Winchester 680
- Thread starter jonb32248
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ArchAngelCD
Member.
I'm fairly sure when Winchester stopped selling WW680 it was picked up by Western Powders and marketed as AA1680. You can use AA1680 data as a guide.
steveno
Member
WW-680 varied quite a bit from lot to lot. I used it in heavy bullet loads in the 357 max , 41 mag and 44 mag. like other WW powders (630 for one) of the same time frame it was temperature sensitive and one of the reasons Winchester stopped making it. I don't know if I would use the AA-1680 data for it but that is up to you. I would just throw it away and not worry about it. what are you going to do after you find one load that shoots good and there isn't any more of the powder around? if you find another can of it the lot number is probably going to be different.
if you want load data for WW-680 you will probably need to find a manual that is 25 years or more old
if you want load data for WW-680 you will probably need to find a manual that is 25 years or more old
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LOLBELL
Member
Why would you throw away perfectly good powder? He knows what it is and there's data for it. If you find one good load, shoot that load until it's all gone then find something else.
steveno
Member
I see no reason to work up and find a good load with a powder that is no longer made. if you managed to find another can of the powder it probably isn't going to have the same lot number and you would have to start over. if it happened to have the same lot number I would go buy a lottery ticket. you can send an e-mail to Accurate Arms to see if they would tell you what the differences are between 680 and 1680.
LOLBELL
Member
I can see your point if he has only a couple of OZs of said powder, why bother. If he has a pound or more, that's a whole lot of fun at the range to just throw away. To me, and I know not every one does thing as I do, but, to me more than 1/2 the fun is working up a load.
Swampman
Old Fart
IIRC Winchester developed 680 specifically for loading 7.62x39 in the late 60's/early 70's. It's probably best suited for lower capacity rifle cases like .22 Hornet, 7.62x39 and 300 Blackout or super magnum pistol loads like .454 Casull and .460 S&W.
Secondary uses would be reduced loads in larger rifle cases like .308, 30-06 or 8mm Mauser.
As long as it looks and smells right, I'd probably use it. Working up practice loads for the average AK or SKS isn't a super involved process for me. Just select a bullet and a desired velocity, work up to it, then load a bunch up.
We're not talking about gilt edge 600+ yard sniper ammo here.
How much of the powder did you get?
What calibers would you be interested in loading?
Secondary uses would be reduced loads in larger rifle cases like .308, 30-06 or 8mm Mauser.
As long as it looks and smells right, I'd probably use it. Working up practice loads for the average AK or SKS isn't a super involved process for me. Just select a bullet and a desired velocity, work up to it, then load a bunch up.
We're not talking about gilt edge 600+ yard sniper ammo here.
How much of the powder did you get?
What calibers would you be interested in loading?
brasscollector
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According to my 3rd edition of 'Cartridges of the World' W-W 680 was a double-base powder for very small centerfire cartridges such as the 22 hornet
ArchAngelCD
Member.
You know! The OP came here asking about old data and is told he is wasting his time, throw away the powder and everything but load data. Indolent matter if you think the powder is worth your time, the OP wants to use it, not you.
Like I said above, I'm not sure but I think AA1680 is the same powder but if course you have to verify that before using it. I'm not home this week so I don't have access to my manuals but when i do get home I will try to find specific data for WW680.
Like I said above, I'm not sure but I think AA1680 is the same powder but if course you have to verify that before using it. I'm not home this week so I don't have access to my manuals but when i do get home I will try to find specific data for WW680.
Grumulkin
Member
I'm in the camp that would use a powder from back in the olden days.
I have a reloading manual that lists Winchester 680 for at least the 22 Hornet. If you PM me your e-mail address and the specific cartridge(s) you're interested in loading, I'd be happy to scan and e-mail the information to you.
I really don't know whether or not Win. 680 was replaced by 1680. If it's 1680 it should be good for the 460 S&W Magnum among other cartridges.
I have a reloading manual that lists Winchester 680 for at least the 22 Hornet. If you PM me your e-mail address and the specific cartridge(s) you're interested in loading, I'd be happy to scan and e-mail the information to you.
I really don't know whether or not Win. 680 was replaced by 1680. If it's 1680 it should be good for the 460 S&W Magnum among other cartridges.
Swampman
Old Fart
W680 powder should be usable in cartridges ranging from .22 Hornet to .458 Winchester Magnum.
What specific data do you intend to provide?
As of this time OP hasn't specified a caliber/chambering.
In any case you answered the question in the second post of the thread when you said: "You can use AA1680 data as a guide."
W680/A1680 has been made in at least three countries that I know of (USA, Israel and Czech Republic). Any W680 possessed by the OP is old enough that specific period data isn't really applicable.
