Optimal mods for a "bugout bag" Ruger Bearcat?

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MatthewVanitas

MatthewVanitas

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As y'all may have seen in my other thread, I'm about to make the leap and customize some Rugers! My 10mm "M1877" idea was at the top of the list, but just this week on GunBroker I got a Buckeye Blackhawk in 32-20, and already it has a date with Hamilton Bowen for Bisley-ification, so we're on a roll and I'll see it back to me sometime next year.

At the same time I was asking Clements about Bearcat mods, and got on his waitlist for a .327 Federal Bearcat. However, since I now have an awesome .32 coming in (eventually), I'm less-inclined to spend the big bucks for a tinier equivalent, but I love my stainless Bearcat so just might make more reasonable mods to it. I've always thought of my Bearcat as an ultimate "bug out" gun (though I emphasize I'm not a 'survivalist' kind of guy) since it's tiny, ammo takes up little space and is bone-common, gat itself is nearly indestructible, etc.

Here are my thoughts:

  • have Clements do the whole tune-up on the action, leave the sights fixed but maybe add some paint or tritium for visibility.
  • Replace the steel grip frame with one of the old aluminum ones for weight? Maybe anodize it a neat color?
  • Either take the current steel cylinder and lighten it as much as possible with heavy fluting and a BP chamfer, or else have a new cylinder made and see if it can hold more than 6 rounds, and also how light it can be made. If we get really crazy, are there people I can send the original cylinder too and then can make me an unchambered one in aluminum, scandium, titanium, or some other such lightweight exotic metal?
  • In whatever case, have the cylinder chambered for .22 WMR, so that allows me to carry a much more powerful cartridge in barely more space than a .22LR.
  • Here's the clever brainstorm that hit me: if I rechamber to WMR I can't (safely) shoot LR anymore, unless I carry around a whole spare cylinder which kinda defeats part of the "ultra-compact" purpose. But what if I got a cartridge adapter for WMR to LR, and then used Blue (non-permanent) Loctite to firmly affix it to one chamber? That way I could carry 5 shots of WMR ready for defensive use, but one chamber of LR so if I saw a groundhog or a quail I could free-wheel the cylinder to the marked chamber and pot-shoot it? And in my go-bag I could pack even more ammo since I could store .22 Short and CB for the smallest game.
I know it seems like a lot, but on the simplest level, based on Clements' prices (and I already own the Bearcat): http://www.clementscustomguns.com/bearcat.html

Action job- $185
.22 magnum conversion- .22LR cyl rechambered to .22 Magnum, cal. designation removed from cyl. and remarked 22M on face of cyl. Firing pin protrusion maximized, gun is testfired for function with 3 different brands of ammo, forcing cone and crown checked and recut if needed at owners discretion with extra charge added for this service- $195 Not available for OM Bearcat

If I want to get fancier lightening it up and making it look cool:

Remove rollmarkings from cyl.- $50
Flute above cyl.- $100
Add blackpowder chamfer to fluted cyl.- $70
Scollop recoil shield- $125

So just the .22 WMR conversion would run me $195 and then $28 for a chamber adapter, so no reason not to do that. Going deluxe (except for the crazy idea of having an exotic-metal cylinder made and sourcing an old grip), it would run me $725 in Clements-work (plus shipping and FFL fees).

That said, if I get an exotic cylinder made, especially if the cylinder-maker can flute and chamfer it as part of the design, I can deduct $220 from the Clements cost, and deduct maybe another $100 since I can sell the really clean original cylinder, so anything the new cylinder costs up to $320 is a freebie. Any idea who might make such a thing? It doesn't have to be a gunsmith, just anyone who does metal-milling (CNC?) who can scan/mic the original cylinder and copy it onto a different material, provided Clements thinks the new material can handle the pressure. And *big* if, but if the cylinder-reproducer can just scan and copy an (unchambered) cylinder, can I also send along the steel grip and have it copied in exotic metal? I realize a one-off might be pricey, so a group-buy may be in order, but the idea has potential.

How crazy and/or clever is this idea? Even if I just go with the standard Clements package and don't source any exotic parts, $725 is totally doable for my "dream Bearcat" since the donor gun is already money (happily) spent years ago.
 
I love the idea of a Bearcat chambered to .22 WMR. If I had deeper pockets, I'd already have a customized one myself.

There is some talk about subsonic .22WMR that is currently sold in Australia by Winchester that may make it to the USA for suppressed rifles. Basically an even slower .22 WRF, but made at full WMR length to fit rifle chambers more precisely. With the uptick in high quality .22 WMR being sold in the last decade, and more suppressor buyers, I think it is looking probable to be sold here.

Which means, you may get to use that subsonic in your .22 WMR Bearcat without resorting to a glued in chamber adapter.
 
