Who Is Teaching These People That This Behavior Is Acceptable?

Yeah, it's way too common. Yes, and, no one.

And it explains why I have distanced myself from the internet gun forums the past couple years; just getting tired of hearing about how the average gun-forum member is a much better marksman and much more of a "gun person" than the average cop. At least those in law enforcement are forced to go through training two or three or four times a year and become re-acquainted with the Four Rules (among other things) as well as actually having to demonstrate that they can still manage a qualifying score on a handgun course (no matter how pathetically easy the course seems to all the internet commandos).

Concealed means concealed. I don't talk openly at work about what i carry or when, but plenty of folks do get rather loud proclaiming all kinds of things. I don't post anything firearms related on social media for the same reason. I even hesitated a bit to 'like' the pages of some gun clubs I frequent because other people can see that stuff.

In my humble opinion, one is much better off taking pride in the fact that no one has the slightest idea one is armed and ready.

This is why we can't have nice things.

herkyguy said:

In my humble opinion, one is much better off taking pride in the fact that no one has the slightest idea one is armed and ready.

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^^^This^^^
As to the OP's question: no one is teaching these folks to expose their EDC, brandish, violate the 4 rules, etc...
It shows a lack of maturity, or even worse, a lack of concern for the responsibility of carrying a deadly weapon. Many reasons, some societal, some stem from computer gaming, some from a need to impress or bully.
It is a severe problem.

The world is full of pinheads and some carry guns.

huntsman said:

The world is full of pinheads and some carry guns.

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I should have said it that way!

herkyguy said:

Concealed means concealed. I don't talk openly at work about what i carry or when, but plenty of folks do get rather loud proclaiming all kinds of things. I don't post anything firearms related on social media for the same reason. I even hesitated a bit to 'like' the pages of some gun clubs I frequent because other people can see that stuff.

In my humble opinion, one is much better off taking pride in the fact that no one has the slightest idea one is armed and ready.

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I don't even volunteer that I *own* a gun unless the other person first says they do.

I see your location is 'Occupied Territory', could it be that in areas with restricted firearm access, the people who jump through the hoops and start carrying just don't have that lifelong experience around firearms that they do stupid things? I hear stories on here all the time about stuff like that, but being around guns and armed people every day I've never seen anything like this in Maine. Maybe its because we grow up around firearms coupled with the fact that New Englanders are pretty uptight lol, I don't know. (Edit: Don't get me wrong, stupid people are everywhere, I just never see it to this degree first hand.)

Myself and other Church members carry every Sunday and none of us would think of exposing in Church. However guns are pretty common here so we've definitely done some parking lot deals after service.

Politely reminding anyone that puts their hand on the grip of their gun without cause when interacting with others that it's a good way to get shot might make them consider the consequences of screwing around.

Those people who act like that are accidents waiting to happen.

Did you ever see the movie Grosse Point Blank? Great, darkly funny, film about the difficulties of maintaining positive interpersonal relationships when you're a hit man. But I bring it up because the writers actually incorporated "that guy" into the script as a minor character.

He's a rather goofy acquaintance of the main character (Martin, played by John Cusak) who's managed to land a job as a roving security guard for a gated community, and one of his treasured job perks is that he gets to carry a gun -- which he excitedly draws (awkwardly, like it's a dead fish he's got in his pocket) to impress Martin, and awe him with his status and authority.

Martin, who actually does carry a gun at all times for serious professional reasons, is shown as vaguely shocked, alarmed, and a little bemused, by his old friend's newby-ish, over-excited antics, without ever letting on that he knows which end of that gun the bullets come out of.

I remember being amazed at how RIGHT the director and actors got the whole scene. The look on Martin's face, and the kind of helpless half-cringe, half laugh he gives as his pal acts like a spastic goober barely in control of a deadly weapon is just so painfully familiar.