Even assuming that you can find original W680 data, it would be unwise to rely on it for 30+ year old powder.
Grumulkin
Member
I think it would be wise to rely on original Win. 680 data. If you're using it in a gun with one of the weaker actions, don't load to maximum and if you're using a gun with a strong action, just start low and work up in the usual way. In a gun with a strong action and assuming you know how to evaluate pressure signs, ALL you need is a starting load.
kerreckt
Member
It is great in 218Bee. 12.0-13.0 gr and 40gr/45gr bullets. I guess, I am unwise to use this 30+ powder for its unmatch accuracy in my 218Bee rifle.
ArchAngelCD
Member.
I know there are those online who love to argue. You may or may not be one if those. When I Saud he could use AA1680 as a guide, I meant just that, a guide. I didn't tell anyone to use the data directly. As for the powder being made in 3 different countries, so what. That's the thing about commercial powder, they make it the same within reason for safety. If it changes considerably they change the name.
I never used anyone's name so if I struck a nerve that's on you, not me.
Swampman
Old Fart
All I did was point out that you had provided the correct answer in post #2, use A1680 data as a GUIDE for developing loads with the W680.
Until he tells us what chambering(s) he might wish to reload for, it's pointless to try and provide any specific data.
My apologies if I offended you, but all I did was point out that you had provided about as good an answer as possible in post #2 of the thread.
Unless the OP provides us with more info, that's about as much as can be done.
My question about what specific data you intended to provide was aimed more at the OP. He asked for data in his first (and so far only) post of the thread.
Until he tells us what chambering(s) he might wish to reload for, it's pointless to try and provide any specific data.
My apologies if I offended you, but all I did was point out that you had provided about as good an answer as possible in post #2 of the thread.
Unless the OP provides us with more info, that's about as much as can be done.
Not sure how to PM but my email is [email protected]
Ok so I see all these great comments and advise. I thank you for it now the bottom line is does any body know if this is rifle powder or pistol powder. I am loading two calibers, 9mm. and 22-250. I saw somebody said .22 hornet, or 218 bee where would 22-250 fall. I hate throwing good stuff away.
Winchester 680 and Western 1680 are not the same powder although they are very close and work for the same cartridges. 680 is approx. 3-5% faster than 1680. I used to use it in the .357 Maximum but found IMR4227 and 1680 to be much less temperature sensitive. Then IMR4227 was discontinued. Current IMR 4227 is actually H4227.
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Grumulkin
Member
I looked at my two manuals from "the olden days" and found no Win. 680 loads for either the 22-250 Remington or the 9mm Luger.
GooseGestapo
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I started loading for the .22 Hornet in 1977. By then Win 680 had already been discontinued. Not because of heat sensitivity but low demand, limited applications. Demand for .22Hornet and .218Bee factory ammo, as well as .32/20, .25/20, ect were low.
IMO AA1680 is too slow for the .22Hornet, and Hod. Lil'Gun so far superior.
My .218Bee insists on IMR4198 for 45-46gr Bullets for accuracy but Hod Lil'Gun puts it another class velocity wise.
Back to original topic, you'll have to go back to late '60's-early '70's manuals for #680 data. If it were my powder I'd cheerfully load it and shoot it. I have ancient (circa 1960's) manuals with data. Finding them would be the issue.
IMO AA1680 is too slow for the .22Hornet, and Hod. Lil'Gun so far superior.
My .218Bee insists on IMR4198 for 45-46gr Bullets for accuracy but Hod Lil'Gun puts it another class velocity wise.
Back to original topic, you'll have to go back to late '60's-early '70's manuals for #680 data. If it were my powder I'd cheerfully load it and shoot it. I have ancient (circa 1960's) manuals with data. Finding them would be the issue.
Swampman
Old Fart
You could work up reduced loads for your .22-250 using W680 without too much trouble.
They wouldn't be good for 400 yard varmint hunting, but they'd likely be fine for target practice out to @ 200 yards.
If barrel life is important to you, reduced power loads won't give you near as much throat erosion as full power ammunition.
Wow very cool, BUT what would you start at. 4064 is what I use and I'm loading at 33.1 gr. How much less or just try some thing? I've never experimented but it's worth trying.
Grumulkin
Member
If I had a can of Win. 680 I probably would find a way to use it in something. I've used extrapolation in the past to work up loads with powders for which data wasn't available in a particular cartridge but then I've reloaded for a long time for a BUNCH of different cartridges and guns. I've never had a squib or damaged a gun but those are risks of going where no one has gone before and probably that journey should be reserved for the very experienced reloader.
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