By the way, I'm in for keeping the stainless grip frame over the alloy grip frame. I just don't like the long term finish wear of anodized or painted aluminum compared to stainless. Just my opinion, of course. :)
 
Great lead on the Subsonic .22WMR! Do you have a link to the Aussies that carry it, so I can look for the same product here in Quebec?

Re the chambers, I think we have a crossed wire: WRF fits into WMR just fine, it's LR/L/S/CB that doesn't, so I want to have at least one chamber suitable for LR and down. The idea again being in this .000001% scenario of an emergency, I have a full load of defensive WMR ammo, but if I'm out stalking the woods I can rotate to the LR or Short if I want to pop a squirrel for lunch. If I'm going deluxe and goofy with this, I might could just have one of the chambers cut for LR instead of WMR (I don't plan on ever reselling this), and mark the cylinder so that by feel in the dark I can find that chamber and freewheel it to the next position for cocking.

Speaking of chambers, any chance the Bearcat could be cut for, say, 7 rounds, or better to just stick to 6?

And I'll ask around some tech forums to see if anyone thinks they know a guy who can make a copy of a Ruger cylinder in exotic material, just a basic unchambered cylinder (would have to make sure it's a material that Clements feels comfortable chambering) with the "flower" bit that the pawl grabs (what's the technical term?) and maybe rough-cutting the ratchet surfaces so Clements can clean them up to his taste. If I'm going with an exotic lightweight material, and not going for trad looks, there's no point to fluting, right? Maybe I can have the cylinder maker laser-engrave it with some cool image around the cylinder? And then some little patch in the right spot so I can index the LR chamber by feel in the dark.

For grips, thinking Micarta or G10 with some light functional checkering for grip when wet, and a lanyard ring, and then a Kydex holster in the Yaqui Slide style so it's less-noticeable on the belt. Maybe coat it matte black or dark grey or something?

Another brainstorm: what if I had the front sight set back slightly, and threaded the end for a suppressor? Yes, I know that revolvers don't suppress well, but if it makes even a slight difference, and I have a small .22 can anyway, might as well, no? I can't think of anywhere in the US or Canada where a threaded barrel makes a SA revolver verboten, and I can have a cool muzzle-cap on it when not using a can.

I think just one last brainstorm: is there any good maker of (synethic material) ammo wallets? Like a really slim little case the size of a business card case or at largest a small flat wallet, that can hold a load or two of quality WMR defensive ammo, then other spaces for some LR, some subsonics, some tiny CBs, etc.


I know some of this is a little silly, but it would all be good-quality stuff and assembled by a good smith. And again I'm not a survivalist, I just think it's a fun "what if?" theme to give me an excuse for the mods, and again this would be an heirloom (like my father's unmolested Single Six he got from his father-in-law when he was courting). Not to brag, but I sold a house and a motorcycle this year, so I have some mad-money handy, and since I might get married in the near future, now is certainly the time for big gun purchases so I won't ever have to argue about them. I'm set on putting at least a grand into this, similar to 10 years ago when I got some windfall money and tricked out my Ruger MkII with an integrally-suppressed barrel and stag grips. Fun stuff!
 
I think I like the idea of leaving one chamber in the Bearcat at .22LR rather than using a chamber adapter. Although, I admit I personally like the idea of a two cylinder convertible much better.

I really like the idea of a custom cylinder being cut for 7 chambers and having the gun timed for it. It may reduce the cylinder fluting you seek. I haven't measured it out to see if it is possible, though.
 
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The Bearcat doesn't have a separate grip frame, it's all unitized like the old Remingtons. You can change the triggerguard but that's it.

There have been folks who have had only one chamber reamed for .22Mag and left the rest .22LR. No reason why you couldn't do the opposite.

I don't know of anyone doing cylinders in titanium or aluminum. If possible it's going to be very expensive. I think the cost is going to far outweigh the weight savings. Removing the rollmark and fluting will probably be your most bang for the buck.

All I did to mine was to change the African rosewood grips for a waterproof pearlite.

IMG_3071b.jpg
 
Well, solve one problem. Clements says "no way" to alloy gripframe or cylinder, but assures me he has some Big Ideas to add to his Bearcat list that will be announced soon, so I must cool my jets, know that I'm locked-on for the waitlist, and be patient...

Understood! It is your gun and I shouldn't put my ideas over yours. :)
Click to expand...

Oh, no worries at all, be real! If you have ideas spit them out, we just won't agree on all of them.

All I did to mine was to change the African rosewood grips for a waterproof pearlite.
Click to expand...

Great call, I'm thinking Micarta or G10 for mine,with moderate checkering for grip. And I'll see what ideas Clements has for grip re-shaping to smooth out the corners and make it a tad more compact.
 