They used to have a psychological exam for police officers to weed out such types......sadly, as you already know, Trunk Monkey, those that failed tended to go into security jobs. They must have altered or eliminated the psych tests, probably because someone whined that they 'violated their civil rights"...

I'm really beginning to wonder is this common behavior in the gun owning community?

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No. Behaviors that fall into this general category are common enough in ALL of society, but no more so among gun owners. Call it masculine display, lower tier social hierarchy posturing, and acting without thinking.

Is this how people really act?

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Sure. Dudes shadow-box, throwing a few fake punches at their buddies, roughhouse, tease, engage in horseplay. It's juvenile, and often abandoned as men grow up into responsible adults, but holds on for a long time among some members of society. Especially those who really peaked during the part of life where such displays were more expected.

Who the Hell is teaching these people to carry a gun?

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Nobody, or "the system" if they were forced through a training regimen of some kind. They don't have the experience of grave mistakes nor the imagination to grasp the bigger picture of how close they are to dramatic failure, and what that could mean. In other words, they're just idiots.

This morning I was working at the information desk at church. I'm doing my job and I hear two guys right in front of the desk talking about who can draw the fastest. The one guy tells the other that he'd be behind the curve because he'd have to untuck his shirt before drawing. I looked at the guy's belt line and sure enough he was wearing a super tuck. Then the first guy sweeps back his jacket and fully exposes his weapon in the lobby of the church!?!?!?. Seriously? Who does that?

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Now, we may want to caution against over-sensitivity in the first case. Two guys who know each other and know the other's habits of carrying firearms, and who are probably even shooting buddies, don't commit a faus pas by discussing gear and tactics as small talk, or even one of them showing something to the other, as long as they aren't making other people uncomfortable or drawing unnecessary attention to themselves.

However, exposing a firearm, deliberately, in a social setting like a church isn't very professional and could cause parishioners and the staff grief -- all of which simply detracts from the church's purpose and mission. So, they should avoid being a stumbling block to others, and keep their gear stowed and covered if that's what the situation calls for. Some context is required, here though. If this took place in a deserted vestibule where nobody (or just you) was able to observe, maybe I don't see a fault committed. If there were families and members walking through and able to see these dudes clowning around, that's unacceptable behavior.


And, don't forget, YOU are a full fledged person, just like they are. YOU have the authority to speak to them. To greet them, introduce yourself, and then politely express that you feel their actions aren't appropriate for that location. They aren't going to shoot you for that. By their actions and their location, they clearly think that they're the "good guys" just as you are, and while they might chafe a little under peer scrutiny, they DO know better and could hardly present a serious protest.

For what its worth, the police are not above such comment as well. The cop in your first example is absolutely open to being politely confronted by you, the citizen. "Hi officer! Sorry to interrupt you, but watching you play with your gun like that here in public is making me uncomfortable. It's dangerous and unprofessional. Please don't do that." He probably wouldn't even have an answer, but again, he can't shoot you or arrest you for expressing yourself, and you certainly would make an impression. He might even straighten up and fly right...er, considering how embarrassing it is to be called out by a citizen for acting like an ass in a completely indefensible way.

And, of course, a note (or cellphone video if lawful) sent to his superior expressing your dismay at his unprofessional behavior might be just what's needed to get discipline kicked into gear. Chances are if he acts like that in front of you, other officers have noticed his idiocy as well.

Sunday morning after first service, before second (About as crowded as the lobby of the church gets.

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Pretty poor, then.

I reported it to the security detail. They sent 3 guys to check it out, they observed the two for a couple of minutes and decided they weren't doing anything overtly threatening.

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And I'm sure they weren't by that time.

The head of the security team knows the guy that was flashing his weapon and is going to speak to him about it.

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Good. That might do some actual good.

I did say something to the cop and he made it quite clear that he wasn't going to be corrected by a mere security guard

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Ahh, yes, your position as a security guard does bring into play some social status posturing that is probably unavoidable, especially with the sort of guy who'd be doing that to begin with.

