Are there any truly non-corrosive BP substitutes?

entropy said:

Geez, you guys are leaning towards needing to be a chemist to clean a BP gun. What happened to hot water and Dawn? That's all I used for years, before I worked in a shop as a smith and was spoiled by T/C #13.....

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Howdy

The word HOT is the difference. I have been using Murphy's Mix (equal parts Murphy's Oil Soap, Rubbing Alcohol, and drugstore Hydrogen Peroxide) for about ten years now to clean my guns after a CAS match. The beauty of Murphy's Mix is it can be used cold, does not need to be heated. So cleaning can be done anywhere, at the range, or at home. The other beauty is, as stated, when the alcohol and water evaporate, the Murphy's Oil Soap leaves behind an oily residue that coats the steel preventing corrosion. When cleaning my revolvers, rifle, and shotgun after a match I always squirt a liberal amount of M Mix down inside the mechanism of the guns. I do not tear the guns apart completely to remove every speck of BP fouling. BP fouling remaining down inside the lockwork gets coated with M Mix, and when it dries the oily coating prevents atmospheric oxygen from reaching the steel. Every year or two I tear down my pistols, rifle and shotgun to remove all the black, oily guck down inside. There is always plenty of guck, but there is no rust because the oil protected the steel.

Regarding Per Oxide causing steel to corrode, of course it will in sufficient concentration. But the concentration of H2O2 in drugstore Hydrogen Per Oxide is very low, usually only 3%. On top of that, when it is mixed in equal quantities with the other two ingredients, the concentration goes down to about 1%. That is not going to corrode anything. I have been using this stuff for ten years, and I would have seen it by now if it was going to corrode anything. As a matter of fact, a bunch of years ago I did a little test. I submerged a piece of steel in a dish of M Mix and left it there a few days until the M Mix had completely evaporated. There was no rust on the steel. In fact, all the Peroxide does is create a little bit of fizzing action to help lift any stubborn fouling.

Everybody knows that hot water is a great way to remove BP fouling. In fact, it is the water in the Per Oxide and the Alcohol in M Mix that does the dissolving of BP fouling. The alcohol makes the water evaporate more quickly, the Per Oxide provides a little fizz, and the oil soap leaves the oil coating behind.

One more beauty of M Mix. You don't have to remove it. Just leave it in there. Back when I used to shoot a lot of Cap & Ball I tried everything under the sun to get the water out again. Q-Tips in the nooks and crannies of a C&B cylinder was a pain in the neck. Yes, I tried heating the guns in a low oven, and yes, I tried using scalding hot water, to heat the steel so the water would evaporate quickly. In both cases I got flash rust.

Murphy's Mix is so simple. You don't need to be a chemist, you buy the ingredients at the super market. You swab the gun off liberally inside and out, and you make no effort at all to remove the stuff from inside. A couple of patches through the bore and the chambers will remove the Mix, then I follow up with a patch soaked with Ballistol to leave a nice coating of oil in the bore and chambers. Takes about five minutes to do a cartridge revolver.

Every so often I'll gut my revolver and clean it completely.

With the exception of BH 209 none of the black powder substitutes are smokeless powder. Pyrodex does contain sulfur. Triple Seven, the defunct Black Mag, IMR White Hots, and the powders made by APP (Black MZ, JSG, Pinnacle, etc.) do not contain sulfur. With the exception of BH 209 all the black powder substitutes contain potassium perchlorate.

The residue left after the firing of Pyrodex is perhaps more corrosive than that of black powder. The residue of Triple Seven is much less corrosive than either black powder or Pyrodex. Residue of the APP powders is not very corrosive at all.

Cleaning a black powder gun is really easy. I swab the bore with a patch wet with water followed by three or four dry patches then repeat same. Lastly an oiled patch is run through the bore. Never had a black powder gun rust.

My revolvers have the grips removed and are sprayed with Windex Multi Surface Cleaner. Then they go through the dish washer.

Probably going to peve a few off but BP is not corrosive at all. It is hydroscopic and can draw moisture out of the air. Back in the day it was the priming salts in the BP sludge that was the issue. If you have one rust its due to cleaning it not very well.

MEHavey said:

True BP is about the easiest of all fouling to clean up/out -- taking no more than 15-20 minutes of barely-soapy water.
Run any reputable CLP down the bore/over the surfaces as you would any other gun & you'll never have a spot of corrosion.

Small price to pay given how miserable all substitutes are by comparison.

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No it isn't. Not only does 777 produce less fouling but it is also easier to clean afterwards.

I agree. T7 leaves much less fouling than the Olde Eynsford I use, which produces less fouling than most other black powders. I couldn't tell you if one was harder to clean or not as I don't find them all that hard.

I absolutely hate the fouling Pyrodex leaves. It's almost sticky.

A fellow did a corrosion test comparing BP to T7 and Pyrodex lighting each on a steel plate that was left in the garage for 4 days. T7 was nearly pristine. BP was mildly pitted, but Pyrodex was horrific.

If I likely won't have time to give a proper cleaning I swab the bore and chambers with Ballistol and give it an external wipe down with it too, and tried leaving my pistols in my Texas garage for two days one summer. Well protected. Any oil ought to do this as the fouling absorbs it leaving no way for moisture to get in.