>I think just one last brainstorm: is there any good maker of (synethic material) ammo wallets? Like a really slim little case the size of a business card case or at largest a small flat wallet, that can hold a load or two of quality WMR defensive ammo, then other spaces for some LR, some subsonics, some tiny CBs, etc.<

MTM ammo wallet. Holds 30 rounds

https://www.amazon.com/MTM-Round-Caliber-Wallet-Clear/dp/B0013R6JJ0
 
MatthewVanitas said:
As y'all may have seen in my other thread, I'm about to make the leap and customize some Rugers! My 10mm "M1877" idea was at the top of the list, but just this week on GunBroker I got a Buckeye Blackhawk in 32-20, and already it has a date with Hamilton Bowen for Bisley-ification, so we're on a roll and I'll see it back to me sometime next year.

At the same time I was asking Clements about Bearcat mods, and got on his waitlist for a .327 Federal Bearcat. However, since I now have an awesome .32 coming in (eventually), I'm less-inclined to spend the big bucks for a tinier equivalent, but I love my stainless Bearcat so just might make more reasonable mods to it. I've always thought of my Bearcat as an ultimate "bug out" gun (though I emphasize I'm not a 'survivalist' kind of guy) since it's tiny, ammo takes up little space and is bone-common, gat itself is nearly indestructible, etc.

Here are my thoughts:

  • have Clements do the whole tune-up on the action, leave the sights fixed but maybe add some paint or tritium for visibility.
  • Replace the steel grip frame with one of the old aluminum ones for weight? Maybe anodize it a neat color?
  • Either take the current steel cylinder and lighten it as much as possible with heavy fluting and a BP chamfer, or else have a new cylinder made and see if it can hold more than 6 rounds, and also how light it can be made. If we get really crazy, are there people I can send the original cylinder too and then can make me an unchambered one in aluminum, scandium, titanium, or some other such lightweight exotic metal?
  • In whatever case, have the cylinder chambered for .22 WMR, so that allows me to carry a much more powerful cartridge in barely more space than a .22LR.
  • Here's the clever brainstorm that hit me: if I rechamber to WMR I can't (safely) shoot LR anymore, unless I carry around a whole spare cylinder which kinda defeats part of the "ultra-compact" purpose. But what if I got a cartridge adapter for WMR to LR, and then used Blue (non-permanent) Loctite to firmly affix it to one chamber? That way I could carry 5 shots of WMR ready for defensive use, but one chamber of LR so if I saw a groundhog or a quail I could free-wheel the cylinder to the marked chamber and pot-shoot it? And in my go-bag I could pack even more ammo since I could store .22 Short and CB for the smallest game.
I know it seems like a lot, but on the simplest level, based on Clements' prices (and I already own the Bearcat): http://www.clementscustomguns.com/bearcat.html

Action job- $185
.22 magnum conversion- .22LR cyl rechambered to .22 Magnum, cal. designation removed from cyl. and remarked 22M on face of cyl. Firing pin protrusion maximized, gun is testfired for function with 3 different brands of ammo, forcing cone and crown checked and recut if needed at owners discretion with extra charge added for this service- $195 Not available for OM Bearcat

If I want to get fancier lightening it up and making it look cool:

Remove rollmarkings from cyl.- $50
Flute above cyl.- $100
Add blackpowder chamfer to fluted cyl.- $70
Scollop recoil shield- $125

So just the .22 WMR conversion would run me $195 and then $28 for a chamber adapter, so no reason not to do that. Going deluxe (except for the crazy idea of having an exotic-metal cylinder made and sourcing an old grip), it would run me $725 in Clements-work (plus shipping and FFL fees).

That said, if I get an exotic cylinder made, especially if the cylinder-maker can flute and chamfer it as part of the design, I can deduct $220 from the Clements cost, and deduct maybe another $100 since I can sell the really clean original cylinder, so anything the new cylinder costs up to $320 is a freebie. Any idea who might make such a thing? It doesn't have to be a gunsmith, just anyone who does metal-milling (CNC?) who can scan/mic the original cylinder and copy it onto a different material, provided Clements thinks the new material can handle the pressure. And *big* if, but if the cylinder-reproducer can just scan and copy an (unchambered) cylinder, can I also send along the steel grip and have it copied in exotic metal? I realize a one-off might be pricey, so a group-buy may be in order, but the idea has potential.

How crazy and/or clever is this idea? Even if I just go with the standard Clements package and don't source any exotic parts, $725 is totally doable for my "dream Bearcat" since the donor gun is already money (happily) spent years ago.
Click to expand...
Why not ream 5 chambers only?
 
