol sale

Weird.

Did this person look like a rat or an undercover cop?

tuckerdog1 said:

I suppose an undercover cop could look like most anything. But no, he was just a nice guy. Drove an upscale car, and during our short conversation, just seemed like another gun guy. He did say he was in a hurry to make it to his son's game.

Tuckerdog1

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Hmmm... well good luck. He most likely planted a tracking beacon on your vehicle and tomorrow morning you're going to wake up in a bath of ice water with a scare where his goons took out your kidneys to sell them on the black market!

Just kidding, I'm sure it's fine.

Casual sale, sure maybe.

But "non sketchy" I don't know. How did he know there was even anything in the box? You could've just as easily put some gravel or something else in there to simulate weight.

Seem's really weird to me that he would not even look at the fire arm.


Hopefully all is well....

A distracted man. Sons game important to him. Nothing for you to worry about in any case. You did just fine.

tuckerdog1 said:

Over the years, I've done quite a few private party gun sales. Today, had something new happen. Went through all the usual procedures. Met the buyer at a public location. He showed me his carry permit, so I knew he was legal to buy the gun. completed a bill of sale ( not required, but I like to do that ). He handed me the cash. I handed him the box with the pistol and asked if he'd like to inspect it before we parted ways. He not only said "No", but he didn't even take the top off the box to look at it. Just tossed the box in the back seat & thanked me. I've never had somebody buy a gun from me and not at least LOOK at it.

Tuckerdog1

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For some people the price of a gun isn't a big deal and they might rather just take their chances rather than be inspecting a firearm in a parking lot somewhere. He probably felt that he could trust you at that point.

I've had people wire me funds to buy a car without having driven it or even seen it. I had a sophomore in college call his dad in Hawaii to have him wire me $59K for a BMW M3, then a few days after I had the funds in my bank account he asked me to drive the car 45 miles to the house of an acquaintance and leave it there. The kid had never even seen the car, just relied on my description of the condition and everything about it. And I'm just an individual, not a dealer, mind you.

Some people are trusting, and some people are trustworthy. You know where you fit in here.

I am lazy. It is so much less work to trust people than not to.

I think you did fine. You did get your money before he hurried away. As long as you only gave a tail light warranty he doesn't have a reason to come back. You have his information so you know where he lives. Go buy another firearm, shoot it and enjoy yourself.

The price of a gun is pocket change to some people. He probably didn't want to cause a stir by pulling it out of the box in public.

I would assume that anyone selling a gun to me would assume himself that I'd check to make sure it at least exists before I left the sale. This guy probably felt the same.

Still, I would personally check it, if only to make sure the seller at least put the right gun in the box. I'd be as much watching out for innocent mistakes as for someone trying to dupe me.

My take isn't that he's a LEO instead it's either a straw purchase or he'll sell it on the street to a thug. Hope that bill-of-sale don't come back to bite you.

huntsman said:

Hope that bill-of-sale don't come back to bite you.

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Why would it? He did everything by the book as per FTF sales. If it ends up being a throwaway gun used in a crime, the bill of sale would be a plus.

I had a fairly casual transaction this weekend myself.
However it was a trade and we did both look in the box.

No CHLs shown, no bills of sale.
We looked at each others gun, agreed to the deal, shook hands and went our separate ways.

buck460XVR said:

Why would it? He did everything by the book as per FTF sales. If it ends up being a throwaway gun used in a crime, the bill of sale would be a plus.

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On another Forum in a discussion about FTF sales the idea that a bill of sale is an admission of sale and puts the burden on the seller to prove that he did the due diligence for the sale.

He might have been a little uneasy about opening the box and flashing the gun in a public place. Somebody sees, calls the constabulary, and then it gets complicated. Some people are more worried about that than getting ripped off

A bit different -- we had agreed on the price and I had the money folded over in my shirt pocket. I gave it to him and he stuffs it in his pocket... I said to him Trust but verify, he looked up at me and I said -- Suppose something falls out of your pocket, you may think I under paid you...
Counting, looking protects both of us.

I always check it over. I inspected an AK in a Walmart parking lot in broad daylight. I'd rather explain to the cops that I'm involved in a legal FTF sale than get taken on a gun without a bolt, like one of my wife's uncles did.

Still though he probably figured after all the time you spoke and you asked for a bill of sale that you were on the level.

huntsman said:

On another Forum in a discussion about FTF sales the idea that a bill of sale is an admission of sale and puts the burden on the seller to prove that he did the due diligence for the sale.

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The due diligence was to make sure the person he sold the gun to was not prohibited from owning a firearm. This was verified by the guys carry permit. It most states all you need to do is ask the person if they are prohibited or not.

^ looking at a CHL only proves the purchaser qualified at one time, what if the state is slow to revoke?

When you go beyond what the law requires (what a reasonable person does) could that be considered suspicion or your part?

These are questions that I have about needing to see ID, it seems to me if you just ask the 2 questions you are taking the purchaser at his word and that meets the law requirement, it's not your fault if he lies.

My guess would be that he wasn't very confident in his ability to handle a firearm. It might have been his first purchase and felt silly looking at it when he didn't know himself what he was looking for.

I remember when I bought my first pistol I pinched my finger when I closed the slide... I tried to play it off like nothing happened and don't know if anyone noticed but it hurt haha! Embarrassing!

Was this sale the result of an online listing? If so, the buyer may have committed to the sale before this meeting took place, and the meeting is really just a "delivery," of both funds and merchandise. No reason to peruse the gun in public because there's no going back on the deal anyway.

I have done this: bought a gun through a Gunbroker auction but actually picked it up in person from the seller and made payment at that time. I considered it a done deal from the moment I clicked the mouse to buy the gun, and would have assumed the risk of unsatisfactory goods, etc.

OTOH, there is something to be said for making sure there's actually something in the box. I once bought a Beretta shotgun on sale at a Gander Mountain store. I opened the box and saw that the barrel was in a separate box inside. I jokingly said to the sales clerk, "There's a barrel in there, right?" We both laughed a bit. I wasn't laughing when I got home and went to put the gun together. There was a barrel in there, all right -- it just didn't have a bead on it. I turned that box inside out. There was no bead anywhere. Fortunately they made it right for me when I took it back to the store -- no "ship it back to Beretta" or any such nonsense.

buck460XVR said:

The due diligence was to make sure the person he sold the gun to was not prohibited from owning a firearm. This was verified by the guys carry permit. It most states all you need to do is ask the person if they are prohibited or not.

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I don't think you are required to ask if they are prohibited or not. The laws I am aware of require that you not have reason to believe they are a prohibited person, no requirement to ask. Besides, if a prohibited person were trying to buy a gun, are they going to say "yes I'm prohibited"?

I still personally believe it is good practice to, at absolute minimum, look at a current valid gov't issue photo ID verifying their state of residence. An additional item that verifies they, at some point, probably relatively recently, were legally able to possess a firearm, doesn't hurt either (weapon/carry license, maybe receipt for a firearm from an FFL, IDK what else)