For what it's worth, you very well may have STILL made an impact. Even if he played the monkey-with-a-bigger-badge dominance card to your face, he was still embarrassed to be caught doing something asinine.

At the next instance, an official complaint to his supervisor would be required.

I was reading on another forum about allowing semi-auto rilfes in PA. One of the commenters had been in the Army and knew all about guns and didn't see the need for commoners to be able to use these guns for hunting. I have the greatest respect for that Vet's service, but her opinion showed she was very elitist. Sadly we have those types in our fine community as well.

I was reading on another forum about allowing semi-auto rilfes in PA. One of the commenters had been in the Army and knew all about guns and didn't see the need for commoners to be able to use these guns for hunting. I have the greatest respect for that Vet's service, but her opinion showed she was very elitist. Sadly we have those types in our fine community as well.

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I think you may have cross-posted this in the wrong thread?

What did you mean this in reply to?

Cops are good people for the most part. However, these days, they're hired more for their degree, not their other skills. And they are the absolute worst firearms users. They get away with doing stuff that'd get anybody else thrown in jail. Few years back a local cop was running through a residential neighbourhood, gun in hand, discharging the thing in every direction. He said he was chasing somebody. That being no reason to have his pistol even out of the holster. Anyway, one shot went through a window or an external house wall and hit the inner wall over a crib. Fortunately it was empty at the time. Other shots hit garages, went through windows and otherwise caused property damage. Multiple criminal offences(indictable offence, Stateside.). Never did hear what happened to the guy. Screamed locker/briefing room bet to me.
Even the SWAT types have been known to play 'Quick draw' in the locker/briefing rooms or during lulls in training. Other cops have been shot by their peers doing that, up here. Forget how badly hurt the guy was.

Sam said it pretty well in post 14. There are stupid people everywhere and gun owners are not exempt.
There are no more among us than non-gun owners. There may even be a bit less, but they are no doubt among us.

It's immature behavior that most of us grow out of by the time we're out of our teens.

drband said:

^^^This^^^
As to the OP's question: no one is teaching these folks to expose their EDC, brandish, violate the 4 rules, etc...
It shows a lack of maturity, or even worse, a lack of concern for the responsibility of carrying a deadly weapon. Many reasons, some societal, some stem from computer gaming, some from a need to impress or bully.
It is a severe problem.

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This hits it head on.

Those are all idiots. I can't disagree (with criticism of) with any example you posted. I'm not "black and white" though with a no touching the gun ever while carrying personal policy.

The most important part of the draw stroke is acquiring the firing grip. When home (or in any non-public environment), sometimes I'll practice just getting a grip on the gun for extra reps. I don't move it at all so it stays 100% in the holster at all times. I would never do that in public or around anyone other than a fellow military co-worker (or LE, if I was LE, but I'm not). I wouldn't be joking with anyone and I wouldn't be doing it in a manner where anyone would think I was actually drawing my gun.

Ryanxia said:

I see your location is 'Occupied Territory', could it be that in areas with restricted firearm access, the people who jump through the hoops and start carrying just don't have that lifelong experience around firearms that they do stupid things? I hear stories on here all the time about stuff like that, but being around guns and armed people every day I've never seen anything like this in Maine. Maybe its because we grow up around firearms coupled with the fact that New Englanders are pretty uptight lol, I don't know. (Edit: Don't get me wrong, stupid people are everywhere, I just never see it to this degree first hand.)

Myself and other Church members carry every Sunday and none of us would think of exposing in Church. However guns are pretty common here so we've definitely done some parking lot deals after service.

Politely reminding anyone that puts their hand on the grip of their gun without cause when interacting with others that it's a good way to get shot might make them consider the consequences of screwing around.

Click to expand...

From past posts we see that "Occupied Territory" is Colorado Springs, Colorado, certainly not unfriendly to our gun rights.

The OP makes many salient points on the POV of the beholder. Good thread starter.