Thanks for the Shopkeeper heads-up (my cousin got one as a gift as her first gun and loves it), but I need a barrel at least 4.2" or I can't bring it into Canada. I'm a US citizen but living in Canada right now and might use this as my base camp, and start a small business, while traveling overseas for other contracts.
 
So how much more punch does a .22WMR have coming out of a 4" revolver than some of the heavier .22LR like the CCI Velocitor? I know in a rifle length barrel is makes a big difference, but coming out of a 4" barrel most the extra energy may just contribute a lot of flash and bang.

The .22WMR conversion may not be worth it - just put the money towards high end .22LR ammo. I've got a 3.5" barreled S&W Model 51 in 22 WMR and it is LOUD and has a big flash when shooting.
 
Even in short barrels, 22 WMR does in fact trump 22LR. Neither are extreme power houses, but there IS a marked difference between the two. Just as there is for 38spcl & 357mag, 45colt and 454C... It DOES contribute to more flash and more bang, but it does contribute to more energy on the bullet too.

For the OP - have you held the cylinder of a Bearcat? They're quite small, and quite light. I'm on a work trip out of town this week, but the cylinders are 1.4" long and 1.22" in diameter, so minus 6 22WMR chambers cut straight a 0.242" dia, that puts the stainless cylinder (non-fluted) at ~5.7oz. Made from titanium, the same volume would weigh ~3.5oz. Saving a whopping 2.2 oz doesn't really make a significant difference. Made from Aluminum, it'd only be ~1.9oz, which seems like a lot, just under a quarter pound, but in the grand scheme of things, you're only talking about 20oz instead of 24oz... Not really significant, for all of the cost you'd incur getting it done, and frankly, I wouldn't spend money on converting to an aluminum cylinder - and certainly wouldn't waste the money converting to titanium just for 2oz saved.

Carrying an extra cylinder, equally, is almost insignificant in size and weight as well, and would avoid potential issues of having one chamber of different dimension (in the event some future owner thinks it to be a 22LR, then ruptures a bunch of cases by dropping them in the WMR chambers). I carry mine in a pill bottle in my pack.

As CraigC pointed out, and as Dave must have let you know, the grip frame on the Bearcat is integral to the frame - no option to swap material. Only way to make it lighter is to shed some of the meat.

Personally, the Al Harton 327FM Bearcat is what has caught my attention as a pack pistol. I'll expect to not shoot much 327 in it, as I've favored the 32 H&R for many years, but having the option for extra power is certainly alluring. My donor revolver started as a Shopkeeper, so it already had the factory round butt, although I might admit, having the extra purchase in my palm of the plow handle might have been nice.
 
clang said:
So how much more punch does a .22WMR have coming out of a 4" revolver than some of the heavier .22LR like the CCI Velocitor? I know in a rifle length barrel is makes a big difference, but coming out of a 4" barrel most the extra energy may just contribute a lot of flash and bang.

The .22WMR conversion may not be worth it - just put the money towards high end .22LR ammo. I've got a 3.5" barreled S&W Model 51 in 22 WMR and it is LOUD and has a big flash when shooting.
Click to expand...

Good question. The only directly comparable figures I know of for a 4" revolver barrel are for the NAA Mini Master at the NAA website.

https://northamericanarms.com/ballistics/ball-mml/

https://northamericanarms.com/ballistics/ball-mmm/
 
The .22Mag still beats the .22LR by a good margin out of pistol barrels. Usually a good 300-400fps, with a better bullet.
 
chicharrones said:
Good question. The only directly comparable figures I know of for a 4" revolver barrel are for the NAA Mini Master at the NAA website.

https://northamericanarms.com/ballistics/ball-mml/

https://northamericanarms.com/ballistics/ball-mmm/
Click to expand...

Great reference info. Thanks for sharing. The data is even for 4" revolvers. Too bad they didn't test the Velocitors, they are supposed to be a couple hundred feet per second faster than mini mags (out of a rifle). I don't know of any 40 grain 22lr that is faster.
 
Cheaper and easier to buy an older S&W M43, NOT the new 43C. An aluminum 22LR J frame with a 3 1/2" barrel with adjustable sights. About the same size as a Bearcat.
 
Whats wrong with leaving the BC just as it is? I almost talked myself into buying one but at 24oz it weighs the exact same as my S&W model 34-1 so I saw no advantage. Plus the S&W is faster to load and unload and has a double action trigger and can use speed loaders.

I like the suggestion of one of the NAA minis instead. This would be my choice. It weighs 9 ounces with a 4" barrel and two cylinders.

https://northamericanarms.com/shop/firearms/naa-1860-4c/
 
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A DA is only faster to load if you have speedloaders.

The NAA's offer very little utility compared to a Bearcat. One could easily keep the stewpot filled with a Bearcat but there's not much small game hunting one could do with a 9oz revolver.
 
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